Curse

Eria · Dec 28, 2009, 09:25 PM // 21:25

I've been reading on monk equips for GvG such as -5/+5e w/ shields of all sorts
But when I watch GvGs and I watch the monks, but I don't think I see the monks actually switch to a variety of shields when facing different dmg dealers. But what I'm wondering is what is the armor vs they usually use? because it seems unrealistic for a monk to open their inventory and keep switching sheilds apposed to just having a primary one. I was thinking -5/20%

Also what do most monks use -5e or +5e spear?

Earth · Dec 28, 2009, 09:30 PM // 21:30

-5e spears are only good for hiding energy, which is only good if you face lots of e-denial.

Also, most monks just check the build the opposing team is running and change their shield according to that. For example if you face a r-spike +10 vs piercing is probably the best choice.

-5/20 sucks.

Johny bravo · Dec 28, 2009, 09:31 PM // 21:31

Most casters have a primary shield set they will sit on based on what damage they expect to be taking or conditions they want to reduce.

Switching is done on an as needed basis. For example if you are taking fire damage sometimes but always have a axe warrior on you, you're going to keep your vs slashing shield equipped for the most part

On that note I am not a GvG expert so I deffer to any of the more experienced players

kedde · Dec 28, 2009, 10:45 PM // 22:45

If you can for some reason maintain a godly APM then by all means switch shields for every damage type.
Noone can, and trying will be likely to require so much of you that it will make the rest of your play worse.

You switch if a split happens and you suddenly find yourself in a situation where the damage is now limited to one major source, or against spikebuilds.
Apart from that you simply analyze the opposing teambuild within the first 30 seconds of engagement and equip what is the most beneficial.

I Jonas I · Dec 29, 2009, 04:47 AM // 04:47

Starcraft players get 400 APM's, switching sheilds takes maybe 3 actions, so if you're good at this game you should be able to switch to your blunt sheild pretty easily in the 2 seconds that it takes a hammer warrior to switch in your direction and actually reach you.

Tearz1993 · Dec 29, 2009, 06:35 AM // 06:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Jonas I

Starcraft players get 400 APM's, switching sheilds takes maybe 3 actions, so if you're good at this game you should be able to switch to your blunt sheild pretty easily in the 2 seconds that it takes a hammer warrior to switch in your direction and actually reach you.

Uhhh no, people generally pick the right shield in the beginning and just use that. In the time it takes for you to switch to the correct shield while fighting, you could have been pre-kiting instead. The only time I would suggest changing shields after the initial encounter is maybe in a split situation.

Krill · Dec 29, 2009, 03:07 PM // 15:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eria

But what I'm wondering is what is the armor vs they usually use?

Disciple's (+15 /w condition) is usually the best since essentially all builds besides blood spam have a deep wound on spikes.

Casting sets and weapon swapping can be useful but there is also the rawr theory to guild wars, sitting in shield sets all the time to mitigate damage and not getting a false sense of security from casting sets if you're taking too much pressure or being interrupted a lot. That may sound counter intuitive but then again...how many gold capes?

Eria · Dec 29, 2009, 05:20 PM // 17:20

The disciple's armor is rather interesting. But I thought you would have survivor's instead, I assume I dont use disciple's on all my armor just chest and legs?

I Jonas I · Dec 29, 2009, 05:55 PM // 17:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eria

The disciple's armor is rather interesting. But I thought you would have survivor's instead, I assume I dont use disciple's on all my armor just chest and legs?

No, use it on all of your armor

Snow Bunny · Dec 29, 2009, 06:13 PM // 18:13

I'd prefer to take 10% more damage from an arrow than dick around switching to piercing while I'm getting spiked.

Lifestyle · Dec 30, 2009, 02:43 AM // 02:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

I'd prefer to take 10% more damage from an arrow than dick around switching to piercing while I'm getting spiked.

Then you also deserve to lose in any serious pvp. Of course if you're up against r-spike you'll sit in your vs piercing shield like you was born with it.

Also, survivor is in general bad for today's 28 min lord damage battles, since +armor negates much more damage than the survivor adds, including possible overhealing that might happen on +armor, and you aren't in danger of degening out, even on many splits. Disciple is simply the best +armor insignia around for monks due to the overabundance of conditions.

