Curse

Little Wise Owl · Nov 16, 2008, 04:28 PM // 16:28

Nice post! I feel #1 is the most important of all. I see way too many people trying to fight the mob 3 against 12 or 1 against 12. When arenanet adds Superman to this game and we can play him then we can do that but until then. Don't fight the mob!

moriz · Nov 16, 2008, 04:32 PM // 16:32

the real secret to success in AB: outscore your opponents. how you do it is up to you.
/thread

Tyla · Nov 16, 2008, 04:50 PM // 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriz

the real secret to success in AB: outscore your opponents. how you do it is up to you.
/thread

No.

Don't cap, just kill everything in sight brainlessly while thrashing about like a zombie out of 28 Days / Weeks.

Krill · Nov 16, 2008, 05:04 PM // 17:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

The secret to succes in AB regardless of which map your on:

1. capping always beats mobing...so you might think why do mobbers win? Cause there's always some players who consider ab they'r personal arena and ingage the mob solo or in small numbers and die fast. Deaths addup in favor of the enemy. Bottom line avoid the mob and cap!

Sometimes mobbing on Saltspray is the only stategy that works to overtake the rez shrines. There are situations on Grenz and Keys when mobbing through the rez shrine is ok too if it goes quickly and teams disperse afterwords to cap and map lock the opposing team in their base.

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

2. Builds that are capable of soloclearing shrines rule! Dont make the mistake to cap the shrine, cause if the oposing team arives and you have not finished capping it, they wil recap it at no effort and you'll end up dead! Clear the shrine and move on to the next, and leave the capping to a group. Besides as long as that shrine remains uncaped but cleared, it will NOT atract the oposing partys attention; and keep in mind that solo capping is contraproductive cause you waste alot of time.

Sometimes a 2-2 split makes sense to cap fast, but soloing shrines is almost always a bad idea because of the time and risk that you'll be driven off the shrine or ganked.

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

3. Self healing builds endure and are therefore always better! The mistake in uber damage dealing builds is that you are vulnerable and therfore might end up dieing more often than the amount of kills you make. Dieing is bad cause it adds to the oposing partys score; you waste oodles of time while waiting to rez and it will, unless you control the rez shrine, always take you back to base. This can add up to full minutes wasted before you can rejoin your party/ get to wehere you need to be. Besides the better you can survive by yourself the more precious time the oposing party will waste trying to kill you; time that could have been better spent capping. Choose your build carefully.

If you can't kill you're in trouble. It's better to retreat from battles you can't win than slog it out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

4. In the land of the dead the team that controls the rez shrine is KING! Why you might ask? Its just another shrine...No!. Its the heart of the map, which gives easy and fast access to all shrines; and you dont waste time gettting to the where the action is/ where your need to be if killed, when controling the rez shrine. Starting from base=a waste of capping time! This is why teams that run in circles on the map while capping most of the time loose the match! Remember the fastest point between shrines is a straight line. Running in circles will get you nowhere!

I agree, which is why sometimes it's ok to mob with another team through the rez shrine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

5. CASTERS should always pickup and cary the rez orbs; especially near the rez shrines. You acomplish 2 things by this. Wasting the oponents precious time, because they will have to kill the NPC's allover again before they can move on...and as a bonus your dead party members in the area will be instantly rezed! The orbs can make all de difference in a well balanced match!

Rez'ing the NPC's on a shrine fight is always a good tactic. Every shrine is pretty good now since Melandru's Shot was upgraded. The ele's do huge damage for 15-20 seconds, the mesmers backfire casters, the necros slow down melee and do AoE damage, the warriors do ok damage, the rangers snare and the monks heal fairly decently.

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

6. Take the fight to the enemys doorstep. A mistake manny teams make is caping shrines close to they'r base afther caping the rez shrine. That is plain stupidity. If the oposing team recaps the rez shrine, any oponents you kill near your base will respawn at the rez shrine and put them right back at your doorstep. 2 teams should rush the enemys base and confront them while they are exiting the base and protect the shrines nearest; because thats when they'r most vulnerable. The third team has plenty of time to cap the shrines nearest your own base and later join the others at the enemy base. The enemy will be pinned in his own base. Make shure to guard ALL exits to the base!

Map lock is always the key on grenz and keys, it's too easy to control the base exits when you get them pushed back.

