Curse

Akaraxle · May 23, 2008, 07:58 AM // 07:58

BLOCKZ R TEH SUXORZ, ITS NOT FUN, I WANNA KILL STUFF, GAMES SHOULD END IN 5 MINUTES.

Right.

Barkeep · May 23, 2008, 08:21 AM // 08:21

I'd like to add some complaints about the update from a TA point of view.

At the moment the Foul Feast / Wail of Doom necros completely dominate TA. Monks are unable to play a decent game because they are shut down 50% of the time by a skill that cannot actually be stopped. Also, any form of condition pressure is laughed at.

Another build that is often used by the more lame people is dual monk, dual assa, one with shattering assault, one with wounding strike. PLEASE FIX WOUNDING STRIKE!

I'm quite happy with the nerf on disarm, and I suppose the backbreaker-sword warriors were getting a bit too powerful, but I don't think the nerf on steelfang is the best solution to this, steelfang was what made coward warriors good. Dunno if these BB-sword warriors were used anywhere else, and I doubt the update was specifically meant for them, but just pointing it out to show that the update did have some good effects..

Gneppe · May 23, 2008, 08:43 AM // 08:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by kvndoom

But Eremite's and Mystic take 1/4 second longer now! That's gotta count for something, right?

Let's all play nerf-around-the-bush...

Yeah you live a 1/4 sec longer gz m8. /jk
Of course this will mean something but imo not enough..

Burton2000 · May 23, 2008, 03:38 PM // 15:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akaraxle

BLOCKZ R TEH SUXORZ, ITS NOT FUN, I WANNA KILL STUFF, GAMES SHOULD END IN 5 MINUTES.

Right.

Thing is people wanted blockway completely nerfed and anet listened and this is what we get. Of course because of that people whine so anet can't win either way. I do agree the balance is bad in that it didn't touch any of the new things in the meta.

Kaida the Heartless · May 23, 2008, 03:42 PM // 15:42

Heres the problem: Anet nerfs shit into FUBAR state (see: Watch Yourself), and completely misses the actual [current] problems.

Killing Bsurge and Wards would have done fine, but they had to tag aegis too. Guess water ele's are going to become a staple. HEV Mesmers anyone?

IMMORTAlMITCH · May 23, 2008, 04:35 PM // 16:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burton2000

Thing is people wanted blockway completely nerfed and anet listened and this is what we get. Of course because of that people whine so anet can't win either way. I do agree the balance is bad in that it didn't touch any of the new things in the meta.

They couldn't put out the update sooner due to some personnel problems afaik (people being sick etc) and didn't want to make too many untested changes 2 days before the monthly, another update is planned shortly after the monthly afaik.

Akaraxle · May 23, 2008, 05:12 PM // 17:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burton2000

Thing is people wanted blockway completely nerfed and anet listened and this is what we get. Of course because of that people whine so anet can't win either way. I do agree the balance is bad in that it didn't touch any of the new things in the meta.

Actually the situation has always pretty simple - yet not that easy to figure out: blockway was never the culprit. However sitting down, analyzing the format(s) (we always talk about GvG but I guess you need to consider them all), trying to find the causes why blockway is/was effective and applying a design-scope solution would've likely taken too much effort to be worth it.

Therefore, with the few resources devoted to balance (now, essentially only Izzy), all they could do was applying patches, palliatives, fake panaceas, swinging the metagame from blockway to cspace to sinsplit, always working around the problem but never really taking it head-on. And you know what happens if you keep stacking too many workarounds on an application? It eventually blows up on you and shit doesn't work anymore.

Free Sigils · May 23, 2008, 06:01 PM // 18:01

After an update like this, I almost expect an Infuse Health Nerf Now.
Infuse Health - Spell- 1/4 - "Not as Good as Spirit Transfer."

Nerf Balance More. Whatever. I'm done caring.

The only thing I don't even begin to understand is why Anet likes dead people. Flesh? Deathpact? DPacts been nerfed almost as many times as Arage has now. And thats saying something.

dies like fish · May 23, 2008, 07:26 PM // 19:26

Deaths add excitement to the game. Flesh of my Flesh and Death Pact were so overpowered that some teams started running only 1 or 2 res sigs.

Kaida the Heartless · May 23, 2008, 09:54 PM // 21:54

Dying things = good.

Did you even GvG during blockway? Mega lamefest. Both teams may as well have agreed to share coffee until VoD.

Akaraxle · May 23, 2008, 10:30 PM // 22:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaida the Heartless

Dying things = good.

Did you even GvG during blockway? Mega lamefest. Both teams may as well have agreed to share coffee until VoD.

No one is saying that blockway wasn't lame. I'm just claiming it was never the real culprit, and iway isn't the answer. For part of the reasons, do a search on Ensign's posts about dying in GvG.

Kaon · May 23, 2008, 11:23 PM // 23:23

I love it how people whine about "blockway" while its something that's never been really around much, especially not the last year. It's a term that can go into the thrashbin along with "lame builds" and "gimmicks" not because the word itself is bad, but because 98% of the times its mentioned wrongly.

I've said it plenty of times. There were a few periods where balance was excellent. But along comes an update that screws things up, and things just don't really work out anymore at all and will never return to that period of goodness. Instead every balance fixes something by breaking something else.

One example would be the buff of the conditionskills like fevered dreams and fragility. Probably it doesn't mean anything and they're still useless, but the buff is as random as it gets, and it's only purpose is to be useless or fuel an extremely gimmicky and possibly overpowered build. Quite like many other random buffs we've had in the past (more recently rangerattacks and pious assault).

Free Sigils · May 23, 2008, 11:29 PM // 23:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaida the Heartless

Dying things = good.

Did you even GvG during blockway? Mega lamefest. Both teams may as well have agreed to share coffee until VoD.

Dead =/= Dying.

Obviously it promotes team whipes, but it makes hard resses this close [-] to being not worth it. Dpact was fine. Flesh's recharge is meh.

Div · May 24, 2008, 12:58 AM // 00:58

Conjure needs to not stack with SoH. That is all.

dies like fish · May 24, 2008, 01:00 AM // 01:00

Change SoH to only work for physical damage. Problem solved.

dies like fish · May 24, 2008, 01:07 AM // 01:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ec]-[oMaN

It only works with melee dmg, which is already um physical dmg.

It still works with an elemental weapon. See: [Order of Pain]

DarkNecrid · May 24, 2008, 01:40 AM // 01:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by dies like fish

Change SoH to only work for physical damage. Problem solved.

Nah, just make SoH make you do holy damage.

dies like fish · May 24, 2008, 02:35 AM // 02:35

There is no shield vs. Holy damage.

Targuil · May 24, 2008, 05:32 AM // 05:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by dies like fish

There is no shield vs. Holy damage.

Then anet should make shield mod with 10 vs holy.

Krill · May 24, 2008, 06:12 AM // 06:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep

I

At the moment the Foul Feast / Wail of Doom necros completely dominate TA...

Another build that is often used by the more lame people is dual monk, dual assa, one with shattering assault, one with wounding strike. PLEASE FIX WOUNDING STRIKE!

Retarded buildwars...

Only reliable way for a "balanced" pug to beat dual monk lameway is to have a WoD / FF nec carpeting one monk with WoD and removing wounding strike gayness for free. Unless wounding strike, WotM and scythes in general are nerfed more I don't see this crappy meta going away.