 |
|
Nov 08, 2007, 12:39 PM // 12:39
|
#81 |
|
Wilds Pathfinder
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Europe
|
Overall this thread is now at a stage where it is hard to follow the on topic discussion.
I haven't voted since none of the options suits me. Lorekeeper posted mass amounts of replies here and I really would like to see some of his suggestions in a test run. However the best summary of these ideas can be found in an older thread from the test weekend: HoH 3 map rotation Anti-Climatic end to HA Big up's to Nadia Roark I enjoyed reading your posts. Cheers, Timebandit |
|
|
|
Nov 08, 2007, 03:06 PM // 15:06
|
#82 |
|
Academy Page
Join Date: Mar 2006
Guild: LotP - Niphadora is n00b
|
Any scenario with 3 teams is random, so I suggest we keep the mechanics with 2 teams.
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 08, 2007, 06:16 PM // 18:16
|
#83 | |
|
Krytan Explorer
Join Date: Jan 2007
Guild: Tomb Refugees [ToRe]
Profession: Mo/Me
|
Quote:
|
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 08, 2007, 10:46 PM // 22:46
|
#84 |
|
Forge Runner
Join Date: Feb 2006
|
Hmm, Sure, Takida is probably exagerating when saying "everything will be perfect" with old-school holding.
But once again, it is a FACT, and that's the only thing in this intire thread that's actually 100% sure, that ever since Anet started to chang HoH people have left. Sure, it could have been the IWAY nerf that made people leave, or it COULD have been the fact that people got bored, or it COULD have been the fact that armor looks ugly in the way the current HoH reflects it. NO! Bs, these people left because of 1 reason, Old-School holding got removed, that was the ONLY reason these people left... Lore, U speak about how you can win HoH WITHOUTH any AoE, yet U mention "Fear Me!"-sins, which is AOE shutdown (Nearby if U ever even read the skill), SoJ, which is 180+ (3 Sins) dmg + 2 fire eles, these hex pressure builds, which usually pack a fire ele or 2... Once again, and please, for once, read it, IT IS ABOUT CAPTURING A POINT, A.K.A. BALLING UP ON A CENTER SHRINE! AoE IS, and ALWAYS WILL BE overpowered on ANY capture points map. 1 on 1, yeah, Dual Mesmer builds can hold versus it, because you can shuth the fire eles down, but in a 3-way HoH, gl trying to shut ALL the fire eles down (1 fire ele pumps out +- 800 Dmg (1 target, so yeah, assuming he "ONLY" hits 5 people, 4000 Dmg) in 8-15 seconds, with a 30 second recharhe on most.) ANY build that doesn't have the AoE to do so, has a noticable disadvantage on Capture Points. Yes, you can use tactics, and go cap someone's base, turns out they send their intire team back, so you can't cap it.. You go for center again, but once again, too many fire eles, etc... It's NOT an option to pack AoE/Snares/Speed Buffs/Considerable defence, It's a REQUIREMENT. I can guarantee you a win with 8 Wammo's in HoH, but did I win because of "skill"? No, I won because the 2 other teams Ganked eachother... The problem here is that you think you're an excellent tactics caller, and that every time you win HoH you've won because of YOUR tactics. WRONG, with capture points, it's barely tactics, because, as you say, there's only 4 points. Making this more points wouldn't solve this, why? Because once again, you're dealing with 3 teams. You CAN'T predict what one of the teams is going to do, so it doesn't matter what strategy you use. If the other team reacts in a "strange" way to your moves, you need to counter-react, when in the meanwhile, the 3th team is getting away with extra points. CAPTURE POINTS WILL NEVER, EVER, EVER AND EVER (I really hope you understand it now) BE FAIR IN A 3-WAY HALL OF HEROES!!! (Relic Run is just plain retarded - Ok, who has best connection? => Make Haste, gogo, make sure U cap last. (Capping first could fix this problem, but, just like anything else, it won't fix the "Don't get too far ahead" problem...) AND ONCE AGAIN: RELIC RUNWILL NEVER BE FAIR(/Skill based) IN A 3-WAY HALL OF HEROES!!! (Because there is NO WAY you can fix the 2v1 problem) |
|
|
|
|
Nov 09, 2007, 12:51 AM // 00:51
|
#85 | |||||||
|
Wilds Pathfinder
Join Date: Apr 2006
|
oh i do enjoy posts like these!