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

5. Timewasterbuilds are great for stalling the oponent; and are even capable of soloing an oposing team of four. Do not engage greater numers or you'll be pushing your luck.

Defy Pain warriors can be super annoying and still do good damage with dismember instead of eviscerate (defy pain hammer and sword warriors = fail), but you still need to be able to kill players. Super tanking is only a good tactic against bad players, you need to kill the good players to win.

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

10. Always target and kill the healers first. This is not your personal arena; its AB...you want to fight 1on1 go beat your spouse (just joking). Scan the area and choose your targets wisely. Avoiding a fight can ofthen be advantagious.

Monk stomping is usually fairly easy in AB, especially with a hammer warrior. Learn to quarter knock and break and it's too easy against monks with no support or team defense. However, stance and shield bash monks are becoming a lot more common, always be careful with those. Just be aware of who needs pressure first...dom mesmers, curses necros, eles, sometimes line backing big damage sins and dervs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

11. Bring conditions removal. Do or die!

On a ranger yes, always bring the usual mending touch and help teammates with it. But on everything else use your secondary for bigger damage (conjures), disruption or mobility (shadow steps, speed boost).

Overall pretty good tips though. I've noticed a lot more Kurzicks in AB lately because of the FFF nerf, I hope it stays more active.

SaDuFam · Nov 17, 2008, 01:31 AM // 01:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

Let me elaborate on the staller build: it keeps the enemy bussy. As long as they are trying to kill you they are not capping! Staller builds should be run by individuals in a team and not by the entire team. The point is that you want your team to go on capping while ONE individual keeps an oposing team bussy. And lastly good staller builds are even capable of killing an entire oposing group of 4. Bottomline keep the enemy bussy while your team caps! And anticipating on you trolls out there: AVOID MOBS!

The bottomline is if a solo person can stall (usually some pesky rangers, sins or monks) or even kill the entire opposing group of 4 then winning is ensure. In that situation, the teams can very much just do whatever they like (cap or fight) and normally would quickly start mobbing and locking down opponents in front of their base camp. It would be a walkover match without the need to adhere to any winning stategy.

The staller build is only good against newbies to AB, otherwise would be quicly disposed off. I have to admit a good staller monk at the 2 monk shrine can be a pain. On the other hand, his other three teamates are not getting the precious healing support at somewhere else. Sin and ranger stallers never put up a fight.

ps I have also come across a good 2 monk staller team guarding the res shrines. They were very good at kiting, proting and healing. We finally gave up, ignored them and went capping other shrines to win.

phan · Nov 17, 2008, 07:21 PM // 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by arienrhode

snip huge post.

It's ab ; not rocketscience .. load up a build take 3 guildies and go xD

Krill · Nov 18, 2008, 01:58 AM // 01:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by phan

It's ab ; not rocketscience .. load up a build take 3 guildies and go xD

Yes it is rocket science, ab is super serious!

kedde · Nov 18, 2008, 10:49 PM // 22:49

The secret to being succesful in ab is to not be a complete retard and play with people who grasp the principle of basic logic.

shoogi · Nov 19, 2008, 05:29 PM // 17:29

It's funny how in most AB matches one side mobs, other side flames them in chat for mobbing ("noob suxons alwayz mob!"), but the side that mobs wins 90% of the time, because the other side doesn't know how to play against mobs. (tip- c+space is NOT a very good idea).

It's also funny that every time a team loses in ab they blame the other teams on their side.

People in AB are stupid.

JASON626 · Nov 19, 2008, 05:40 PM // 17:40

If the enemy wishes to engage in a battle typically after first cap fall back to npcs at the shrine you just capped to dd pressure, especially if the battle is not going your way or monk gets low on energy.

Learn to anticipate the direction your teammates are capping as well as opponents. You'll capped in a quicker succession if you don't end up meeting allies at the same shrine.

Byron · Nov 19, 2008, 07:09 PM // 19:09

Stop deleting my posts.

kthx.

AzNChicken · Nov 19, 2008, 08:50 PM // 20:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byron

Stop deleting my posts.

kthx.

rofl

The secret success to AB...hmmmmm. Have a fuctioning brain?

_Nihilist_ · Nov 21, 2008, 03:42 AM // 03:42

Understand your goals, how to attain them, and situations when you can/cannot attain them.

