Curse

InfernalSuffering · Mar 29, 2008, 07:14 PM // 19:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Patrick

[Dev Update] Issues with ATS and Xunlai Tournament House – 29 March

The monthly tournament in the Automated Tournament System, taking place this weekend, had an error with the map rotation. We had three choices: (1) Restart the tournament, depriving players and guilds of their hard-earned victories; (2) leave it running with the incorrect maps; (3) correct the map rotation mid-tournament, so that the majority of the tournament takes place on the intended maps. We elected to go with the third choice, and we have amended the rotation so that all maps moving forward will be as indicated in the tournament messaging. We apologize for this issue, and wish everyone the best of luck in the coming rounds.

Absolutely nothing was said about the Xunlai Tournament House.

Changing it mid rotation was a terrible idea.

The Arching Healer · Mar 29, 2008, 07:17 PM // 19:17

[Dev Update] Issues with ATS and Xunlai Tournament House – 29 March

Ye indeed, Andrew could you give us some information what's going to happen with the Xunlai House?

Gaile Gray · Mar 29, 2008, 07:17 PM // 19:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Arching Healer

[Dev Update] Issues with ATS and Xunlai Tournament House – 29 March

The proper update is:

[Dev Update] Issues with March ATS Tournament -- 29 March

The monthly tournament in the Guild Wars Automated Tournament System, taking place this weekend, had an error with the map rotation. We had three choices: (1) Restart the tournament, depriving players and guilds of their hard-earned victories; (2) leave it running with the incorrect maps; (3) correct the map rotation mid-tournament, so that the majority of the tournament takes place on the intended maps. We elected to go with the third choice, and we have amended the rotation so that all maps moving forward will be as indicated in the tournament messaging. We apologize for this issue, and wish everyone the best of luck in the coming rounds.

Sorry for the confusion, I was going to mention both, but took the XTH to forums.

Aera · Mar 29, 2008, 07:19 PM // 19:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Arching Healer

[Dev Update] Issues with ATS and Xunlai Tournament House – 29 March

Ye indeed, Andrew could you give us some information what's going to happen with the Xunlai House?

I agree, just like DutchSmurf said, at least SAY so when you change back. Like. Seriously.

Kaon · Mar 29, 2008, 07:29 PM // 19:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by DutchSmurf

Option 3 would have been perfectly fine if it:
a) was announced to the players
b) was done after the Swiss rounds.
What we got now was a shortsighted solution that made it only worse. Anet really needs to look at the way they are doing their tournaments. Errors like this are just unacceptable if you want to be taken serious.

Quoted for truth. If it had been announced everyone would've been happy, now it was plainly ridiculous. I thought this was obvious but apparantly it isnt.

xhappy feetx · Mar 29, 2008, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Patrick

[Dev Update] Issues with ATS and Xunlai Tournament House – 29 March

The monthly tournament in the Automated Tournament System, taking place this weekend, had an error with the map rotation. We had three choices: (1) Restart the tournament, depriving players and guilds of their hard-earned victories; (2) leave it running with the incorrect maps; (3) correct the map rotation mid-tournament, so that the majority of the tournament takes place on the intended maps. We elected to go with the third choice, and we have amended the rotation so that all maps moving forward will be as indicated in the tournament messaging. We apologize for this issue, and wish everyone the best of luck in the coming rounds.

Changing it mid-tournament eh? without notifying anyone? Sounds super brave, also the majority of matches played occur during the Swiss rounds, so changing it more than halfway through Swiss means the majority of the tournament matches have already been played on the incorrect rotation. Plus the addition of the Xunlai mishaps should have been enough to show that it would've been better just to cancel the tourney.

JR · Mar 29, 2008, 07:36 PM // 19:36

Two about this concern me:

- Why did it take so many rounds for someone to do something about it/notice it. Surely for an important event like this people should have been on hand to deal with problems.

- Why was there no in-game message broadcast about the rotation being corrected.

Wahoo · Mar 29, 2008, 07:49 PM // 19:49

Guild Wars: Now with 50% less dev support

I also like how one of our players was banned mid-match during round seven. With the first four rounds on incorrect maps, it's as if our (and everyone else's) Q.P.s gained this month were worthless.