About swapping, you'd idealy want to sit in your shield set whenever you aren't doing anything and swap to 40/40 for casting heals and 20/+ench length for prots, depending on your weapon sets. The high energy set is the oshi- set and should be used when you're out on energy, but NEVER EVER sit in it as you only have 2 pips of regen. Basicaly, play like you have 76 max energy (or whatever it is, haven't played GW in a long time, much less monks), and swap to this set when your 40/40 set/shield set hits 0 energy.

dr love · Dec 30, 2009, 03:13 AM // 03:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by kedde

you simply analyze the opposing teambuild within the first 30 seconds of engagement and equip what is the most beneficial.

definitely this. maybe switch for a specific split, but usually you just use the shield that will reduce the most damage from their entire team's arsenal or reduce a condition that can greatly hinder you (daze, blind, cripple etc).

Snow Bunny · Dec 30, 2009, 03:33 AM // 03:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifestyle

Then you also deserve to lose in any serious pvp. Of course if you're up against r-spike you'll sit in your vs piercing shield like you was born with it.

If the choice is between kiting/casting and inventory-swapping shields, I'm going to go with the former.

That's what I was talking about. You should figure out (fast) what damage will be the highest, and sit in that shield the most. Swap appropriately, but too often you see people obsessing over the +10 from their bloody shields and not paying attention to the warrior that's t-minus 0 from opening a can of rape.

Shadowspawn X · Dec 30, 2009, 04:26 AM // 04:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Jonas I

No, use it on all of your armor

Why would you use disciple's on your hands? I was under the impression that studies had been done showing that there was never any hits at all to the hands, therefore putting armor on your hands is ridiculous since its not global where as survivor and radiant are global.

Dusk Banewalker · Dec 30, 2009, 05:09 AM // 05:09

I'm pretty sure a char's AL is a weighted average of the AL of all of his armor pieces. Weapon/offhand mods are then simply added to that figure.

Div · Dec 30, 2009, 08:16 AM // 08:16

Generally, you do an early check to see what type of damage you'll receive the most.

Against 2w2r, 2p2r, or a/p spike, I like to go with piercing. On a prot monk that expects to get hammertrained a lot by 2w2r, maybe blunt.

Against honour, it varies between slashing and blunt, depending on which you think will hit you more.

Switching to blunt when you see a hammer run up to you is very helpful, but takes a little more micro than average. Just make sure you're also kiting when you're doing the shield swapping, or else it's not worth it. Switching to piercing for potential ranger damage when no warriors are hitting you in honour is just not worth it, since you reduce 1 damage but take a lot more damage if a warrior catches you on a piercing shield.

Water shield is often very helpful, since a strong spike will consist of shard storm+freezing gust, which totals about 160 damage before reductions.

As soon as you go on split (and you have more than enough time to react), I go with cripple (if I might get pinned), piercing (against archers), or slashing (against knights). If I hear from my teammates that I'm being collapsed on, I usually switch to water if there's a water ele coming. For 1v1 or 1v2 against fire eles, I switch to fire. Things like that you easily have enough time for, and is worth it on a split.

Corporeal Ghost · Jan 03, 2010, 02:45 AM // 02:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Earth

-5e spears are only good for hiding energy, which is only good if you face lots of e-denial.

Generally right, but incomplete. Any time you die, if you have time, you should die in a -5 set. Since the current metagame is mostly about spikes, you generally do not have the time. And you don't run out of energy on a monk anyway. If it for some reason shifts in the near future--which I'm pretty sure only happens with some non-existant miracle update--and pressure returns, dying in a low set will become important again.

However, if you play monk in arena environments it's still a very relevant skill. Many a time was dying intentionally for energy in TA the difference between winning and wiping. In Codex, it can be even more important depending on what we're running.

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Jonas I

Starcraft players get 400 APM's, switching sheilds takes maybe 3 actions, so if you're good at this game you should be able to switch to your blunt sheild pretty easily in the 2 seconds that it takes a hammer warrior to switch in your direction and actually reach you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kedde

If you can for some reason maintain a godly APM then by all means switch shields for every damage type.
Noone can, and trying will be likely to require so much of you that it will make the rest of your play worse.

For emphasis. Those three actions could be something far more productive, like pre-kiting, or if your other monk is bad, Guardian. Even if you get the shield swap up every time a hammer comes your way, you probably could have done something better instead.

Additionally, if you take enough time to practice this to develop muscle memory to be able to do it consistently, you could have spent that time developing a more useful skill, like learning to Veil better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dusk Banewalker

I'm pretty sure a char's AL is a weighted average of the AL of all of his armor pieces. Weapon/offhand mods are then simply added to that figure.

Unless mechanics have changed while I wasn't paying attention, this is wrong. Every hit, including spells is assigned randomly (but weighted) to a body part, and the armor at that body part is applied. This is pretty easy to test: put on a 0AL hat and full AL everything else and let someone hit you with some constant damage spell for awhile (IE, Mind Blast). Most of them should be ~30-40. When you randomly get hit for 150+, you know you got hit on the head.