Curse

Lykan · Apr 18, 2008, 02:55 AM // 02:55

So what are they going to do? Roll these changes out for every monthly??
Wtb new izzy tbh, he's finally lost it.

horseradish · Apr 18, 2008, 02:57 AM // 02:57

Splinter Weapon got pwned.

Ah well.

What I really don't understand is why they keep nerfing FomF and DPS.

I can't believe Dark Pact got buffed. This is a sad day.

la_cabra_de_vida · Apr 18, 2008, 03:05 AM // 03:05

Dark Pack spike hurts, a lot. Lol at 70 damage for 1 energy.

Div · Apr 18, 2008, 03:06 AM // 03:06

Quote:

You have to understand the scope of the game and everything involved with every change. There are so many other game types, and angles to look at this stuff. Yes there are changes that would make the game more balance but also destroy the balance somewhere else, yes I understand you guys don't care about those aspects of the game, but I do I have to. You know that the vast majority of the community hates it when ANYTHING gets changed? There are a crap ton of things to consider here.

Yes, PvE has their wish now. I think this quote summarizes it all.

Made In Ascalon · Apr 18, 2008, 03:30 AM // 03:30

Good thing izzy could buff dark pact, fragility, chaos storm and fevered dreams, that was certainly needed for pvp. =| A worthy contender with the decision to buff signet of agony and elemental flame in january. It's nice that passive defense was touched slightly, but they're still weak changes and won't change the meta much IMO. Clearly, izzy is too afraid to make any more definitive, interesting changes. Thanks, PvE noobs; I was just starting to get my hopes up from march.

Frank Dudenstein · Apr 18, 2008, 03:32 AM // 03:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by lacasner

Reverting skill balances is completely ridiculous and foolish. Why not just see how these play out in the next couple of days and make minor changes accordingly.

I must be seriously missing something here if someone can tell me why this can't be done.

The PvE-ers are going to go ballistic over the splinter weapon (and a few other) nerfs so that is why they are saying that.

They should just buff Ursan Blessing to give Invulnerability and give it an Insta-aoe-death skill so the PvE ers will be happy and then we can properly balance PvP .. but oh well...

Draikin · Apr 18, 2008, 03:34 AM // 03:34

So basically they're going to revert this change and replace it with one that doesn't "negatively impact" PvE, and after that every future balance update will focus on not impacting PvE as well. In other words the "feedback" from a Riverside thread regarding balance updates is now more important than the feedback from Gladiator's Arena?

Kyp Jade · Apr 18, 2008, 03:36 AM // 03:36

Reverting good balance changes, and then seperating pvp skill balances from pve, that will be the ulitmate death call of GW pvp. Great management decisions.

la_cabra_de_vida · Apr 18, 2008, 03:45 AM // 03:45

Why do I have a feeling sin split is going to come back now.

Moral55 · Apr 18, 2008, 03:47 AM // 03:47

That might be a good thing, in order to not effect PvE Izzy might have to either do nothing (bad), or be inventive.

Destromath · Apr 18, 2008, 04:08 AM // 04:08

Does anyone think that DPS would still be a decent battle rez? It looks pretty dead to me, and it was my favorite rez skill of all time >_<.

Div · Apr 18, 2008, 04:09 AM // 04:09

DPS will still be powerful when used on a mesmer. It just makes it really difficult for a warrior to get it off now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Draikin

So basically they're going to revert this change and replace it with one that doesn't "negatively impact" PvE, and after that every future balance update will focus on not impacting PvE as well. In other words the "feedback" from a Riverside thread regarding balance updates is now more important than the feedback from Gladiator's Arena?

It has always been this way for the past year. Izzy rather listens to shitters in Riverside than people who know what they're talking about, because frankly, that's where they get their money.

C2K · Apr 18, 2008, 04:14 AM // 04:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seraphim of Chaos

Disarm didn't deserve this...

QFT.

Disarm just got Ether Renewaled...

And SoM spamming went untouched lol. Pretty ironic.

Captain Robo · Apr 18, 2008, 04:18 AM // 04:18

Holy balls, I thought the game couldn't get any worse. Touche`, anet.

Destromath · Apr 18, 2008, 04:34 AM // 04:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

DPS will still be powerful when used on a mesmer. It just makes it really difficult for a warrior to get it off now.

