Curse

IMMORTAlMITCH · Jan 30, 2009, 08:52 AM // 08:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by valence

the skills are not the problem, fc itself is. fc not working on any non-mesmer skill with casting time of 1 or below would be a nice fix.

I'd say steam doing ~90 damage for 5e 1s and also being a defensive skill because it blinds makes it a little over the top, tone the damage down to 60-70ish and it's fine.

I do agree that fastcasting is the bigger issue with this template however.

Burton2000 · Jan 30, 2009, 04:20 PM // 16:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by IMMORTAlMITCH

I'd say steam doing ~90 damage for 5e 1s and also being a defensive skill because it blinds makes it a little over the top, tone the damage down to 60-70ish and it's fine.

I do agree that fastcasting is the bigger issue with this template however.

Why should steam do damage at all? Compared to blind flash the skill is 10 energy cheaper and has a longer blind duration and is in a better attribute line.

urania · Jan 30, 2009, 04:26 PM // 16:26

and u need another skill to meet the condition for it to blind at all.

Greedy Gus · Jan 30, 2009, 04:49 PM // 16:49

Steam is just boring design currently. The damage ranges should be swapped so that the conditional damage is the lower one (or nonexistant as mentioned). Then at least there is some skill involved in getting your tempo right between defensive blinding and spike contributions. Then you can tweak the strength of the skill as well as how good glyph immolation is, but get the design right first.

Burton2000 · Jan 30, 2009, 10:27 PM // 22:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

and u need another skill to meet the condition for it to blind at all.

Yeah but that condition is so easy to meet that its not even relevant really.

Sk8tborderx · Jan 30, 2009, 11:08 PM // 23:08

Why not just change how glyph of immolation works so it causes the burning after steam hits instead of before?

There are obviously other problems with the FC water mesmer, but the synergy with glyph of immolation and steam is the biggest issue imo.

Byron · Feb 01, 2009, 05:32 AM // 05:32

The blind for steam is fine imho; agreed with Mitch on the damage nerf.

@ Angra

Interrupts are cheap and easy enough in this meta to make fast casting as appealing as its been.

Animate · Feb 01, 2009, 11:53 PM // 23:53

this is going into the wrong direction
you need fastcast because interrupts are overpowered
even on the me/e it is still easy to dshot the 1sec glyph

this is the result of blinding surge being nerfed 5(?) times
ineptitude mesmers, steam me/e, prot me/mo
what's next? ash blast mesmers?

as seen by one of the last updates in that glowing ice etc were changed, anet is overwhelmed with understanding why people take mesmers over eles and think that forcing eles to put more points into their useless primary attribute would make them more attractive

while eles are the clunkiest class to play, who can blame people for taking mesmers

you will always whine about the situation, there is some form of defense needed, and if you nerf steam, there will be something else

and what awowa says is bullshit, of course during GWWC/GWFC every team had heal party/extinguish/aegis, but for the flagrunner himself, blinding flash with occasional healing breeze were the only defense
that flagrunner was very clunky, fragile and easy to shutdown, spikes were never the only way to achieve kills back then.... wtf

IMMORTAlMITCH · Feb 02, 2009, 01:37 PM // 13:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Animate

this is going into the wrong direction
you need fastcast because interrupts are overpowered
even on the me/e it is still easy to dshot the 1sec glyph

PBlock is the only interrupt that can be even remotely considered as 'overpowered', people got away just fine with BSurge eles and Water eles when PLeak was 12-15r and had a bigger energy loss.

People run fastcasting because not having to worry about interrupts > getting interrupted every now and then, especially when you basically lose nothing by going Me/X.

Quote:

this is the result of blinding surge being nerfed 5(?) times

BSurge is the best it's been since it got changed to 10 energy atm.

Quote:

you will always whine about the situation, there is some form of defense needed, and if you nerf steam, there will be something else

BSurge is right there, more options would be nice though, I'd even say old ward against melee would be fine if it wasnt for Me/E and Glyph/Mantra of Concentration.

The problem with the static defense was (apart from concentration skills and fastcasting) mostly based around VoD and the inevitable confrontation at the flagstand, now wit VoD gone this would be a lot less of an issue.

Anyway, the point of this thread was adressing highly defensive builds being able to put out crazy spike damage, this needs to be looked at so stop derailing the thread!

Kaon · Feb 02, 2009, 05:19 PM // 17:19

DON'T NERF STEAM!!!

It is the core skill of a byob shatterstone elementalist. Nerfing this skill would be a very hard nerf to byob.

