Curse

The Blade From Hell · Dec 17, 2008, 09:11 AM // 09:11

Erm.. Primal Rage was never about bar compression and having more skills in your bar, its the fact that doing both rush and frenzy at the same time alnmost doubles the damage, making it a high pressure skill and thus making it strong 8v8. Its perfect for landing bulls and also moves faster than rush for catching players on a split. The utility of primal rage is extremely high and thats why it sees play in top guilds, becasuse mose top ranked play is about utility and movement, aside from double champ weekends. The problem happens when people see top players run it and copy it without knowing why its used and then those others who think theyve discorvered the weak link of primal rage while the top players havent so they think they did a very smart thing. Whoever says primal rage is bad doesnt know jack shit bout warrior lol.

Marxon Aurion · Dec 17, 2008, 01:41 PM // 13:41

There's no doubt it's a good skill, but the thing is: is it worth your elite slot?

phan · Dec 17, 2008, 02:34 PM // 14:34

Primal rage is the new avarre

zelgadissan · Dec 17, 2008, 02:50 PM // 14:50

I have a bad habit of yelling "RAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGE" over my Vent whenever I hit this skill. My guildies are getting pretty annoyed.

Also, this skill is amazing and anybody saying otherwise is baed. If Endurance ever gets nerfed, this will be the only elite run on axes and potentially even swords.

Zabe · Dec 17, 2008, 03:10 PM // 15:10

Be brave and run disciplined stance as cancel stance for PR.

Barkeep · Dec 17, 2008, 03:29 PM // 15:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by zelgadissan

Also, this skill is amazing and anybody saying otherwise is baed.

Wow.. you must be amazing to know who is baed and who is not.. Good arguments too. Yes.. very impressive.

Our warriors fell in love with primal rage. I do not play warrior that much, so I cannot really go into the details of it. But according to them you save out loads of energy because of primal rage. Build up adrenaline much faster. Get easier KDs with bulls strike, and even good kiting only makes them laugh.

now consider what you lose.. 21(?) extra damage on the spike.

Personally I get the feeling Izzy is trying to make it easier to play warrior. Because of PR it's not an achievement anymore to deal with kiting targets or to make every bulls strike hit.

Tyla · Dec 17, 2008, 03:43 PM // 15:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep

Personally I get the feeling Izzy is trying to make it easier to play warrior. Because of PR it's not an achievement anymore to deal with kiting targets or to make every bulls strike hit.

The game has been dumbed down to a stupid level for the most part. ANet just aren't getting the picture, or are being lazy in that field.

phan · Dec 17, 2008, 03:46 PM // 15:46

Be a man ; use frenzy as a cancel stance for primal rage

Ragnorak · Dec 17, 2008, 03:52 PM // 15:52

I love it. And for some reason I am much less likely to be spiked out while using it

. I guess people just haven't registered what it actually does yet, whereas with Frenzy, people scream to kill you instantly.

zelgadissan · Dec 17, 2008, 04:23 PM // 16:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep

Wow.. you must be amazing to know who is baed and who is not.. Good arguments too. Yes.. very impressive.

Do I really have to explain why it's amazing when 90% of the people in the thread already have?

Dickery aside, I agree with you in that this makes playing warrior insanely easier, and Tyla's right on in that Anet's basically trying to make everything explode. *warning, more personal stuff* I'm an awful warrior - I'm a noob at Chizu dancing - and this skill turns me into a serious threat when I'm landing every Bull's, constantly able to unleash spikes, and kiting is irrelevant. PR alone practically makes up for my lack of personal skill. I haven't obs'd much since the update but I can't imagine what someone like Polly or Chop Chop can do with it.

My point (and I think yours too from the last paragraph) is that it makes bad warriors like me somewhat respectable - which means that the ones who think it's an awful skill are really bad.

Edit: I also agree with Echoman below me, I'd prefer stuff that doesn't make the game mindless - but while it's there it almost has to be used to stay competitive.

Ec]-[oMaN · Dec 17, 2008, 04:29 PM // 16:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by zelgadissan

My point (and I think yours too from the last paragraph) is that it makes bad warriors like me somewhat respectable - which means that the ones who think it's an awful skill are really bad.