So do you think it will still work out on a profession with high Resto to compensate for the higher cast time and reuseability, or will it be limited to only Mesmers now?

Cammy · Apr 18, 2008, 04:56 AM // 04:56

I was under the impression everybody hated Izzy for letting rawr's defense ball win so many monthlies, especially since it led to long, drawn-out, and generally uninteresting matches.

Now passive defense can be readily dismantled. I don't get why everyone is complaining.

bungusmaximus · Apr 18, 2008, 05:23 AM // 05:23

Heh thx for deleting my posts, but my point still stands: Why bother organising an arena event and don't fix nothing about the shit builds that are ran in 4vs4? I know this game is based around GvG, but it would be rather bad game if all other pvp modes but GvG sucked

.

Not that I don't like most of the updates, but I miss a couple of things that's all.

Div · Apr 18, 2008, 05:27 AM // 05:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cammy

I was under the impression everybody hated Izzy for letting rawr's defense ball win so many monthlies, especially since it led to long, drawn-out, and generally uninteresting matches.

Now passive defense can be readily dismantled. I don't get why everyone is complaining.

Not really. The motigon template is still capable of providing enough passive defense to make the team feel little to no pressure. The nerf of aegis is something that hurts pressure teams, and promotes taking more passive defense on the midline, which completely contradicts the original goal of killing passive defense and promoting pressure. Now that monks alone can't be trusted to keep a team up, teams will have to resort to more defensive midlines.

RhanoctJocosa · Apr 18, 2008, 06:29 AM // 06:29

Icy Shackles ownzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Lordhelmos · Apr 18, 2008, 07:03 AM // 07:03

PvE balance doesn't mean shit if Ursan Blessing stays the way it is. Negatively affecting PvE balance? What PvE balance? Everyone is running Ursan and can give half a rat's ass about what happens to PvE balance -because the reality is, it doesn't affect them. As long as there are consumables and UB, people are going to depend on the same Ursan Strike and Ursan Rage skill mashing and arguing over who uses consumables until the cows come home.

Fixing UB is the first step to "PvE balance" so if your not going to touch that, then you don't have the right to talk about PvE skill balance. There really aren't any skills to balance there. So you can pretty much toss out "PvE balance" as a sad excuse for this kind of stuff.

~

On to the PvP side, nerfing all of these passive defense skills is just going to cause more people to load their midline with even more defense. After this skill update all you are going to see are turtling matches that are going to go all the way till VoD. I hope this nerf comes with pillowed seats in observer mode, because half the community is going to fall asleep watching the games.

Second of all, Dark Pact wtf?

Oh and good job and completely destroying the Ritualist class.

Mesmer updates are really the only half decent thing I'm seeing in there. Eremites and Mystic is really going to hurt dervish assaulting, but R/D and A/D are dead because of it now.

In regards the passive defense, the best solution to passive defense is making it active. Rather than slowing down the skills or upping costs, make their durations shorter and if needed, make their costs lower. Force players into taking more effort into keeping wards and aegis up through active play, that way during a pressure game, defense falls apart faster and victories are decided by what teams are more skilled at multitasking.

I really couldn't say what to do about rits and paragons, as those 2 classes are broken at the core. You'd really have to change leadership and spirit mechanics from the ground up if you want to fix those. Unfortunately every time there is an attempt to fix something that currently can't be fixed through individual skills, Rit and Paragon players suffer and more and more just get deleted.

Wow @ SoR and Ballad to 30 seconds, now a paragon would probably have better luck spamming healing party rather than bringing those two >.<.

Granted spirit protection and shout protection are passive defense at the core, the ultimate enemy of guildwars balance. Its like when those 2 classes were made, the worst foe to the game was invited to Anet's private cottage and served tea while being given a 6-digit job.

Need to find a way to pull rits and paragons from becoming completely dependant on partywide passive defense, but those factors are the core of those 2 classes. Which pretty much forces you to nerf them over and over and over again repeatedly because they are continuously causing problems. Just like at the start of factions, when a ritual lord could hold halls for 3 days straight. And then the same mistake is make with paragons when halls is being held with incoming chains that make paragon teams impossible to kill. The same freaking mistake two times.

Makes me wonder about balance in Gw2, with the rate that things here are going. Rewards for the Hall of Monuments better be good.