Curse

ariarena · Jan 23, 2008, 11:42 AM // 11:42

Hi

I’ve been playing gw almost two years now, almost only pve. I’ve beaten all 3 campaigns, have all professions, and play the core ones regularly. I consider myself a good pve player.

Now, I thought I could try pvp around two weeks ago. I had done ab sometimes, but I wanted something else. My guild is pve only, and they are good friends, so leaving them for a pvp guild is not an option right now.

So… I thought random arenas would be the solution. The best place to start and learn, as a new pvp player. I even got a pvp toon.

Now, I’ve played mainly mesmer, ranger and sometimes necro. I do think I’ve done decently. But… once I decided to play my pve monk (no sup runes, +600 hp, prot bar) and well… I’m a new player, I got spiked by two sins and my team lost. A guy there told me not to leave pve and never play ra again because I s*cked.

While I’m intelligent enough not to get offended for those words, that got me thinking… It was ra really the best place for a new pvp player like me? Or my only mistake was playing monk, and I should leave that class for when I get more experienced?

What do you guys think?

Note to mods: I’m not sure where is the best place to post this, so please move if necessary.

Thundro · Jan 23, 2008, 11:47 AM // 11:47

Personal thought: welcome to my world.

Seriously. I've been trying to set up a team for years, but as long as you havent got friends to join you at a given time it's pretty much a lost cause.

RA is not the best place to test skill, since you pretty much depending on the people you get in your team.

My suggestion is that you ask those people you play AB with if they feel like going to TA for a change. Who knows, they might enjoy it.

RhanoctJocosa · Jan 23, 2008, 11:49 AM // 11:49

You need to play something like a mesmer or a ranger because by playing them you learn every class. Keep playing builds like ESurge and Cripshot in RA and when you get better you can try TA. I'd keep clear of HA because it doesn't really improve you as a player as much as the other arenas do. Try reading all the articles here and on www.teamquitter.com and keep practicing.

You've started PvP very late so don't expect getting into the PvP scene to be easy.

Medion · Jan 23, 2008, 11:50 AM // 11:50

The best place to start pvp...

Not one really good answer to that I think, though I'd say TA is probably best for you when you are able to get 4 people together (semi-)regurlarly.
Although your guild may be PvE-only, there is the possibility that some would like to try PvP too, just ask

.

What is actually your goal in PvP at this moment? I mean, do you just want to play it once in a while for an hour, or do you hope to seriously improve and perhaps become a very decent player who wins battles regurlarly?

Wish Swiftdeath · Jan 23, 2008, 11:51 AM // 11:51

yea I'd say go to TA - yea there's retards but usually theres decent players too and they can teach you some stuff, with enough luck you'll end up on their friends list and may be guested if they're short on players.

Best way is too dedicate alot of time, join a pvp guild and just play everyday together to improve you're individual and teamwork skills.

Thats about as far as i've got so i can't say any more

netniwk · Jan 23, 2008, 11:55 AM // 11:55

Best way to get into PvP is joining a good and helpfull PvP guild,i learned this the hard way.

RotteN · Jan 23, 2008, 11:55 AM // 11:55

The best place to start PvP is in a guild.

Be it one with mixed PvP interests, or focussed on TA, HA or GvG, doesn't realy matter. Mixed might be better so you get a chance to try out every format and decide what you like best.

RhanoctJocosa · Jan 23, 2008, 12:01 PM // 12:01

TA is full of ridiculous gimmicks that are decided by who has the better monk. I honestly don't think it's the place for a new PvPer to learn the game- unless mashing buttons is your idea of PvP. Another thing, try decide what profession you like best and stick with it. Start observing players of your class in high level GvGs (rawr, DF, dR, etc.) and watch how they move, use skills, etc.

Fril Estelin · Jan 23, 2008, 12:04 PM // 12:04

One advice for you (I'm in a similar situation):
practice builds you can find on PvX http://www.pvxwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page

You learn a lot about the difference between PvE and PvP through experience. For example, you need fast casting spells, and easy energy management, plus sometimes more generic spells that combine well with other professions.

It's a totally different world, but don't be put off by the over-competitive behavior of some people. As long as it's not constantly like that, just ignore them and move on. Unlock TA, play with guildies, do some AB too if you can, gain XP, read thread on the HA/TA/RA forums of GWG and observe some PvP games (use the "b" key to access observer mode). It takes time, a lot of it, simply be patient.

(one big problem I found is that PvP players play many professions while PvE players specialise a lot)

Good luck anyway!

I D E L E T E D I · Jan 23, 2008, 12:17 PM // 12:17

Another advice i would give you is maybe not to start monking in pvp. Its one of the most difficult proffession to play well imo.
and i semi agree with RhanoctJocosa that ranger is a good proffesion to start off with especially crip shot its not an easy bar to play but its easier than some of the other bars.