Or some just think it's bad for the game, not really the skill itself being a poor choice of a skill. That ship has sunk though with the recent balance updates and lack of an actual balancing of skills...

Lorekeeper · Dec 17, 2008, 04:48 PM // 16:48

on a side note

the first time I played in a team with someone using primal rage, i freaked out when they used it for the first time. The sound effect reminded me of the monster in Cloverfield... i was like "WTF?! Did you guys hear that too!?"

its quite an apt sound effect for its name. Frenzy's sound effect on the other hand leaves much to be desired!

Shendaar · Dec 17, 2008, 04:57 PM // 16:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ec]-[oMaN

Or some just think it's bad for the game, not really the skill itself being a poor choice of a skill. That ship has sunk though with the recent balance updates and lack of an actual balancing of skills...

Skill balancing ... more like Skill de-balancing. If I was on a quest to destroy GW PvP, I would probably come up with skill updates similar to what we just got. The worse thing is PR isn't even that bad(for the game) when compared to crap like Warrior's Endurance.

ac1inferno · Dec 17, 2008, 05:45 PM // 17:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

@ac1inferno
u clearly kno nuthin bout warriors

rush is not only used to cancel frenzy when under attack
theres this thing called kiting

primal rage has very little to do bout freein up slots on ur skill bar
and everything to do wit being able to have a simultaneous ias+ims 33%

most ims' r 25%, including rush
considering 33% is the fastest ims u can get except for dash
this is pretty important

an extra 30dmg on from eviscerate almost seems neglible
compared to the amount of dmg u can output wit primal rage
(not to mention bein able to use it as an ims outside of battle can come in handy)

the only advantage eviscerate has is because this game is quite heavily spike-based

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shendaar

ac1inferno, you obviously have no idea how to play warrior.

I don't know why people keep looking at PR like a bar compression skill when it isn't. PR is better frenzy that can double as a energy based run stance when out of danger.

I lose a whooping +29 damage on my spikes by taking PR over Evis. I think the advantage of a speed buff with frenzy is a good tradeoff.

I'm not saying it's about bar compression. The problem is that it's not. It can't even save you from bringing [[Sprint]/[[Rush]. You wouldn't be doing more damage with [[Primal Rage] than [[Eviscerate]. The second someone sees you, you're going to have to cancel Primal Rage, so that movement buff is not worth the Elite. Speed boost is quite for nothing since you will need to cancel it anyway. Sprint would work better for an energy based run stance when out of danger, and it doesn't even take up your elite slot. And because you're taking a cancel stance anyway, you would barely be able to tell the difference between [[Frenzy]+Rush and Primal Rage+Rush (for example) if you've played a Warrior for a while. Seeing as you will have to bring a cancel stance for Primal Rage anyways, it would replace your Frenzy, meaning you just lost your attack Elite, so you would have to replace that, it didn't give you an extra skill slot, just a wasted Elite.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoxBat

It's alright to maintain that it's "bad", but it's funny to say "it won't see usage" when you look on obs. I have yet to even spot Eviscerate anymore.

Hitting kiting stuff in IAS+IMS is powerful pressure and fast adrenaline building. Not only do you get more crits, your attacks finish faster, so you catch up to them faster and hit more. See [Rampage As One], [Heart of Fury][Signet of Mystic Speed].

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

rao is 33%/25%
pr is 33%/33%

all the more reason to think that pr is ftw

Testing is not serious usage. The second someone sees you, you're going to have to cancel Primal Rage so it's is not worth the Elite. You don't have to cancel [[Rampage As One].

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kumlekar

I would have thought the use of this skill would have been obvious. If you're frenzy, and the person kites, you have two choices (assuming your staying on the same target): keep following in frenzy, or hit rush and lose the 33% boost. Primal rage removes this choice. It fills both roles, and rush is then only used as a cancel for PR.

You have many choices, but your best choice is to hit [[Rush] and land a [[Bull's Strike], activate [[Frenzy] again and build up the adrenaline for Rush again. Shouldn't be that hard. And because you're taking a cancel stance anyway, you would barely be able to tell the difference between Frenzy+Rush and [[Primal Rage]+Rush (for example) if you've played a Warrior for a while.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend Dr

Its hard to really see how good it is right now. Obviously won't be used with hammer. Good on shock axe, but it is going to have to compete with warriors endurance. Would actually make sword worth bringing again, except that Hundred Blades also hitting your target makes it spike for so much more.

