Curse

I Jonas I · Jun 20, 2009, 04:11 AM // 04:11

If someone doesn't give me their bar and their hit points (yes, HP is necessary to catch those idiots running sup runes) in 15 seconds when I'm pugging in AB they are getting kicked. I don't really give two shits about your contrived reasons why you don't want to just show me your skills. If you are a decent player you have nothing to hide and you would be willing to change your skills.

erk · Jun 21, 2009, 10:24 AM // 10:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonas The Keen

If someone doesn't give me their bar and their hit points (yes, HP is necessary to catch those idiots running sup runes) in 15 seconds when I'm pugging in AB they are getting kicked. I don't really give two shits about your contrived reasons why you don't want to just show me your skills. If you are a decent player you have nothing to hide and you would be willing to change your skills.

I'm the opposite, if someone asks me to ping I just leave the group. I am sick of spending 5-10min whist some retard, that just want's to fight, sorts out the perfect team only to get rolled game after game because they're clueless about movement and capping in AB. Too much HA/GvG/TA will do that. I consider my time too valuable for that rubbish. Most games I hardly even have a skirmish if I am playing well and capping fast enough.

bungusmaximus · Jun 25, 2009, 04:23 PM // 16:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by erk

I'm the opposite, if someone asks me to ping I just leave the group. I am sick of spending 5-10min whist some retard, that just want's to fight, sorts out the perfect team only to get rolled game after game because they're clueless about movement and capping in AB. Too much HA/GvG/TA will do that. I consider my time too valuable for that rubbish. Most games I hardly even have a skirmish if I am playing well and capping fast enough.

Grrrr, yeah like some TA balanced setup I joined, looked well, and fought like the best of them, but they got stuck in the same spot for the entire game fighting the same opposing TA balanced setup ALL the frigging time, those people happened to be about as good as we were. Teamleader however wanted to beat those guys no matter what without paying attention to the score/shrines.

I don't mind noobs being idiots but seasoned players should know better, especially when they spend tailoring a build for 15 minutes before going in.

But There's plenty of seasoned PvPers out there that know how to AB nicely. GvG-ers tend to be rather ok-ish at it. They're used to having much room and using it

Nadia Roark · Jun 25, 2009, 05:31 PM // 17:31

I don't always ask for pings, but if I do, it's to make sure some idiot isn't carrying a rez. You can pretty much run whatever build you want, as long as you have the presence of mind to stand near altars.

Bobby2 · Jun 25, 2009, 08:20 PM // 20:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

Teamleader however wanted to beat those guys no matter what without paying attention to the score/shrines.

Yeah... tends to be much more interesting than the actual outcome of the match.

Moloch Vein · Jun 25, 2009, 09:28 PM // 21:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by erk

I'm the opposite, if someone asks me to ping I just leave the group. I am sick of spending 5-10min whist some retard, that just want's to fight, sorts out the perfect team only to get rolled game after game because they're clueless about movement and capping in AB. Too much HA/GvG/TA will do that. I consider my time too valuable for that rubbish. Most games I hardly even have a skirmish if I am playing well and capping fast enough.

Oh yes, and how are we supposed to know you're such a God in the game? Ever thought about the fact that maybe the other people want to see what you run so they can see if it fits?

Seriously, that's weak.

Burst Cancel · Jun 26, 2009, 12:06 AM // 00:06

I especially love the off-handed remark that HA/GvG/TA make you bad at AB. You know what actually happens when those teams AB? They roll the enemy groups and cap where they please, because there isn't anyone on the map that can actually stop them.

Life Bringing · Jun 26, 2009, 12:19 AM // 00:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

I especially love the off-handed remark that HA/GvG/TA make you bad at AB. You know what actually happens when those teams AB? They roll the enemy groups and cap where they please, because there isn't anyone on the map that can actually stop them.

QFT.

Tbh, AB is a shitter arena. Almost everyone is absolutely terrible. When plaers who actually know how to play the game get together, they will obviously roll through it.

