Curse

Almighty Zi · Mar 26, 2008, 03:36 PM // 15:36

Its difficult to reasonably balance a mechanism that makes good positional play redundant. Making offensive shadowsteps half-range and the defensive ones (and the ones that return you to your original location) black out your skills for 7..2 seconds would be a good starting point.

Celeborn10 · Mar 26, 2008, 04:28 PM // 16:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Almighty Zi

Its difficult to reasonably balance a mechanism that makes good positional play redundant. Making offensive shadowsteps half-range and the defensive ones (and the ones that return you to your original location) black out your skills for 7..2 seconds would be a good starting point.

If that were implemented Assassins would have even less reason to take Shadow Arts for defensive shadowsteps. Monks can afford to invest around 8-9 points into Shadow Arts for a decent Dark Escape while Assassins rarely have the room on the bar or don't have enough points to justify taking any Shadow Arts builds. The inherent problem with Shadow Arts is that what few skills do see use are damage mitigation skills and a few lousy healing skills.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luminarus

For 3 seconds you cannot be targeted by spells or attacks (like shadow form) and move 100% faster. You cannot change directions and move directly towards target foe. (Can pass through terrain but can be body blocked by people). Whilst under this you cannot use skills, and cannot change directions. This effect ends when you are adjacent to target foe. When it ends if you're target has more HP then you you are healed for XXX.

This is one of the better solutions that's been suggested but would it be an enchantment or a stance? Would the movement stack with something like Dash (use Dash->Shadowstep)? Also if enchantment, signets and touch skills could counter it

. Overall its a good solution but there might be a few loopholes that need to be resolved.

moriz · Mar 26, 2008, 04:32 PM // 16:32

line of sight, and if you fail to reach your target, you are dazed for 10 seconds.

bas koopman · Mar 26, 2008, 05:33 PM // 17:33

I think keeping the non-agressive shadowsteps as they are, but increasing the recharge on SP, Dark Prison, etc to 1 second could fix the problem. that way you can interupt it easily

Storm Warder · Mar 27, 2008, 05:59 PM // 17:59

All enchantments/stances end (or perhaps just non-assassin ones, saving SF farmers) + dazed for x seconds.

Pyro maniac · Mar 27, 2008, 06:07 PM // 18:07

Blinded for 3 seconds at the offensive ones

Itokaru · Mar 28, 2008, 01:35 AM // 01:35

Half-Range sounds good, but wouldn't an aftercast delay mess up the element of surprise? Surprise is supposed to be one of the assassin's main strengths.

C2K · Mar 28, 2008, 09:42 AM // 09:42

Don't make Shadowsteps half ranged, plz.

Unless you really want to see Shadowsteps be broken. [skill]Deadly Haste[/skill]

Just Line of Sight would be great.

Unreal Havoc · Mar 29, 2008, 02:06 AM // 02:06

Make all Shadow Steps a maintainable enchantment like AoD and all of the offensive shadowsteps should all be elite. That way theres a nice way to combat them with enchantment removal and energy denial while limiting the Assassins elite choices in conjunction with a shadowstep. When the enchantment is removed any type of condition imposed on the target from the shadow step (snare, daze, etc), and any benefit the Assassin has, is removed and the Assassin is sent packing back to where he shadow stepped from. Add line of sight that includs both players and scenery. Increase activation times so that they are easier to interrupt. Failure chance of 50% for none Assassin primary classes if the attribute nessacary for the shadowstep is 6 or less.

Arkantos · Mar 29, 2008, 02:17 AM // 02:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by C2K

Don't make Shadowsteps half ranged, plz.

Unless you really want to see Shadowsteps be broken. [skill]Deadly Haste[/skill]

Just Line of Sight would be great.

Make shadowsteps a skill, not a spell. Or change deadly haste to exclude shadowsteps.

ensoriki · Mar 30, 2008, 08:22 AM // 08:22

Half range shadow steps, why the hell would you use a half range shadow step?
Unless your s-steping to a bridge above you or something along those lines it would just be better to take dash.

Quote:

Make all Shadow Steps a maintainable enchantment like AoD and all of the offensive shadowsteps should all be elite. . .

