Curse

Eria · Feb 03, 2008, 09:20 PM // 21:20

Hi, Im doing a lot more Monking now for my guild and I want to learn more. Ive been observing GvGs, and Im usually watching the Monks. I see many Monks using Staffs now and some other sets of weapons.
If anyone out there can give me some overview of the weapons those top guilds use, I would love to learn from this. Pls list out the weapons + mods and any general tips on when to use.
Thanks

Tab · Feb 03, 2008, 09:46 PM // 21:46

Protection staff with 40% HCT, 20% HSR and +20% enchantment length - for Aegis and other protection skills,
40/40 Heal set for WoH/Gift,
15/-5 spear and a shield with +30/+10 armor vs x damage type for when you're under attack,
and a +30/-2 energy prot/heal set for when you're low on energy.
Is the standard equipment for WoH/RC. If you aren't running any heal (SoD for example), drop 40/40 Heal for 40/40 Prot for use on SoD/Dismiss.

TheOneMephisto · Feb 03, 2008, 10:04 PM // 22:04

Ah, the ever-present monk equipment thread.

listen to ibreaktoilets, except that I personally don't think that you need to have -5 on your spear in your defense set. That's mostly personal preference though.

Ensign · Feb 03, 2008, 10:10 PM // 22:10

+5 energy is better on the spear, as it gives you more leeway to RoF, stance, and the like without leaving your shield when under attack. Put a -5 energy spear in the pack for unconditional edenial.

elektra_lucia · Feb 03, 2008, 10:20 PM // 22:20

Actually to begin with -5 is better than +5. Kind of a mind thing... If you're new to monking in GVG, you might burn too much energy but by having a smaller energy pool (at that time) it can kind of train you not to burn too much.

Also there's the fact that you might die more often as a new to GVG monk and the -5 will help for that.

dies like fish · Feb 03, 2008, 10:31 PM // 22:31

When you run out of energy, you switch to a set with more energy. +5 energy allows you to stay in your defensive set longer while blowing all your energy.

LifesRestorer · Feb 03, 2008, 10:49 PM // 22:49

how many times have we had this thread? anyone wanna take the time to count?

JR · Feb 03, 2008, 11:11 PM // 23:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by elektra_lucia

Actually to begin with -5 is better than +5. Kind of a mind thing... If you're new to monking in GVG, you might burn too much energy but by having a smaller energy pool (at that time) it can kind of train you not to burn too much.

Also there's the fact that you might die more often as a new to GVG monk and the -5 will help for that.

I don't quite understand why a tombs scrub is giving advice in a gvg thread. Bad advice at that.

lady0sheep · Feb 04, 2008, 01:31 AM // 01:31

I wouldn't say it's bad advice, I often start up ona low energy set, you can switch up when you need and when you start the match you don't know if you'll be facing a mesmer with e-burn e-drain. Why have a large energy pool floating about to get stolen?

elektra_lucia · Feb 04, 2008, 01:32 AM // 01:32

Quote:

When you run out of energy, you switch to a set with more energy. +5 energy allows you to stay in your defensive set longer while blowing all your energy.

Of course, I don't doubt that but the key word here is him being 'new' to gvg. I presume he's fairly new to PVP in general (as he is asking for weapon and equipment advice). Sure you will switch to your normal set BUT it just helps you not burn out all your energy to begin with... Also, a shame/pleak and so on, in a -5 is better. If you are talking about him switching up then you can reverse that thought... Cast, switch down again

.

Quote:

I don't quite understand why a tombs scrub is giving advice in a gvg thread. Bad advice at that.

Alrighty. So I'm a crappy tombs monk. Shouldn't have problem in defeating my argument without the need to flame then, should you? :3.

romO · Feb 04, 2008, 01:43 AM // 01:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by ibreaktoilets

Protection staff with 40% HCT, 20% HSR and +20% enchantment length - for Aegis and other protection skills,
40/40 Heal set for WoH/Gift,
15/-5 spear and a shield with +30/+10 armor vs x damage type for when you're under attack,
and a +30/-2 energy prot/heal set for when you're low on energy.

This.

Except +5 energy instead of -5. There is no energy denial in guild wars anymore, and as Ensign said, having more energy in a defensive set allows you to stay protected during casts more often. Eburn and Esurge in their current form are nukes. The edenial is just a cute side-effect. If a team is dedicating their mesmer elite and another skill to take 0-16 of your monk's energy every 20 seconds, then I'd be curious as to how they're attempting to kill you.

elektra_lucia · Feb 04, 2008, 01:58 AM // 01:58

Incorrect. The damage is the side effect. You take damage for each point of energy lost, so if you're on less energy you're going to be taking less damage. Around about the rank I assume he is playing there is also going to be e-denial. Then there is the aspect of dying and being able to res with more energy.

Phe Belladona · Feb 04, 2008, 01:59 AM // 01:59

yup toilet breaking person has good set, im in the -5 energy camp for defensive set because it'll basically negate the esurge damage on spike. if you're not fighting a dom mesmer fine +5 it.

Div · Feb 04, 2008, 02:16 AM // 02:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by elektra_lucia

Incorrect. The damage is the side effect. You take damage for each point of energy lost, so if you're on less energy you're going to be taking less damage. Around about the rank I assume he is playing there is also going to be e-denial. Then there is the aspect of dying and being able to res with more energy.