Arkantos · Jun 26, 2009, 12:29 AM // 00:29

There's nothing wrong with pinging your skillbar. What do you have to hide, a bad build? If someone asks you to ping, then ping. If they argue with you about your skillbar, simply leave. I always ask people to ping their health/skillbar, because I don't want to play with a wammo who has 430hp, frenzy with no cancel stance, dolyak signet, mending and healing hands.

Nadia Roark · Jun 26, 2009, 04:18 AM // 04:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

There's nothing wrong with pinging your skillbar. What do you have to hide, a bad build? If someone asks you to ping, then ping. If they argue with you about your skillbar, simply leave. I always ask people to ping their health/skillbar, because I don't want to play with a wammo who has 430hp, frenzy with no cancel stance, dolyak signet, mending and healing hands.

... and a rez sig

glacialphoenix · Jun 26, 2009, 04:33 AM // 04:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nadia Roark

and a rez sig

I've seen bars with Rebirth in AB. Thankfully, I saw them on some guy on the opposing team in the middle of battle, but my first thought was 'wtf was his team thinking?!'

Nadia Roark · Jun 26, 2009, 05:00 AM // 05:00

yeah, I see it very once in a while too.. I actually ran into a guy once who actually tried to defend his idiocy, by insisting that "rez sig is good in AB" in the face of all evidence and common sense.

bungusmaximus · Jun 26, 2009, 07:00 AM // 07:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Life Bringing

QFT.

Tbh, AB is a shitter arena. Almost everyone is absolutely terrible. When plaers who actually know how to play the game get together, they will obviously roll through it.

True, provided of course they aren't just joining for laughs and skirmishes, because then they're pretty much useless. Yesterday I pug-ed a warrior and a monk, none of them were very good at fighting (little damage, would blow up to pressure) but they understood how to move. We got rolled by some guild group once, after that we just avoided those guys and capped, and hence we won the match. It was funny because our opponents were better players then we were overall.

tmakinen · Jun 26, 2009, 08:41 AM // 08:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

I especially love the off-handed remark that HA/GvG/TA make you bad at AB. You know what actually happens when those teams AB? They roll the enemy groups and cap where they please, because there isn't anyone on the map that can actually stop them.

Good GvG players should find it easy to adjust to the slightly different requirements of AB since GvG maps have 3 or 4 focal points and some maps are fairly large. On the other hand, most RA/TA/HA tactics are essentially useless in AB. It's not so much that playing other game formats would make one bad. Rather than that, some of them have so little common ground that being skilled in one doesn't automatically make you competitive in another, and it may even be necessary to unlearn some tactics that worked in one format but that are counterproductive in another. In AB you can have a team which never loses a fight but still loses the match just because the opposite side can choose not to fight. AB is the GW game format with most strategic depth (and this has nothing to do with the overall skill level of players since it's inherent to game objectives), and thus players who are used to purely tactical game formats like RA/TA/HA may not initially fare too well despite being vastly superior on a purely tactical level.

bungusmaximus · Jun 26, 2009, 09:07 AM // 09:07

That and bambis that have been farming UW with lameway 24/7 are pretty terrible to begin with.

Burst Cancel · Jun 26, 2009, 12:47 PM // 12:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmakinen

Good GvG players should find it easy to adjust to the slightly different requirements of AB since GvG maps have 3 or 4 focal points and some maps are fairly large. On the other hand, most RA/TA/HA tactics are essentially useless in AB. It's not so much that playing other game formats would make one bad. Rather than that, some of them have so little common ground that being skilled in one doesn't automatically make you competitive in another, and it may even be necessary to unlearn some tactics that worked in one format but that are counterproductive in another. In AB you can have a team which never loses a fight but still loses the match just because the opposite side can choose not to fight. AB is the GW game format with most strategic depth (and this has nothing to do with the overall skill level of players since it's inherent to game objectives), and thus players who are used to purely tactical game formats like RA/TA/HA may not initially fare too well despite being vastly superior on a purely tactical level.

