Curse

Div · Mar 03, 2008, 04:33 AM // 04:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Real Roy Keane

People using bad skills in AB. What's new about that?

Yeah. It's not new that people are using shitty skills. Eles are using mind burn over SF for damage or mind blast for sustainability. Monks are using healing hands instead of WoH. It's AB, where bad players unite to think they're good because they can beat someone when they're heavily favored by the map to win.

Riotgear · Mar 03, 2008, 05:44 AM // 05:44

To be quite honest, it's in use for two reasons:

1.) PvE'ers who roll warriors because they want to tank. This is about 90% of it.

2.) Because people think they're awesome when it takes a lot of players to kill them.

And quite honestly, in AB, one of the most-effective things you can do is divert ridiculous amounts of enemy players. Hardly anyone there will ever let a kill go, which is why you see 8 players piling on one earth tank and facerolling until one of them scores a lucky KD interrupt on Stoneflesh. That's 8 fewer players doing anything even remotely helpful for their team.

bungusmaximus · Mar 03, 2008, 06:11 AM // 06:11

Riotgear is rite, my guildmate and I rolled 2 riposte/mending/dolyak wammo's and we kept 8 peope from doing important stuff while the rest of the kurzicks capped shrines :P. Buying time is priceless. Turning local chat on is even more priceless.

The sad part is that we actually scored quite a bit of kills in the process

.

Amadei · Mar 03, 2008, 08:57 AM // 08:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by ajc2123

Ps dont turn this into a lux vs kurz thread. Thats just my opinion, i could be wrong.

Yeah, let's not, because then I'd have to drag out my -- literally -- hundreds of screenshots from ABs with Luxons using the most awful skills you can possibly think of.

Topic? Uh, Defy Pain is bad. Don't bring it. </deaf ears>

C2K · Mar 03, 2008, 09:35 AM // 09:35

Defy Pain has been used in AB since AB was put in the game. It actually spilled over into RA/TA for some time before they changed RA/TA rules to have a time limit.

But yeah, AB is a silly place. You kill a warrior, they chase you the entire match and if you kite, they complain your a runner for not letting them hit you.

Elisabet Ramsey · Mar 03, 2008, 04:23 PM // 16:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Macks Mistress

The thing is alot of people who run bad bars tell you to 'stfu' when you suggest a change.

It's great that you want the community to be better players when you come across things like this, it's getting those guys to listen that's the real problem.

QFT

Best you can do is make everyone ping, kick the noobs, and keep the decent. Lol I don't even waste time telling them whats wrong either, because they think their too leet for you and will ramble on about 1vs1.

Riotgear · Mar 03, 2008, 04:27 PM // 16:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elisabet Ramsey

QFT

Best you can do is make everyone ping, kick the noobs, and keep the decent.

I'd love to do this, except being able to click Enter Battle eventually might be more important.

Elisabet Ramsey · Mar 03, 2008, 04:37 PM // 16:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riotgear

I'd love to do this, except being able to click Enter Battle eventually might be more important.

lol I somehow get by. Then again i lose my patience after kicking 6-10 people.
Can always bring guildies

Bobby2 · Mar 03, 2008, 05:39 PM // 17:39

I've turned completely around. When I see a good skill bar in my team, it is a Happy Day. Apart from that, I stopped caring, both sides suffer from bad players.

Mercury Angel · Mar 05, 2008, 05:05 AM // 05:05

Survival instinct.
New and inexperienced players seem to have a tendency towards defensive builds and an aversion to death, even when it means little to nothing at a given place. (No penalty in Competitive Missions, and you'll still see people that would rather run around like a headless chicken to regenerate from near-death than keep fighting, die, and rez at the nearby shrine quickly.)

One of the most taunted and well-known examples would be the Healing Hands W/Mo builds.

As time passes, I think the natural progression is to elites that are still somewhat defensive in nature, but also help kill. Gladiator's Defense and Life Transfer (zomg, so much regeneration!) are skills that embody this principle.

Eventually, the drive to "not lose" may be overridden by the desire to "win."