[sever artery][gash][sun and moon slash][bulls strike][shock][primal rage][rush][resurrection signet]

reminds me of one of the manlies warrior bars ever played

[sever artery][gash][final thrust][bulls strike][shock][charge][frenzy][resurrection signet]

Primal Rage would only be worth it for old sword builds, with Final Thrust as the "Elite" attack skill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

What are you talking about? If it was a non-elite, it would be frenzy with a lower recharge and a 33% IMS. If you think a non-elite 33% IAS is better than a 33% IAS and IMS, you're not that smart.

Which is why it's seeing usage now, right?

You get the same duration at 7 strength (I know, what warrior doesnt run strength? but still) it has the same recharge at 4 seconds. Any other profession requiring an IAS would choose [[Frenzy] over this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Blade From Hell

Erm.. Primal Rage was never about bar compression and having more skills in your bar, its the fact that doing both rush and frenzy at the same time alnmost doubles the damage, making it a high pressure skill and thus making it strong 8v8. Its perfect for landing bulls and also moves faster than rush for catching players on a split. The utility of primal rage is extremely high and thats why it sees play in top guilds, becasuse mose top ranked play is about utility and movement, aside from double champ weekends. The problem happens when people see top players run it and copy it without knowing why its used and then those others who think theyve discorvered the weak link of primal rage while the top players havent so they think they did a very smart thing. Whoever says primal rage is bad doesnt know jack shit bout warrior lol.

I'm not saying it's about bar compression. The problem is that it's not. It can't even save you from bringing [[Sprint]/[[Rush]. You wouldn't be doing more damage with [[Primal Rage]. The second someone sees you, you're going to have to cancel it. Speed boost is quite for nothing since you will need to cancel it anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ec]-[oMaN

Seeing as at least the euro meta has almost entirely moved to a lingering curse fast cast for midline d what threats would a warrior be worried about now? No more double dmg from FC waters and obviously decent warriors will see converges coming at them. Perfect time to run this elite.

It is only because of this that rawr can maintain [[Primal Rage] most of the time for constant pressure. If it wasn't, Primal Rage would not be on for the full duration.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ragnorak

I love it. And for some reason I am much less likely to be spiked out while using it

. I guess people just haven't registered what it actually does yet, whereas with Frenzy, people scream to kill you instantly.

You are lucky with it. [[Primal Rage] is simply an Elite [[Frenzy]. Having to bring a cancel stance to cancel your Elite is pretty bad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ec]-[oMaN

In my OP the reason why this Elite shines is, as a warrior you don't have to land a KD in order for your unload to be rather successful, also you can build adren faster without the KD as you just IMS the target instead while under an IAS, you are blessed with rush and frenzy at the same time. Seeing this occur has been very evident lately. I saw someone bring up the fact that landing bulls with PR was easier, yet I've seen the opposite on obs mode. Go figure. Baddies will still cue up bulls on their auto attack/target

It's not hard to land a knockdown with [[Bull's Strike]. You can all ready build adrenaline fast with a spear or by picking a target that wouldn't really kite (aka their frontline). The second someone sees you, you're going to have to cancel [[Primal Rage], so that movement buff is not worth the Elite. Speed boost is quite for nothing since you will need to cancel it anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marxon Aurion

There's no doubt it's a good skill, but the thing is: is it worth your elite slot?

It's not a good skill. It's a decent skill if it wasn't elite, but because it is, it's bad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep

Wow.. you must be amazing to know who is baed and who is not.. Good arguments too. Yes.. very impressive.

Our warriors fell in love with primal rage. I do not play warrior that much, so I cannot really go into the details of it. But according to them you save out loads of energy because of primal rage. Build up adrenaline much faster. Get easier KDs with bulls strike, and even good kiting only makes them laugh.

now consider what you lose.. 21(?) extra damage on the spike.

Personally I get the feeling Izzy is trying to make it easier to play warrior. Because of PR it's not an achievement anymore to deal with kiting targets or to make every bulls strike hit.

