Curse

Snow Bunny · Feb 12, 2009, 07:47 PM // 19:47

I was looking over some builds from '06 and early '07, many of which are certainly more fun to play than the crap from today's meta.

I recall Axiom running a [psychic distraction] flagger bar, which he said was pretty fun to run. Anyone remember that build?

Icy The Mage · Feb 12, 2009, 11:33 PM // 23:33

Oh wow, I'd appreciate seeing this build as well

I Jonas I · Feb 12, 2009, 11:50 PM // 23:50

A mesmer flag runner wouldn't have a lot of the utility skills that are generally required in a normal flag running bar. Not a lot of survivability, no party heals, no snare, etc.

dies like fish · Feb 13, 2009, 12:56 AM // 00:56

[build prof=Me/A][Energy Surge][Energy Burn][Unnatural Signet][Shatter Enchantment][Caltrops][Shadow Refuge][Dark Escape][Dash][/build]

This was fun, too.

Snow Bunny · Feb 13, 2009, 05:10 AM // 05:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonas The Keen

A mesmer flag runner wouldn't have a lot of the utility skills that are generally required in a normal flag running bar. Not a lot of survivability, no party heals, no snare, etc.

The whole point would be for fun, and PD matched it perfectly. I remember him saying how Rangers would get cripshot and apply PD'd.

The build that DiesLikeFish is an old favorite of mine, but I want to know the original PD build.

You could get a bit of simple survivability from the assassin line with [feigned neutrality], [caltrops], and [signet of malice]. PD just turns a flagger from frantic strategic job to something fun

romO · Feb 13, 2009, 06:27 AM // 06:27

I can't quite recall the exact bar that he ran, either. However, if you PM him on the QQ forums, I'm sure he'd be happy to tell you.
(The only thing that I remember being on there was blackout)

Also, to think that this kind of flagger wouldn't work in the current meta is a bit ridiculous. It most definetely could still be effective. Running the exact same bar? I doubt it. Would any team be able to execute it effectively? Probably not. But that doesn't make it any less good.

Divinus Stella · Feb 13, 2009, 09:22 AM // 09:22

If you want some thats really fun to play but utterly useless you could play a beastmaster mindshock ele with bestial mauling.

I think PD flagger is one of those things that people run on obs to look cool when they know they are facing clueless pve players.

IMMORTAlMITCH · Feb 13, 2009, 10:06 AM // 10:06

The problem with running such a flagrunner is that it puts a lot of responsibilities on the midline, you will pretty much have to run at least a PwK and a weapon of warding on a midliner and then you'll still lack recup and a potential 2nd PwK.

Apart from that your flagger doesn't contribute anything to the main team while he's running flags, and in this meta of uber speedboosts (read: Primal Express warriors) it's pretty easy to flag quickly keeping the pd mesmer ferrying flags and limiting the opportunities to do a strong push to a minimum.

That being said, it's quite a fun build to play, but I very much doubt it will be effective in the current meta.

Keira Nightgale · Feb 13, 2009, 06:57 PM // 18:57

Just thinking about a Me/D flagger, wouldn't that be passable enough? Even if it's still far from the usefulness a Rt or a Mo flagger would have.

Robster Lobster · Feb 14, 2009, 01:55 AM // 01:55

I remember there being a PD flagger with:

Psychic Distraction
Blackout
Gale
Diversion
Shatter Enchantment
Glyph of Lesser Energy
Storm Djinn's Haste

I can't remember the last skill, but Drain Enchantment could fit quite nicely on there now. I pretty much agree with everything Mitch said though.

Seamus Finn · Feb 14, 2009, 09:24 AM // 09:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robster Lobster

I remember there being a PD flagger with:

Psychic Distraction
Blackout
Gale
Diversion
Shatter Enchantment
Glyph of Lesser Energy
Storm Djinn's Haste

I can't remember the last skill, but Drain Enchantment could fit quite nicely on there now. I pretty much agree with everything Mitch said though.