Another obsession tends to be "big numbers."
It's why Magic cards like http://magiccards.info/scans/en/cs/37.jpg exist.
Although the biggest appeal is when the "big numbers" happen to be offensive and deadly in nature (My combo deals over 2000 damage! [Takes over 12 seconds to execute though.], you'll find players aiming for the biggest heals and such as well.

Defy Pain combines survival with big numbers for WIN.

Give them time. Trying to reason with them at this point is as futile as trying to explain, say, limits to most younger students.
If they're not at the developmental stage to understand the overarching principles of why packing multiple defensive skills on an offensive character tends to be problematic, then I doubt you're going to have much success explaining why Defy Pain is bad. Even if you succeed at that, they're liable to switch to something just as bad.

[Warning: The author of this post may have spewed the above garbage with little to no actual forethought.
But seriously, I think some of these characteristics of players are fairly universal, even if the parallels aren't exact.]

You Look Grim · Mar 05, 2008, 05:13 AM // 05:13

i don't think defy pain would be good on any bar in AB. well, maybe not bad, but there are definitely better alternatives.
but it's always fun to mess around with builds in AB :P

bungusmaximus · Mar 05, 2008, 08:21 AM // 08:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mercury Angel

snip

He's right, GW players are too *&(*!!!! afraid to get wet. I didn't use a tank build myself when I started playing warrior in PvP, but I played way too defensively (Not frenzying enough and whatnot). Balls win games

.

Riotgear · Mar 05, 2008, 05:04 PM // 17:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mercury Angel

If they're not at the developmental stage to understand the overarching principles of why packing multiple defensive skills on an offensive character tends to be problematic, then I doubt you're going to have much success explaining why Defy Pain is bad. Even if you succeed at that, they're liable to switch to something just as bad.

I don't think that's really the problem so much as even understanding a Warrior is an offensive class. I'd imagine most Warriors rolled for PvE and carry over with the exact same mindset: "I win because no one can kill me!"

TheHaxor · Mar 05, 2008, 06:35 PM // 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riotgear

I don't think that's really the problem so much as even understanding a Warrior is an offensive class. I'd imagine most Warriors rolled for PvE and carry over with the exact same mindset: "I win because no one can kill me!"

im in ur AB, holdin da aggro =>

Riotgear · Mar 05, 2008, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheHaxor

im in ur AB, holdin da aggro =>

There's no such thing as "aggro" in PvP, because players can.... oh wait.

Bobby2 · Mar 05, 2008, 09:07 PM // 21:07

Having Triple Chop work out better in AB than PvE (yaay for AoE scatter) is worrying to say the least.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

Balls win games

.

Strange. That's exactly what I thought when I started out as an Assassin but somehow it didn't quite work out.

The Meth · Mar 06, 2008, 04:40 AM // 04:40

Anyone using their warrior elite on defence is downright retarded. Even if its your first time playing you should be able to figure out rather quickly that the warrior class is designed to kill things, not stand around taking hits. If you encounter someone who is intending to run such a build, politely tell them why its bad and request it changed, if they refuse kick 'em. Exceptions given if they are a decent player who will aggro the whole team onto them

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riotgear

There's no such thing as "aggro" in PvP, because players can.... oh wait.

So very sadly true...

Upon entering the match, immediately say something along the lines of "F--- all you (insert other side) noobs. I can pwn you all. Meet me in middle or you are cowards" at least half the other team will stupidly go there and try to kill you forever

Kenny Mack · Mar 06, 2008, 11:53 AM // 11:53

i agree with riotgear on the point of, well yea u get peopple using an elite like defy pain in ab, but u also get as many people on the opposing team willing to waste ages killing them.

i personally would not go into ab, or pve, with this as my elite but u gotta remembber that one day someone might actually manage to make this skill useful....you never know

Kenny

MasterSasori · Mar 15, 2008, 08:26 PM // 20:26

I always assumed that it was a noob warrior skill though I saw this one r6 warrior using it. Is there a logical explanation on WHY he would use it?

I really really can't see why anyone would use it...

RiKio · Mar 15, 2008, 08:48 PM // 20:48

Because is leet.