What tommy means by the side effect is that a mesmer mainly carries esurge/burn to deal damage, not to try and edeny you greatly. He doesn't mean it in the literal sense that you'll only take damage when you have energy.

That said, if anything, the +5 is better for new monks since they won't be very good at weapon swapping. Having -5 means you'll almost always have to switch up every cast, which is something new monks have trouble doing. Plus, even against dom mesmers, I really don't feel the effects of that esurge-8 hitting me even with that +5 set, so the benefits of having the +5 set to cast more outweigh the costs.

I mean, if a person wants to use a -5 energy set, by all means do so. If you feel that it'll benefit you for the additional protection vs dom mesmers, go ahead. Tommy and ensign were just stating their feelings about the edenial situation based on what they see as prevalent in the GvG meta.

elektra_lucia · Feb 04, 2008, 02:36 AM // 02:36

Quote:

What tommy means by the side effect is that a mesmer mainly carries esurge/burn to deal damage, not to try and edeny you greatly. He doesn't mean it in the literal sense that you'll only take damage when you have energy.

If you're all going to get another friend every time I prove your argument to be wrong then there isn't much point in debating further; however, I will try my best... A mesmer would not bring e-surge just for the damage and vice versa. The mainly becomes a moot point. The fact is, the skill has what it has. It is not a 'cute side effect'. When a mesmer brings that skill, they most certainly ARE bringing it for it's e-denial as well as damage. The mainly can't be defined. I was also not debating with what Tommy may of thought in his head or 'meant'. I am debating with what he says. Is this understood?

Quote:

That said, if anything, the +5 is better for new monks since they won't be very good at weapon swapping. Having -5 means you'll almost always have to switch up every cast, which is something new monks have trouble doing.

It really does not take long to learn. Also, I'd think he will be bringing glyph and not something like return (which I personally prefer). So, he can cast even when on 0 energy. You learn something quicker by doing it more. By being forced to switch more, he will learn quicker.

Quote:

Plus, even against dom mesmers, I really don't feel the effects of that esurge-8 hitting me even with that +5 set, so the benefits of having the +5 set to cast more outweigh the costs.

Well this depends on what enemies you face, how good your team is and so on, so obviously the 'what you feel' is irrelevant. Again, e-surge and e-burn isn't the only e-denial...

Quote:

I mean, if a person wants to use a -5 energy set, by all means do so. If you feel that it'll benefit you for the additional protection vs dom mesmers, go ahead.

I don't think the fact that you resurrect with %X of %X energy (depending on skill used) should be over looked.

6am3 Fana71c · Feb 04, 2008, 02:52 AM // 02:52

Damn you people! I wasted ages thinking my 40/40 prot set, +5/20% ench sword & 20/20 prot, high energy and defensive set were best choice...
Now I have to buy staff... ><
Tommy and Ibreaktoilets, you owe me 100K for good prot staff!
/fistshake

Div · Feb 04, 2008, 03:17 AM // 03:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by elektra_lucia

A mesmer would not bring e-surge just for the damage and vice versa. The mainly becomes a moot point. The fact is, the skill has what it has. It is not a 'cute side effect'.

Of course no one's going to take an elite skill for just 96 conditional damage every 20 seconds. But if you look at how mesmers use it, it's very often used in spikes as assist damage. Obviously the energy loss adds on to the pressure, but as it is, it's mainly just assist damage, and not edenial.

Maybe the mesmers you face use esurge/burn primarily as edenial, but from what I've seen, the true powers of those skills is to help spike out a target.

Phe Belladona · Feb 04, 2008, 03:40 AM // 03:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

Of course no one's going to take an elite skill for just 96 conditional damage every 20 seconds. But if you look at how mesmers use it, it's very often used in spikes as assist damage. Obviously the energy loss adds on to the pressure, but as it is, it's mainly just assist damage, and not edenial.

Maybe the mesmers you face use esurge/burn primarily as edenial, but from what I've seen, the true powers of those skills is to help spike out a target.

this would be one of the reasons imo to use the -5 weapon surely, as (after a bit of play) its likely to hide almost all your energy so the surge/burn hits for 0. which is better than having a set which gets burned to 0 energy and does damage on the way down. tho this is all assuming you switch BEFORE the spike hits, if you're switching to an armour set to deal with afterspike and the training you'll get then i suppose the +5 is ok cause you'll unlikely get burned again cause there are very few mesmers not carrying wards and therefore few mesmers carrying surge+burn.

Ruricu · Feb 04, 2008, 03:57 AM // 03:57

If the -8's from Surge/Burn were all there was to worry about in GvG, I'd vote for the +5, but it's the stray -19 Power Leak that normally scared me into wearing my -5 Energy sword.
It actually got the point where I wouldn't even switch to me 40/20/20 staff to cast aegis because it got P Leaked whenever I tried... losing 19 out of a 40 pool hurts like a red engine gored.
As for the main argument, it really lies in an issue of self-preference.

deya · Feb 04, 2008, 04:24 AM // 04:24

The way you see overview of the game pretty much equals your monking skills. Weapon sets does no good for u if you can't see who to preprot and with which skills at which point blabla, long story but everyone knows what I mean.

For now Pleak concerns me most so I'm just casting all my stuff with 40% fcr whether I am attacked or not.