Curse

moriz · Apr 10, 2009, 10:52 PM // 22:52

heavy blow is generally not worth it. it doesn't spike as hard as fierce blow, and requires weakness unlike hammer bash.

Lux Aeterna · Apr 12, 2009, 04:28 PM // 16:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by isildorbiafra

Regarding your question my answer is YES I CAN!

I honestly don't believe you on that.

You're better than some, but still fairly gimped in the offense department.
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Also I tried [heavy blow] and liked it, normally i like [hammer bash] because you can use it on a non-weakened target, but I've been learning that it's better to save up 4-5 pts of adrenaline for another dev rather than blow it by starting with bash after you use dev on a different target.

Unless it's a sin and somebody needs linebacking FAST in which case you want either shock or bash.

New topic: using [axe twist] as a [body blow] subsitute on builds with [dismember].

Pros: usable along with all your 5 adrenaline stuff, slightly less damage but more spammable. Weakness is a huge and great melee shutdown which forces monks to remove conditions if they want their melee to kill anything.

Cons: slightly less damage (19 vs. 36), not looking exactly like everyone else.

isildorbiafra · Apr 12, 2009, 04:36 PM // 16:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lux Aeterna

I honestly don't believe you on that.

You're better than some, but still fairly gimped in the offense department.

Let me rephrase that....depends on how good the palm sin is.

Lux Aeterna · Apr 13, 2009, 12:44 AM // 00:44

How about... can you see your ele being chased by a W/A, catch up with a sprint, teleport down a cliff, bull's strike the W/A while still in enraging charge, and save your ele ?

Meh he got her but barely (2 more adren for dev and i'd have saved her), then I killed him immediately after .... made her get 600hp after the round.

Snow Bunny · Apr 13, 2009, 01:26 AM // 01:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lux Aeterna

New topic: using [axe twist] as a [body blow] subsitute on builds with [dismember].

body blow is used with dismember instead of exec's with evis.

warrior bars, like monk bars, are fairly cramped and have very little room for tweaking.

Lux Aeterna · Apr 13, 2009, 02:15 AM // 02:15

This is on a primal rage or possibly battlerage if I can ever make that work, I actually like exec on eviscerate since I try to only use the attacks together as a spike, therefore one of them being 7 adren doesn't matter (but I don't like eviscerate anyway).

The point of axe twist is that it's a melee shutdown when linebacking, as well as a finisher at a lower adrenaline cost + condition pressure. In AB the target is very often dead or at 40hp by the time body blow is charged, 5 adren means I can unload it along with 3 other attacks. Often I find that with 7-8 adren attacks I feel like I can barely use them, their use is out of synch with the 5-6 adrens rather than being always there. Maybe WE has just spoiled me but even with that I end up spam clicking the power attack / protectors buttons waiting for their oh so long recharges.

Essentially, playing hammer so much has made it hard for me to operate without inflicting weakness (a very strong condition) as well as teleporting.

Hugh Manatee · Apr 22, 2009, 12:30 AM // 00:30

I used to like [Axe Rake] before they nerfed eviscerate's damage and introduced crit chop and agonizing chop. After a shock>evis>rake, they'd usually try to run, then you get an easy bull strike and a cover for DW. [Agonizing chop] might be better, the interrupt can hit all professions if you time it right, the 1 sec activate can compress damage, 6a cost, it's just a creamy skill all around.

Something I used to have fun with, [Rage of the Ntouka], combined with enraged charge can power the cheap axe attacks damn near forever, it's almost like what the WE can do with power attack, you can live in flail or rush, double or triple pop lions, unload your spike on a guy, RotN, unload on another immediately or sustain the assault.

Quote:

But even without a load of defensive skills, I can still make it out of most situations with rush.....Anyway: defensive melee builds is useless or worse.

The problem is then what? You're away, no monk or rit support, all by yourself, and the elite ele shrine is wide open, what now? My warrior marches right up to it and kicks it's ass while my guys respawn and meet me there dunno what yours does. Defy Pain is defense that facilitates offense, can't kill stuff if you're dead. I'm not advocating putting defy, dolyak sig 5 blocking stances and heal sig on your bar, it's just that defy is pre-nerf sup absorption rune, pre nerf knights insigs, sentinal's and brawlers+10al insigs, survivor insigs+sup vigor and vitae runes in 1 skill, the whole rest of your bar is offense and utility. With defy I can march up to a monk hiding in a mine or guard post on JQ, kick it's ass while my team nukes the point.

Quote:

A question for you: can you kill a palm sin before a palm sin can kill a 450hp ele ?

Like I said, only thing stopping a warrior from whacking an assassin is crit defenses, rend that, deep wound then agonizing and his chain is messed up and you can slay it at your leisure.

Wish Swiftdeath · Apr 22, 2009, 12:38 AM // 00:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee

I used to like [Axe Rake] before they nerfed eviscerate's damage and introduced crit chop and agonizing chop. After a shock>evis>rake, they'd usually try to run, then you get an easy bull strike and a cover for DW. [Agonizing chop] might be better, the interrupt can hit all professions if you time it right, the 1 sec activate can compress damage, 6a cost, it's just a creamy skill all around.

Something I used to have fun with, [Rage of the Ntouka], combined with enraged charge can power the cheap axe attacks damn near forever, it's almost like what the WE can do with power attack, you can live in flail or rush, double or triple pop lions, unload your spike on a guy, RotN, unload on another immediately or sustain the assault.

The problem is then what? You're away, no monk or rit support, all by yourself, and the elite ele shrine is wide open, what now? My warrior marches right up to it and kicks it's ass while my guys respawn and meet me there dunno what yours does. Defy Pain is defense that facilitates offense, can't kill stuff if you're dead. I'm not advocating putting defy, dolyak sig 5 blocking stances and heal sig on your bar, it's just that defy is pre-nerf sup absorption rune, pre nerf knights insigs, sentinal's and brawlers+10al insigs, survivor insigs+sup vigor and vitae runes in 1 skill, the whole rest of your bar is offense and utility. With defy I can march up to a monk hiding in a mine or guard post on JQ, kick it's ass while my team nukes the point.

Like I said, only thing stopping a warrior from whacking an assassin is crit defenses, rend that, deep wound then agonizing and his chain is messed up and you can slay it at your leisure.

Think how long it will take you to cap that shrine? (if you do) Then there is the likely factor of your teammates getting wiped again 3v4. If there is no monk/rit support i tend to move towards the ressurection shrine unless its on the other edge of the map, in which case i follow a group temporarily and help them cap till my team respawns.

Lux Aeterna · Apr 22, 2009, 02:21 AM // 02:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee

The problem is then what? You're away, no monk or rit support, all by yourself, and the elite ele shrine is wide open, what now? My warrior marches right up to it and kicks it's ass while my guys respawn and meet me there dunno what yours does. Defy Pain is defense that facilitates offense, can't kill stuff if you're dead.

I'd rather build to kill a caster in 5-6 hits.

The above situation of ending up alone after a team wipe rarely happens to me: I lead my team well, so it takes 2-3 enemy groups being aggressive to trap and wipe us, additionally I pick a strong team so we don't usually lose 4v4.

If my team is busy capping, I'll split and do recon as well as pressing U to find out where we need to cap / where is safe / the location of our allies.

In a situation where my team dies and I'm the only one left (which is becoming increasingly rare), I'll simply team up with other red dots and aid them until I can rejoin my group.

If the situation is so bad that not only did your whole team die, but there are no other red dots, being able to solocap the elite ele shrine will not help.

There's more to the game than whether your elite skill gives you extra HP.