Where shall i start? I hope you do forgive me Nurse if i indulge myself in tearing this one apart. Its not like this thread is good for anything else :P Theres a strange thing i noticed about threads in the HA section compared to say... the gladiator section and the guild battle section... there is a collection of wonderful posters in this HA forum that cant help but get personal, unreasonable when ''discussing'' their ideas (if you can call it that - its more akin to hearing a child whine about not getting their way). I need not point out which posts im talking about, its pretty obvious which ones. In the other 2 forums, there are pretty good discussions, with very little unreasonable posts flying around. Ill leave it to the rest of you to figure out why. Quote:
You really must not mistake fact for fiction. I challenge you to backup your claim of fact. If not, please stop claiming it as such, it really reeks of ignorance. Quote:
I listed those builds as examples of viable pressure builds in the current HA meta because another poster said that bringing back altar holding would allow pressure builds to come back. I made the point that HA right now has plenty of examples of pressure builds... I didnt once say that any of those builds were well suited for winning HoH... you would never catch me running any of those builds and im pretty damn sure you have NO idea what kind of builds i play let alone WHO i am in game. So please dont presume to know ANYTHING about me. Quote:
Let me tell you a secret about capture points fights in HoH when you know you are facing 2 teams with strong AoE dmg. DONT BALL ON THE ALTAR. lol ok, now for those of you who are mystified with that concept, let me elaborate a little. BALLING IN AOE IS BAD. Now youre probably wondering how to win capture points if you dont ball on the altar... well... what happens in HoH capture points most of the time? Yep... people rush the altar and get annihilated by AoE. Boohoo for them. Why dont you accelerate their demise by pressuring their monks? Why dont you set your mesmer on their LoD monk and add more fuel to the AoE bonanza thats going on around them. Why dont you snare the entire altar full of idiots balling in AoE so they cant even escape once they realise balling in the AoE was not such a good idea after all. And where are you whilst all this crazy destruction is going on? Well if you are smart like ''Killed u man'' im sure you were safely off the altar waiting for the two other teams to nuke eachother to hell. I mean, who balls in AoE? Thats kinda stupid right? Its probably not going to take very long for people to start dying, after all, who can possible survive balling in AoE against all those nasty fire eles... and if you got their lod monks shutdown it will happen sooner rather than later. If you time it well they might even die in large numbers right after the auto rez... the dust clears away... smoke clouds dissipate... get on that altar and cap it. Hold it for a little while... go on dont be afraid... if you got a good enough team you should be able to survive at least a small while under a moderate amount of aoe pressure. Whats that? Everyone ressed and is coming to nuke the altar again? GET OFF THE ALTAR!!!! (but if you are close to holding for another point you should probably try get that point before leaving unless you truly will full team wipe) once off the altar the other two teams will more than likely go and ball on it again, because after all this is capture points and you do HAVE to ball on altars to win right? But you were smart, you knew you would die to all those nasty nukes but you had your trusty pokemon in your pocket... thats right TACTICS came and saved your day... you got off the altar and let other people bathe in fire. as much as i enjoy writing this all out for you, i think i made my point. And did i once say that i had 3 savannah heat eles in my team? Nope didnt think so either... that ''tactic'' works for most good balanced builds... assuming a good balanced build has some sort of shutdown... OR some sort of snare... PR and some sort of aoe dmg... OR some good frontliners. Oh and lets not forget TACTICS. Quote:
and 1) AoE is not hard to fit into a build. 2) nor or snares. 3) nor are speed buffs. 4) You got 2 great monks? Good cos that means you dont need a build packed to the brim with defense. all those utilities find a natural and easy place in most balanced builds... i can make a hex build and take along those things... i can make a condition build with them too... the only thing that limits the builds i run in HA is the meta and narrow victory conditions. Quote:
Thats the fundamental concept behind the balanced build. Quote:
Quote:
What you need to do is try to treat these threads like discussions. Not places to rant, or to scream, or to misquote other people, or to attack other people because they are trying to provide constructive feedback. Because im sure you could have written your entire post in a far more reasonable way, and its not like you disagree with everything else thats been said in this thread already, theres obviously things you have said that others have also said already, including me... But the way you talk, you make it sound like noone else had pointed out any faults in HoH. P.S. lawl at the reply to your post above mine... who'd have thought it huh? This stuff is gold. |
|||||||
|
|
|
|
Nov 09, 2007, 01:53 PM // 13:53
|
#86 |
|
Krytan Explorer
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: My Chair
Profession: P/W
|
oldschool altar cap is just much better and i dont want capture shrines taken into every pvp arena i dont AB or HB cus of that but now ur bringing in to TA , RA ,HA?