I remember axiom taking sin skills but thats basically what we ran in RIP, sometimes taking shatter hex, eburn or some other random skill in the last slot. Not having party heals and all that is a fair enough critique, but I always laughed at the players that thought the flagger was a character "just waiting to be ganked." and things to that effect.

IMMORTAlMITCH · Feb 14, 2009, 10:31 AM // 10:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seamus Finn

I always laughed at the players that thought the flagger was a character "just waiting to be ganked." and things to that effect.

That might have been true back then, now there's Primal Express Warriors and Melandru's Shot Rangers.

Seamus Finn · Feb 15, 2009, 06:02 AM // 06:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by IMMORTAlMITCH

That might have been true back then, now there's Primal Express Warriors and Melandru's Shot Rangers.

The situation shoudnt be much different. The wars are still owned enough by gale/blackout and you can pd any ranger attack or preps. Maybe the extra points in marksmenship could mean something, but at the end of the day, if a ranger and warrior pushed way up on your flagger he could have warding and semi-monk skills or offensive shutdown skills and should be just as dead either way with the stand team having screwed up royally.

At the time we ran it the only thing the flagger couldn't handle that monk type flaggers could was base turtling.

IMMORTAlMITCH · Feb 15, 2009, 09:41 AM // 09:41

A Primal rage warrior will catch you despite gale and kill you despite blackout, I'm not sure if you can PD Melandru's Shot but it definitely won't be as easy as PDing Cripshot was.

Phe Belladona · Feb 15, 2009, 02:21 PM // 14:21

if fighting a ranger it would have at least one 1sec activation attack skill (which is a lie because it doesnt take 1 second to activate it..) or/and 33% faster attack speed and that would destroy the mesmer as its PD defense wont be there. amusing and fun vs bad ppl but ppl who even just run basic meta builds and are still bad would prolly kill this flagger, also guild lords die to being sneezed on these days so unless the main team is babysitting the base all game you could be in serious trouble from the most minor of splitting.

i remember seeing this tho and was nice to see it again

romO · Feb 15, 2009, 07:15 PM // 19:15

This is a pretty silly discussion. I can't think of a time when a flagger should be 1v1 versus a warrior or ranger or solo defending a base.

Gurufied summary: teamwork.

IMMORTAlMITCH · Feb 15, 2009, 07:59 PM // 19:59

Yeah, pushing flaggers is really unheard of..

romO · Feb 16, 2009, 01:22 AM // 01:22

I don't see the connection between 'pushing flagger' and '1v1 versus warrior or ranger'.

Seamus Finn · Feb 16, 2009, 05:25 AM // 05:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by romO

I don't see the connection between 'pushing flagger' and '1v1 versus warrior or ranger'.

While I generally agree with what you are saying, I think any flagger build should offer a reasonable window where he can survive against one or two guys so that help can arrive before 15 dp does. When I say window, I am talking 10 seconds minimum to maybe 30 seconds, because fact is, this game is all about screw ups. Teams are screwing up every minute of every game so if you don't pad at least a little for it...

As for the comments about lord damage and splits harming this runner, to be honest, this kind of runner works wonders for splits and counter splits, but you can't do the whole "oh hey guys, there are 2 people in the base, they ran off from the flag stand while you ignored them, so I'll just deal with it while someone else runs a flag." thing. Since the majority of splitting breaks off of flag stand groups, I never understood why stand teams just wouldn't shadow splitting characters anyhow.

TrippieHippie89 · Mar 02, 2009, 03:58 PM // 15:58

if you want fun on a mesmer i go with

Crip Anguish
Auspicius Incantation
Conjure Nightmare
Clumsiness
Wandering Eye
Cry of Frustration
Distortion
Dash

Does a pretty handy job at dropping the standard rit flagger(degen, degen, degen, interupt wow, pwk) and destroys any melee class sent to deal with you

as for flagging on balanced team? no
byob? abso-kitten-lutely