I have considered this position before; it lacks merit because AB is not a strictly 12v12 format - it is a 4-4-4v4-4-4 format. While the deep strategy of AB may be apparent on paper, almost none of it is applicable in practice due to the inability of either side to actually coordinate, control, or even predict the performance of each of their three teams. Put crudely, strategy in AB from any 4-man team's perspective is essentially limited to scanning the map to see where the rest of their side is going, and then going somewhere else. Further strategic understanding will help (e.g., prioritizing res shrines), but teams are ultimately limited to what they can accomplish with their own 4-man unit.

More importantly, the benefits of playing HA/GvG/TA are not limited to their field tactics (i.e., map control, team movement, etc.). Rather, players of those formats tend to have higher levels of general skill (e.g., being able to execute, recognizing enemy skill usage and knowing the appropriate response, being able to quickly evaluate the relative strength of teams based on build, etc.).

Thus, what typically happens when good HA/GvG/TA players play AB is that they run from shrine to shrine as they please, killing any teams in their way. If the enemy teams avoid them, then they operate as any capping team would without interference. If they see mobs, fighting is actually an option for them, whereas it would generally not be feasible for others. In other words, these players simply have more flexibility, knowing that in most cases they can handily win 4v4 or 4v8. Rather than running at the slightest hint of resistance, they have the option of intercepting enemy teams, rolling over them, and moving on to cap as normal.

bungusmaximus · Jun 26, 2009, 01:33 PM // 13:33

That's exactly my point, they have indeed more flexibility, but often just not the intention to use it, because they just don't care. If I join a group like that that spends 15 minutes scrutinizing my build and then makes a brilliant mess of things as soon as the match starts I'm annoyed and I want 15 minutes of my life back.

I know where you're coming from, and yeh, of course the overall skill level in HA/TA is higher (lulz I played that sh!t too you know, but I'm a busy man, and that doesn't combine well with dedication to high end PvP). In HA they don't use mending, sup runes and whatnot.

It's just such a shame AB's are random, sometimes teams cooperate and don't suck, but usually I find myself picking up slack for other noobs (which is quite fun in a sado-masochistic way ^^).

Seraphim of Chaos · Jun 26, 2009, 04:23 PM // 16:23

sup guys i'm still complaining about pvers in AB after 3 years of its installation

Lux Aeterna · Jun 27, 2009, 12:47 AM // 00:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

If I join a group like that that spends 15 minutes scrutinizing my build and then makes a brilliant mess of things as soon as the match starts I'm annoyed and I want 15 minutes of my life back.

doesn't happen.

if a group is spending 15 minutes scrutinizing your build there's probably something wrong with the group or you, the only exception is if you simply can't find a decent player to fill one slot, ie you spend 15 minutes sorting through DD eles and people who think firestorm is great before you finally find a workable SH who can cap.

I get 2 responses to my builds:

1) Great

2) Switch to hammer --> I switch to hammer --> Great

Basically, only a complete noob would try to tell me to change my build.

although once some ranger spent 15 minutes trying to tell me to use coward axe, then when I finally rerolled off palm strike I did and liked it.

Often when I find a decent group I'll stay with them for long periods of time, the one night I spent on Kurzick ab I teamed with the same monk for almost 4 hours, there simply were no other decent monks and he did well despite having healing breeze Mo/E.

YunSooJin · Jun 27, 2009, 07:43 AM // 07:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by bungusmaximus

That's exactly my point, they have indeed more flexibility, but often just not the intention to use it, because they just don't care. If I join a group like that that spends 15 minutes scrutinizing my build and then makes a brilliant mess of things as soon as the match starts I'm annoyed and I want 15 minutes of my life back.

I know where you're coming from, and yeh, of course the overall skill level in HA/TA is higher (lulz I played that sh!t too you know, but I'm a busy man, and that doesn't combine well with dedication to high end PvP). In HA they don't use mending, sup runes and whatnot.

It's just such a shame AB's are random, sometimes teams cooperate and don't suck, but usually I find myself picking up slack for other noobs (which is quite fun in a sado-masochistic way ^^).

I don't see where you get your generalization that people who would normally TA/GvG/HA don't care about AB. If they didn't care why would they be in AB in the first place? You would think that with the mentality that people bring into TA/GvG/HA that they would play to win, even in AB. (And yeah, even if they were screwing around it would be light years better than any normal AB player).