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 09, 2007, 01:56 PM // 13:56
|
#87 |
|
Jungle Guide
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: USA
Guild: Lack of Talent [Luck]
Profession: P/
|
Just thought I'd point out, a 3 way isnt meant to be FAIR to anyone. Being FAIR would inadvertantly give builds more advantage than it would skill or tactics
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 10, 2007, 11:15 AM // 11:15
|
#88 |
|
Academy Page
Join Date: Nov 2007
|
Altar Holding allmost leading by double, gogo.
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 10, 2007, 05:22 PM // 17:22
|
#89 | |
|
Lion's Arch Merchant
Join Date: Jul 2007
|
Quote:
|
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 10, 2007, 05:35 PM // 17:35
|
#90 | |
|
Krytan Explorer
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: My Chair
Profession: P/W
|
Quote:
lol. first theres over then a few thousands 2nd these votes ar eoften listened to they listented to 8v8 and 6v6 vote? |
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 10, 2007, 05:37 PM // 17:37
|
#91 |
|
Ascalonian Squire
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Belgium
Guild: Never Alone Always Together [TeaM]
Profession: R/
|
bring back the old skool thing: last capped team wins
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 11, 2007, 01:28 PM // 13:28
|
#92 | |
|
Academy Page
Join Date: Nov 2007
|
Quote:
|
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 11, 2007, 02:13 PM // 14:13
|
#93 |
|
Banned
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: United States
|
I would like to rock the boat on this one, because HA is primary responsible for skill balance the has destroyed GW as we know it and lead to the creation of GW2 which we all know after the first 3 month we be destroyed too unless they seprate PvP and PvE.
Anyway get away from the focus of just killing (Elimination matches) First suggestion: Capture the flag, in this battle a team would have to capture the opposing teams flag and run it back to their base, the defender team would have to defend the flag. the first team to score 3 wins. If a captured flag is drop, the capture and defend team switch, if a flag is captured they switch. Key stragity would be knockdown and speed with counters. Second suggestion: battle of the ghostly heros In this senerio the ghoshly heros would fight each other, the teams would have to keep their heros alive, first one to die that team loses. Conditions on the heros, they also have -5 health degen. Second all players have -3 energy degen Last suggestion: Running the guntlet In this battle the first player from either team to go the farthest or finish first wins. You have to run threw a line of towers that spit out flame arrows, pioson arrows, and snow balls, as well as crossing lava with submerging rocks and ice sheets. Of course you can still have one or two kill maps, but I believe this would serve to add balance to the game. IMO |
|
|
|
|
Nov 11, 2007, 02:45 PM // 14:45
|
#94 | |
|
Wilds Pathfinder
Join Date: Sep 2006
Guild: Englishmen Don't Drink [Tea]
Profession: W/R
|
Quote:
Suggestion as a whole isn't bad, but the -3 energy degen is bad |
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 11, 2007, 03:05 PM // 15:05
|
#95 | |
|
Lion's Arch Merchant
Join Date: Aug 2007
|
Quote:
But besides the first one, I think it would just encourage more gimmick builds.. |
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 11, 2007, 08:37 PM // 20:37
|
#96 | |
|
Wilds Pathfinder
Join Date: Apr 2006
|
Quote:
idea 1 sounds cool But its generally quite hard to kill a relic runner if the monks are able to focus their attention on keeping it alive. But on the other hand its quite hard for monks to maintain good energy levels in a running battle (the difficulty of which was felt in the old kill count maps)... so if the fight is continually moving in sync with the runner... well i guess its hard to tell how it would work without seeing it in action. I imagine it would be like the first relic run map... however the difference would be that only 1 team gets to run a relic at a time and if they drop it the other team gets to run one. Its very interesting... blody blocking would be quite effective unless you faced a team with significant AoE dmg... since if a runner got totally blocked it would not be allowed to pass the flag on by dropping it... more emphasis will be on snares and cleaning snares... shutting down snarers and preventing body blocks. I wonder if a time limit for holding the flag should be given... when the timer is up the flag gets given to the