I don't see how [[Primal Rage] can save you energy. Using [[Rush] doesn't cost any, and you would be using Primal Rage just as much as [[Frenzy] since they both need to be canceled. It's not hard to build up adrenaline and to land knockdowns with [[Bull's Strike]. You wouldn't be doing more damage with Primal Rage so losing extra damage on the spike means a lot. The second someone sees you, you're going to have to cancel Primal Rage, so that movement buff is not worth the Elite. Speed boost is quite for nothing since you will need to cancel it anyway. So it doesn't help deal with kiting targets.

This skill is barely better than frenzy. Yes, you get a speed boost, you can use it out of combat all right, but in combat it's exactly the same as [[Frenzy], the speed boost is only a minor advantage, because yes, you'll catch up with kiters, but people will hit you. I don't know what PvP or GvG you're playing where people don't hit someone hard if they're using frenzy, but it certainly doesn't sound like you're fighting good teams. And the reason you've seen people using this effectively in GvG matches is because it's used by people who are good at playing Warrior anyway. It's basically like them going into the battle without an Elite. They know exactly how to use and when to cancel Frenzy so naturally, they know how and when to cancel this appalling skill. This is very well a bad skill, the speed boost means crap to me, your cancel stance is most likely a speed boost anyway so why? You want that crappy speed boost while attacking, when once you're being kited, you're gonna get hit, and have to cancel anyway? Also just to point out, the duration of this skill is not a factor at all. Its not likely you'll have this on the full duration anyway, unless you're an idiot with a death wish.

the savage nornbear · Dec 17, 2008, 05:46 PM // 17:46

I'm just gonna let ya'll know that the heroes over at the guildwiki have declared this skill is "lame"-I forget the anagram. I disagree, but I feel the information should be made known.

Kyp Jade · Dec 17, 2008, 05:48 PM // 17:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lorekeeper

on a side note

the first time I played in a team with someone using primal rage, i freaked out when they used it for the first time. The sound effect reminded me of the monster in Cloverfield... i was like "WTF?! Did you guys hear that too!?"

its quite an apt sound effect for its name. Frenzy's sound effect on the other hand leaves much to be desired!

OMG buff frenzy now

shoogi · Dec 17, 2008, 05:53 PM // 17:53

dude, they gave mesmers a lame tag, nothing beats that.

the savage nornbear · Dec 17, 2008, 06:03 PM // 18:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoogi

dude, they gave mesmers a lame tag, nothing beats that.

That's harsh.

Shendaar · Dec 17, 2008, 06:24 PM // 18:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by ac1inferno

This skill is barely better than frenzy. Yes, you get a speed boost, you can use it out of combat all right, but in combat it's exactly the same as [[Frenzy], the speed boost is only a minor advantage, because yes, you'll catch up with kiters, but people will hit you. I don't know what PvP or GvG you're playing where people don't hit someone hard if they're using frenzy, but it certainly doesn't sound like you're fighting good teams. And the reason you've seen people using this effectively in GvG matches is because it's used by people who are good at playing Warrior anyway. It's basically like them going into the battle without an Elite. They know exactly how to use and when to cancel Frenzy so naturally, they know how and when to cancel this appalling skill. This is very well a bad skill, the speed boost means crap to me, your cancel stance is most likely a speed boost anyway so why? You want that crappy speed boost while attacking, when once you're being kited, you're gonna get hit, and have to cancel anyway? Also just to point out, the duration of this skill is not a factor at all. Its not likely you'll have this on the full duration anyway, unless you're an idiot with a death wish.

I'm pretty sure I know exactly how and when to use frenzy buddy lol. Frenzy is a high risk/high reward type of skill and PR is the same but with a higher reward for the same risk. You make it sound like as soon as you hit frenzy or PR you have to cancel out which is completely retarded. People bring frenzy because they can actually use it and I'm pretty sure that if you can use Frenzy then you can also use PR just as much. The difference is PR remains useful against kiting targets so you don't have to cancel out to pursue unless you are taking damage.

Again, I don't think you know what you are talking about. I personally consider myself a very competent warrior and I think PR is worth taking over Evis. My experience with it so far confirms that the pros are well worth the cons(-29dmg lol) and I certainly don't seem to be the only one thinking the same.

Snow Bunny · Dec 17, 2008, 06:25 PM // 18:25

All of you shitting on this skill - RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO YOU.

This shit is awesome.