~ Dan ~ · Jan 23, 2008, 12:56 PM // 12:56

Well if your ping isn't <100fps then unless you can read minds, you can't play ranger effectively.

Iotan · Jan 23, 2008, 01:05 PM // 13:05

The best option is to start GvGing with a bad guild as much as you can, so by not looking at that option you are gimping yourself pretty badly... If you're looking to improve at GvG then the best way to do so is to play it.

Play some of the popular builds in RA and AB and try to make friends with people in those places that know what they are doing. You might get lucky and have them ask you to guest for their guild once in a while. Observe games and talk to other observers about them (most of them will be gigantic idiots but sometimes you'll find someone smart). When people tell you that you suck, whisper them and ask them why. If they continue being a jerk then just put them on ignore but sometimes they will be helpful.

Fril Estelin · Jan 23, 2008, 01:08 PM // 13:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by dan-the-noob

Well if your ping isn't <100fps then

This reminded me a question I wanted to ask since a long time:

what is the acceptable limit for pings for playing PvP (in a normal manner I mean)?

I sometimes get more than 300ms, even higher than 500ms from time to time, but I am at 200 in average. I sometimes get the feeling that it's slow enough for me to miss a thing or two and loose a match. Or maybe it's delays in processing graphics information on my laptop (not to mention the Vista's popups stealing application focus ... !).

~ Dan ~ · Jan 23, 2008, 01:15 PM // 13:15

300ms is fine for pretty much anything else (never played mesmer, so i don't know if it's suitable for their interrupts?). But when i had that much ping playing ranger, it was almost impossible to reflex interrupt 1 second skills

Personette · Jan 23, 2008, 01:21 PM // 13:21

I say stick with RA for a while and keep working out the kinks. I've also just started getting into PvP and after ABing for a while moved to RA...I have played all profs also, but my main is a monk so that's what I have been playing in PvP.

It's a pain because even players who don't know much about PvP do know to attack the enemy team's monk - but those same players frequently don't know that they also need to defend their own monk. It's a little bizarre, actually.

You need to have enough skills on your bar to keep yourself alive when you're being targeted. And you need to be able to keep healing other team members while you're doing it. Bad teammates are good just because they make this job harder and so you get better faster. But if your teammates can't keep half the opposing team from spending all their time trying to kill you, they aren't holding up their end of the bargain.

So when someone is telling you to go back to PvE...well, go look around and figure out if there is something with your bar, that's always good advice, but maybe ask if you're on a team with an incompetent jerk who ought to get the beam out of his own eye before he starts pointing out the splinter in yours.

drakenya · Jan 23, 2008, 01:22 PM // 13:22

If you're doing something new, go to RA. Half the time, people don't know whats going on, don't work together, or are trying something out themselves. At most, you see your team for a couple minutes and then move on to another.

For more organized, structured, and for getting much better do TA or AB or GvG. But for testing or starting out or just quick action, stick with RA.

Iotan · Jan 23, 2008, 01:24 PM // 13:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by dan-the-noob

300ms is fine for pretty much anything else (never played mesmer, so i don't know if it's suitable for their interrupts?). But when i had that much ping playing ranger, it was almost impossible to reflex interrupt 1 second skills

Not sure about that... I routinely play with 230-300 ping and find it acceptable for a ranger. Just know your limits; don't try to reflex 3/4 casts and start watching for how often an important skill is used. Stand a little closer to the character you're trying to get. Ping over 320 and playing a R/ or interrupt based Me/ is pretty pointless unless you're trying for stuff like 2s casts.

Yes ping under 100 is fantastic but I've literally never had that. Just learn how to play with the system you have and you'll be pretty good.

~ Dan ~ · Jan 23, 2008, 01:34 PM // 13:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iotan

don't try to reflex 3/4 casts

But good rangers can do that. Sure you can play ranger at 300ms, but to be most effective you need <100 ping.

ariarena · Jan 23, 2008, 01:54 PM // 13:54

First of all, thanks guys for your answers, all advices are welcome

To Rhanoctjocosa, I’m familiar with those builds, I’ve played both in AB. In fact, I’m thinking I’ll stick to mesmer and ranger, as I enjoy playing the “annoying” char, and generally have enough low ping (around 100-200) to do so.

To Medion, I don’t expect to become a top pvp player, mainly because of playing time limitations. But I do like to play well; I find fun learning and, when deserved, winning.

I’d try TA for now. Sadly, getting another guild is out of the question just now, but thanks for all suggestions anyway.

Avarre · Jan 23, 2008, 01:55 PM // 13:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fril Estelin

This reminded me a question I wanted to ask since a long time:

what is the acceptable limit for pings for playing PvP (in a normal manner I mean)?

I usually played at 300-500ms as Mesmer. Overall I have to say it's a very large detriment as you can't afford to be missing interrupts if you want to be as effective as possible.