Turn all shadow steps into AOD....weak sauce.

also where does scorpion wire play in shadow stepping, As Offensive?
and scorpion wire is pretty easy to negate just by positioning.

kvndoom · Apr 06, 2008, 09:10 AM // 09:10

Shadow Walk can definitely use a fixing. For 30 seconds you cannot cast enchantments my ass. For the few seconds until you cancel the stance (cough *dash* cough) is more like it.

3 ways to fix it:

1) Make it a skill instead of a stance (cannot be self-removed)
2) Make it disable all your other stances for 15 seconds (probably too harsh, not to mention we'll start seeing Grapple A/W then)
3) Cause it to disable all your enchantments for 30 seconds. Then you can still cancel out of it to escape, but the penalty of using the skill is not negated.

(figured it was better to post here than start another thread)

Patrick Smit · Apr 06, 2008, 01:18 PM // 13:18

Aftercast is fixed, and still does not require you to spec in a certain attribute.

I would say link them to attributes, and put a conditional disable of all (or attack) skills instead in it, like 3-0.75 seconds from 0-12

Quote:

Originally Posted by C2K

Don't make Shadowsteps half ranged, plz.

Unless you really want to see Shadowsteps be broken. [skill]Deadly Haste[/skill]

Just Line of Sight would be great.

Maybe shadowstep to nearby opponent (thats not half-ranged)

Cruel Intentionsz · Apr 06, 2008, 09:38 PM // 21:38

how about not nerf shadow stepping because that takes always the whole point of the sin. they have 70 armor n critical attacks without shadowstepping its just a weaker defensed warrior. if u give seconds to disable skills with when the sin shadow steps to the opponent it has like some seconds of it just normal attacking while the enemy can run or blind

Tyla · Apr 06, 2008, 09:49 PM // 21:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cruel Intentionsz

how about not nerf shadow stepping because that takes always the whole point of the sin. they have 70 armor n critical attacks without shadowstepping its just a weaker defensed warrior. if u give seconds to disable skills with when the sin shadow steps to the opponent it has like some seconds of it just normal attacking while the enemy can run or blind

What? The 'Sin was a badly designed class anyway. Shadow Stepping was also a broken mechanic.

Not to mention extremely abusable. *Cough* Teleporting Tree *Cough*

DarkNecrid · Apr 06, 2008, 09:50 PM // 21:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cruel Intentionsz

how about not nerf shadow stepping because that takes always the whole point of the sin. they have 70 armor n critical attacks without shadowstepping its just a weaker defensed warrior. if u give seconds to disable skills with when the sin shadow steps to the opponent it has like some seconds of it just normal attacking while the enemy can run or blind

a weaker defensed warrior that can insta-gib someone in 3s, double strike, etc.

yeah.

lacasner · Apr 07, 2008, 12:13 AM // 00:13

I think what needs to be done to somewhat preserve the sin class is Make most or all attacks have toned down damage, lower recharge, and secondary effects (condition, interruption, etc. etc. (along the lines of mesmer effects perhaps). These effects should take place when the skills are not used in succession as a L O D O D combo. Granted, this isn't directly related to shadowstepping, but there isn't much of a way to fix shadowsteps without just raping them or keeping them OP. I would like to see it limited to A/X though, I think thats very important as a start.

Titine · Apr 07, 2008, 03:11 PM // 15:11

I don't GvG a lot, I am more annoyed with un-protable tele-spike in HA. 1 more sec should be good to pre-prot target.

So I'm for adding an aftercast, this should be enough.

Spirit of the void · Apr 12, 2008, 09:20 PM // 21:20

yo,whoever cant heal through a shadowstep spike is seriously slow,first of all it gives a little hex mark(most of the sin spikes need that and don't use deaths charge or something),second of all you see 1 target on your minimap teleport half the way across the map to another target and u can just click it,third of all assassins spikes did get nerfed.as you noticed you know have a chance of healing yourself,they nerfed sins dmg and buffed monks healing skills,besides one infuser in HA can stop a sin spike,maybe a couple more skills should do the trick and a bit more thinking too

Master Ketsu · Apr 12, 2008, 09:43 PM // 21:43

Lots of sin hate here. The idea is to make shadow steps less degenerate, not kill them completely. They are not THAT Op.