Krill · Feb 02, 2009, 05:32 PM // 17:32

Does anyone know if Izzy is attempting a proper update this month that actually begins to address these issues, or is just going to be the usual slap on the wrist to a few skills and three random buffs?

Reverend Dr · Feb 02, 2009, 10:43 PM // 22:43

Have we had a proper update since Nightfall?

This is what I ask myself whenever I start getting optimistic about future updates.

kosh · Feb 03, 2009, 06:28 AM // 06:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaon

DON'T NERF STEAM!!!

It is the core skill of a byob shatterstone elementalist. Nerfing this skill would be a very hard nerf to byob.

lol kaon, long time, no post...

i think ppl are will not notice your sarcastic tone ^^

Kumlekar · Feb 04, 2009, 08:13 AM // 08:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy Gus

Steam is just boring design currently. The damage ranges should be swapped so that the conditional damage is the lower one (or nonexistant as mentioned). Then at least there is some skill involved in getting your tempo right between defensive blinding and spike contributions. Then you can tweak the strength of the skill as well as how good glyph immolation is, but get the design right first.

Wow, I love that idea, would be an interesting change to the bar.

Seamus Finn · Feb 05, 2009, 06:01 AM // 06:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by IMMORTAlMITCH

PBlock is the only interrupt that can be even remotely considered as 'overpowered', people got away just fine with BSurge eles and Water eles when PLeak was 12-15r and had a bigger energy loss.

I would say dshot is "overpowered", particularly since IAS and Read the wind got so good on rangers. Cutting down flight time, increasing range and lowering attack speed on dshot makes it far too good, and these are skill choices that make everything else about the character good, not just to make a single skill viable(steam).

I also think this character counters dom mesmers way too hard. Usually, when builds were able to bring a lot of raw damage and defense, they couldn't do a lot about shutdown, particularly dom mesmers. While rangers always crapped all over dom mesmers, the situation has actually gotten worse.

IMMORTAlMITCH · Feb 05, 2009, 07:21 AM // 07:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seamus Finn

I would say dshot is "overpowered", particularly since IAS and Read the wind got so good on rangers. Cutting down flight time, increasing range and lowering attack speed on dshot makes it far too good, and these are skill choices that make everything else about the character good, not just to make a single skill viable(steam).

I also think this character counters dom mesmers way too hard. Usually, when builds were able to bring a lot of raw damage and defense, they couldn't do a lot about shutdown, particularly dom mesmers. While rangers always crapped all over dom mesmers, the situation has actually gotten worse.

This is not a problem with dshot, but mostly with the (spike)damage potential of turret rangers.

Edwards · Feb 05, 2009, 07:45 AM // 07:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seamus Finn

I would say dshot is "overpowered", particularly since IAS and Read the wind got so good on rangers. Cutting down flight time, increasing range and lowering attack speed on dshot makes it far too good, and these are skill choices that make everything else about the character good, not just to make a single skill viable(steam).

So fix Flail and RtW?

Tamuril elansar · Feb 05, 2009, 07:55 AM // 07:55

RtW isn't really the problem, the problem is that you can quickly follow up burning arrow because hunters shot has 1 sec activation time.

IMMORTAlMITCH · Feb 05, 2009, 11:10 AM // 11:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tamuril elansar

RtW isn't really the problem, the problem is that you can quickly follow up burning arrow because hunters shot has 1 sec activation time.

RtW is a problem as it makes flatbows broken.

Kaon · Feb 05, 2009, 11:34 AM // 11:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by kosh

lol kaon, long time, no post...

i think ppl are will not notice your sarcastic tone ^^

It's because whenever i post one it gets deleted or i get banned for no reason at all. Guru is a pile of flaming shit with nazi moderators where you aren't allowed to voice your opinion, anyone who ever truely did so got banned already. I'm suprised i didn't get permabanned. Wanna bet this post gets deleted as well?

OT:

The game is almost perfect right now, there is barely anything wrong, any skill update is very likely to make the game worse, just like most of the skillupdates in the past did. Of course there's room for improvement but don't count on it.

On RtW and rangers: Over a year ago a turret ranger was something unheard of (unless you count the quickshot era) noone ever ran one. I had this awesome turretbuild for AB. Then izzy had his retardspasms again and he decided turrets are gud. He buffed a lot of attacks to 1s activation time. Later on he nerfed some of them again but instead of nerfing them properly back to their old state, he nerfed them to destruction, screwing over a lot of players. Now i can never play my supercool AB ranger build again. My point: Just nerf the ranger skills back to what they USED to be. Old penetrating, old huntershot, old burning arrow.

Valiantly awaiting ban and post deletion ~ Kaon.