I think you guys need to take this one step further beyond an apology and offer every affected player 250 reward points for this embarrassment.

xhappy feetx · Mar 29, 2008, 08:02 PM // 20:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wahoo

Guild Wars: Now with 50% less dev support

I also like how one of our players was banned mid-match during round seven. With the first four rounds on incorrect maps, it's as if our (and everyone else's) Q.P.s gained this month were worthless.

I think you guys need to take this one step further beyond an apology and offer every affected player 250 reward points for this embarrassment.

Did he actually do anything or was it a random ban?

Gaile Gray · Mar 29, 2008, 08:13 PM // 20:13

First, I'm not familiar with the coding for the tournament, so I can't comment on some of the questions. I can say that having the game display a warning about the change would have been great, but because the tournaments happen pretty closely together and the devs were working under tight conditions to get things fixed quickly, I don't think that anyone thought of doing that. I will take that suggestion to our post mortem meeting so that we can assess that possibility. In fact, as I ponder this, I wonder if broadcast map messaging could be linked to the ATS by default... it's worth asking about.

I did ask about changing the log-in screen, but that wasn't felt to be necessary. What I was told was that most of those involved with the ATS are savvy enough to check a forum or the Dev Updates page if they perceive or hear of an issue with the system.

As to timing, if my math is correct, the first match began at 9:00 and we have emails starting just an hour later. It took us a bit of time to locate someone to implement the fix, but I'm not sure that would be considered a lengthy a period of time, considering time zones, sleep schedules, etc.

And lastly, on the "ban." Do you mean "ban" or do you mean "block?" And, was that the player with the offensive, racist name that I heard about through the grapevine? If that's the case, don't expect an apology from us for putting a temporary block on the account and requiring him to change the name of that character. If this is the case, that player should have thought about the name long ago -- like when he looked at the character creation screen -- and failing that, the guild should have realized that the member's participation was in jeopardy every time that character was played. In the end, it would be foolhardy to be angry at the company for enforcing the RoC and the UA, and for making the game a better place by removing an obviously offensive and inflamatory name.

Now, if what I've mentioned above was not the case, I apologize for any confusion with my comments. If this appears to be a totally baseless and random action, please feel free to have the player PM me the details, including the Support incident number and the message(s) he received, and I'll check into this. I cannot reset the block to allow him to participate, and we're not going to make adjustments to points or rewards for player or guild as a result, but I will be more than happy to investigate.

Wahoo · Mar 29, 2008, 08:16 PM // 20:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

And lastly, on the "ban." Do you mean "ban" or do you mean "block?" And, was that the player with the offensive, racist name that I heard about through the grapevine? If that's the case, don't expect an apology from us for putting a temporary block on the account and requiring him to change the name of that character. If this is the case, that player should have thought about the name long ago -- like when he looked at the character creation screen -- and failing that, the guild should have realized that the member's participation was in jeopardy every time that character was played. In the end, it would be foolhardy to be angry at the company for enforcing the RoC and the UA, and for making the game a better place by removing an obviously offensive and inflamatory name.

Now, if what I've mentioned above was not the case, I apologize for any confusion with my comments. If this appears to be a totally baseless and random action, please feel free to have the player PM me the details, including the Support incident number and the message(s) he received, and I'll check into this. I cannot reset the block to allow him to participate, and we're not going to make adjustments to points or rewards for player or guild as a result, but I will be more than happy to investigate.

Not the case, you seem to be misinformed. Just clearing the air - he'll be in touch

JR · Mar 29, 2008, 08:23 PM // 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

I don't think that anyone thought of doing that.

That would be your job.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

I did ask about changing the log-in screen, but that wasn't felt to be necessary. What I was told was that most of those involved with the ATS are savvy enough to check a forum or the Dev Updates page if they perceive or hear of an issue with the system.

I don't think any useful details of the problem were on the Dev Updates page, and they certainly weren't on any forum. It was mostly down to people on IRC figuring it out themselves.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

As to timing, if my math is correct, the first match began at 9:00 and we have emails starting just an hour later. It took us a bit of time to locate someone to implement the fix, but I'm not sure that would be considered a lengthy a period of time, considering time zones, sleep schedules, etc.