Basic logic.

Know your enemy, know yourself. Everything else should fall in place. Until you get matched with other teams that fail.

Riotgear · Nov 22, 2008, 02:24 AM // 02:24

The secret to winning is more like actually getting enough people capable of doing those things.

I'm still wondering if it would be possible to repeatedly win by just creating some turtle group just to distract the entire enemy team that refuses to ever give up a kill.

tmakinen · Nov 22, 2008, 10:02 AM // 10:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riotgear

I'm still wondering if it would be possible to repeatedly win by just creating some turtle group just to distract the entire enemy team that refuses to ever give up a kill.

This necessarily leads to the question whether only Luxons are allowed to turtle and Kurzicks must stick to juggernaut tactics

Stalling is always a good tactic when you are already in a winning position, and since you start in a winning position on shallow and deep defend maps you will win those just by turtling and matching enemy movement 1-on-1 so that they are unable to capture anything.

General turtling over a shrine is not feasible since even if the combined forces of the enemy would be insufficient to drill through your layers of defense they will convert the shrine by sheer numerical advantage.

Bobby2 · Nov 22, 2008, 06:48 PM // 18:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmakinen

General turtling over a shrine is not feasible since even if the combined forces of the enemy would be insufficient to drill through your layers of defense they will convert the shrine by sheer numerical advantage.

Not entirely true. If your team pushes agressively, ranged enemy players often won't risk their hide actually moving into shrine range.

Kumlekar · Nov 22, 2008, 11:19 PM // 23:19

I disagree with #14. holding the center is situational. The problem with it is how much energy this can take. If you expecnd all your energy at that one shrine, you'll lose the shrines behind you. If the other team holds it, you just keep the fight there. Have one group of four continulally pressuring it, and they'll often over react sending 6-10 people to guard that one shrine. In this situation you have room for 4-8 people to continue capping behind them with maybe 1-2 splitting off to play defense.

Thats not to say don't cap the center, but its very very easy to do so at the expense of other shrines. Treat it as a target of oppurtuinity and a choke point, not a method of attack.

erk · Nov 23, 2008, 02:57 AM // 02:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

The secret to succes in AB regardless of which map your on:

4. In the land of the dead the team that controls the rez shrine is KING! Why you might ask? Its just another shrine...No!. Its the heart of the map, which gives easy and fast access to all shrines; and you dont waste time gettting to the where the action is/ where your need to be if killed, when controling the rez shrine. Starting from base=a waste of capping time! This is why teams that run in circles on the map while capping most of the time loose the match! Remember the fastest point between shrines is a straight line. Running in circles will get you nowhere!

Um I think you better have a look at your maps again, every map except Saltspray offers a distance advantage to the home team if they base res instead of the res shrine.

So your generalization depends on which shrines need capping at any given time, and that will determine if res capping is worth the fight.

Krill · Nov 23, 2008, 04:42 AM // 04:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by erk

Um I think you better have a look at your maps again, every map except Saltspray offers a distance advantage to the home team if they base res instead of the res shrine.

I believe the OP was (mostly right).

Let's say you're a Luxon atttacking on Grenz and Ancestral (turn it around for Kurz attacking on Keys and Canyon), here's some highly technical diagrams (paint ftw):

From the rez shrine on Grenz you have choice of where you want to go, any shrine is fairly accessible and you have a clear view of where kurz players are, making the decision easier.

From the base you have the choice of two shrines that are hard to cap without a full team or a nuker (warrior and ele) or the attack point where there is always a kurz mob if you're being pushed back.

From the rez shrine(s) on Ancestral you have a choice of either capping center equip and from there pushing into kurz base or the other rez shrine, or making the long march down to the east equipment shrines.

From the base you can cap either east equip shrine and from there pushing into kurz base or making the long march up to the bridge.

Of course there are tons of variables, especially if the rez shrine is being mobbed in a slog-out that favors the side with more shrines capped, but generally it a huge advantage to control the rez shrine(s).

Not even going to get into Saltspray because it's way too random and the better bridge mob wins 90% of the time unless you have a really good team that can split and take the rez shrine the opposing team controls killing stragglers along the way quickly.

turbo234 · Nov 25, 2008, 08:45 PM // 20:45

^^haha thank you john madden^^