other side. Everytime the flag is reset it should appear in the base of who gets to run it... and it should not be clickable by the enemy team. overall an interesting idea... that would only work in a 1vs1 situation. idea 2 hmmm iiiiiiinteresting... thought about it for a few minutes and i realised in theory this would be pretty cool... but in practice... gank gank gank. Theres nothing stopping 2 teams from ganging up on the 3rd because they dont like them cos they smell bad or because they got red capes or something. I cant endorse this idea in a 3 way fight. in a 2 way fight however... there would be no problem with ganking. And i think it would be pretty cool. Forget about those negative conditions... they are unfair on certain professions. If you want a way to make sure that 1 team loses, add a VoD mechanic. If the match lasts for 8min, at 2:00 VoD comes with the following conditions ghostly hero takes double damage from all sources enchantments on ghostly last 50% shorter weapon spells on ghostly last 50% shorter hexes and conditions on ghostly last 50% longer (trying to add negative conditions that would affect both teams equally no matter what they run) i like your idea... in a 1vs1 fight. idea 3 - gauntlet this would be awesome... it would require a totally new map... but i dont think having turrets firing random toothpicks of doom will be very interesting after a while. I think the gauntlet should have a series of rooms filled with a diverse range of monsters or teams of NPCs that must be killed as fast as possible before being allowed to progress to the next room. You could have an upgraded Zaishen teams in each room for example... in room 1 zaishens with hex degen... room 2 with conditions... room 3 obs flame spike or some other spike... room 4 balanced... etc etc That would certainly test every teams ability to be able to beat a wide variety of builds regardless of what the meta contained... even if the HA meta was full of spiritways... people would still need to know how to beat heavy hex or heavy condition teams in order to win HoH. Granted the zaishen teams wont be that good, but give them good enough builds and they could certainly emulate a condition build to a decent enough standard to prove a challenge for your average HA team. you could have as many teams competing in this mode... so if the 2 other maps were 1vs1... this one could be 1vs1vs1vs1 or even more. On the ''U'' map you would be able to see the progress of the other teams... first to reach the end of the gauntlet wins. this could even spawn an additional mini-game within HA. With an NPC recording the fastest times for completing the gauntlet and rewarding the fastest teams every month with something like a sigil each or a random rare item as if they had won a match in HoH. /sigh alas... tis too late... for our beloved Heroes Ascent has felt the coldness of the grave for far too long. |
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 12, 2007, 06:26 PM // 18:26
|
#97 |
|
Academy Page
Join Date: Nov 2007
|
I remember those days when halls was exciting, I remember the days when i cried about 6v6 how bad it was (Yet, It was alot better than ha is atm) ,
I remember how pissed everyone was when 8v8 got back but with new mechanics, I remember now that changing only make things worse, I remember anet caring about the poeple, And i hope they will do it once more. Last edited by Legally; Nov 12, 2007 at 11:23 PM // 23:23.. |
|
|
|
|
Nov 13, 2007, 08:05 PM // 20:05
|
#98 |
|
Academy Page
Join Date: Nov 2007
|
God.. I Just want those days back... Balanced/iway/r-spike/vim/smiteball/dualsmite and holding for Favor..
Whats HA now? gogo aoe, skip from uw to halls get ganked ! Yippie. A freaking joke.. lol 
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 13, 2007, 08:52 PM // 20:52
|
#99 |
|
Academy Page
Join Date: Jul 2006
Guild: LFGuild
Profession: P/W
|
Old school HA
Bring it back now. ANet, you've had your fun. Allow us to go back to our old gimmicks, since the ones which are there now just suck.
|
|
|
|
|
Nov 13, 2007, 09:14 PM // 21:14
|
#100 |
|
Ascalonian Squire
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: htown
Guild: Gangsters In The Hood
Profession: R/
|
yes plz old HoH would be great
|
|
|
|
 |
|
«
Previous Thread
|
Next Thread
»
| Thread Tools | |
| Display Modes | |
Linear Mode
|
|
All times are GMT. The time now is 11:29 AM // 11:29.
jQuery(document).ready(checkAds()); function checkAds(){if (document.getElementById('adsense')!=undefined){document.write("_gaq.push(['_trackEvent', 'Adblock', 'Unblocked', 'false',,true]);");}else{document.write("