E-mails? You are relying on people checking their email mid-tourney? Seriously how can you go to this kind of length but not think of a simple in-game broadcast?

Razz L Dazzle · Mar 29, 2008, 08:23 PM // 20:23

Advice: Before running a tournament check to make everything is good to go, especially with money on the line and everyone preparing all month for this.

The select a solution and tell nobody policy was a terrible idea. Solution 3 was fine but it was poorly implemented just like everything else. Having nobody there to supervise the tournament to resolve any issues was terrible.

Reverend Dr · Mar 29, 2008, 08:24 PM // 20:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wahoo

Guild Wars: Now with 50% less dev support

and more PR blunders

Div · Mar 29, 2008, 08:28 PM // 20:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

I did ask about changing the log-in screen, but that wasn't felt to be necessary. What I was told was that most of those involved with the ATS are savvy enough to check a forum or the Dev Updates page if they perceive or hear of an issue with the system.

Not to be harsh here, but we're kinda trying to prepare our builds for the next round (or what we thought the map would be). The reason why we have set rotations is so competitive teams with multiple builds can choose and run a given build for a given map. Some of us aren't just sitting around on our asses doing nothing refreshing guru or wiki all day. How long would it take for you guys to add a line to the opening screen or the tournament window? That's not worth the effort to clear things up?

Quote:

As to timing, if my math is correct, the first match began at 9:00 and we have emails starting just an hour later.

What you're saying is that you guys didn't even have anyone on responsible for the tourneys? Sure it's "automated," but that doesn't mean no one is on to check when something goes wrong. People were trying to get in contact ever since we loaded into solitude in the first match. I'm sure if an Anet employee was actually on, they'd notice that in the first 15 minutes of the AT instead of starting to look for people an hour (two matches) later.

Gaile Gray · Mar 29, 2008, 08:35 PM // 20:35

Allow me to clarify a couple of things, for greater accuracy:

I do not have all-game broadcast abilities, and those who do have those capabilities did not feel it was necessary to make an all-game message to the effect of map changes for the people playing in the ATS.
An email was written to detail the situation but the primary means of communication was phone calls between at least five different staff members, including the designer who manages tournaments and an ArenaNet co-founder.

Update:

Our website programmer has just written to say he is in the office and working on the XTH now. Thanks again for your patience.

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

Not to be harsh here, but we're kinda trying to prepare our builds for the next round (or what we thought the map would be). The reason why we have set rotations is so competitive teams with multiple builds can choose and run a given build for a given map. Some of us aren't just sitting around on our asses doing nothing refreshing guru or wiki all day. How long would it take for you guys to add a line to the opening screen or the tournament window? That's not worth the effort to clear things up?

I totally understand what you're saying, and frankly, I knew all this when I asked about it. Yes, it's a strategic and tactical thing, and I'm sorry that we could not / did not do it.

Quote:

What you're saying is that you guys didn't even have anyone on responsible for the tourneys? Sure it's "automated," but that doesn't mean no one is on to check when something goes wrong. People were trying to get in contact ever since we loaded into solitude in the first match. I'm sure if an Anet employee was actually on, they'd notice that in the first 15 minutes of the AT instead of starting to look for people an hour (two matches) later.

Obviously, given the promptness with which this was discovered, we monitor the ATS. However, we do not have someone in the game for the 48 straight hours of the monthly championships. (Or were you suggesting 24/7 during the entire month?) Anyway, I will make a recommendation about this so that perhaps we can have more direct observation in the future. However, it remains to be seen if such dedicated staffing would be deemed possible or practical. I do appreciate your thoughts on the matter.

IMMORTAlMITCH · Mar 29, 2008, 08:48 PM // 20:48

Arena.net fails once again, nothing new here.

Apple · Mar 29, 2008, 08:55 PM // 20:55

Unbelievable.

Gaile Gray · Mar 29, 2008, 08:56 PM // 20:56

You guys working on your post counts or somethin'?

I mean, really, what's the point of a one-liner, anyway?

Divinus Stella · Mar 29, 2008, 08:58 PM // 20:58

well you could always give us some pve cookies to make up for it.