Curse

Fluffy Kittens · Mar 01, 2010, 11:24 AM // 11:24

Well, as everyone probably knows Heroes' Ascent is not what it used to be, fun PvP area with many different teams and many players in it. Now it's quite empty, for example: every day during european morning and early afternoon time there are maybe 2 or 3 different teams playing (5 teams max in rarely occasions). So that leads to long waiting and recounting timers and with all these waiting players also don't get to play all the maps which are suposed to be played because u win Underworld, get several restarts, skip all maps and get to Hall of Heroes. Even during the most busy hour, Friday and Saturday evening there are also many map skips due to lack of teams so it's obvious that HA PvP part of the game is dying.

Anyway, Anet developers should do something about it. Maybe change format to 6v6 or maybe get back heroes to HA. You could make a poll, probably over 90% of HA community would want heroes back to HA because there would be something to do in the morning and so called "dead hour". Could just call an friend grab 6 heroes and have some fun...now without heroes it's impossible, people just go play other games and that's obviously not good for Guild Wars.

Other reason for bringing back heroes to HA is making the "low ranks" (Under R9 Hero title) get some rank up because nowadays that's impossible for them. It usually takes them at least 30 minutes to form a team of 8 people and to be honest they don't have much chance vs higher ranked teams and there are a lot more higher ranked teams out there than low rank teams. If there were heroes in HA it would be easier for them to grow in ranks because there would obviously be a lot more teams playing and it's much easier to win against heroes than human players.

It would be fair of forum admins not to close this thread until community express their opinion because community opinion should matter the most and by doing something community doesnt approve you just lose people who are playing the game so that's not good for anyone.

Thank you.

Shadow Feathers · Mar 01, 2010, 11:44 AM // 11:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rezz Anna Nicole

Other reason for bringing back heroes to HA is making the "low ranks" (Under R9 Hero title) get some rank up because nowadays that's impossible for them. It usually takes them at least 30 minutes to form a team of 8 people and to be honest they don't have much chance vs higher ranked teams and there are a lot more higher ranked teams out there than low rank teams. If there were heroes in HA it would be easier for them to grow in ranks because there would obviously be a lot more teams playing and it's much easier to win against heroes than human players.

Thank you.

Tell me if you honestly think waiting around for a 1/2 hr before even getting into a game is acceptable or having to be rank " X " in-order to play ? The people who play on a regular basis at HA, Killed HA themselves. You'll never change that.

chullster · Mar 01, 2010, 12:21 PM // 12:21

I started going to HA a few months before they removed heroes.

Then, it was much easier to get into a team, or add heros and make your own. You'd lose a lot, but there were enough other teams like yours to let you get a win or two for your time, ocassionally getting to HoH the long way.

Got to rank 3, they removed heroes.

Now I can only get in randomway teams, which lose at underworld more times than not, or join a R3/R4 team and run a lame ancient build that compares to paint drying for entertainment value, and isn't anymore succesful.

I haven't played HA for quite some time, and I don't plan on doing so either, it's not a fun part of the game anymore.

miriforst · Mar 01, 2010, 12:31 PM // 12:31

yeah, its harsh with the rank rq

suppose its natural that people want to feel pro someway, and that it in the end gets from pro to a must.

its a bit childish when people is in desperate need for something and goes OMG, NEED ---- TO GO!!!! RANK 12/13++++++++!!!!!! and wont accept someone that isnt the required rank, but know how to do the job.

suppose you have to join a HA guild, thats what i havent done.

i know how you feel XD

AlsPals · Mar 01, 2010, 12:37 PM // 12:37

Even though rampant imbalance didnt help, lack of new maps to push evolution of the gameplay helped hurt HA. On the other hand, the biggest single reason for its lack of players is Rank discrimination. Back in the day, you played with people, saw how they played, and added them to friendslist, and later possibly guild membership. With the totally unfriendly gameplay judged solely by a title, one that you can completely grind by winning only the first battle and /resign spiking to do it over again, players who didnt spend time grinding get little to no chance to enter without befriending someone. Add to the fact not all PvE players are interested, so making friends who want to deal with the dicks and dickettes that run the place isnt easy. Outside of some of the very best players, there are alot of ranked players who aren't very good, but get by on the talents of other handfuls of great players. Place is dead cause the experienced didnt nurture the inexperienced.

papryk · Mar 01, 2010, 12:42 PM // 12:42

no more heroes.... -_-

ps. join a r3+ guild instead of playing with PUGs...

OblivionDanny · Mar 01, 2010, 01:12 PM // 13:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rezz Anna Nicole

Well, as everyone probably knows Heroes' Ascent is not what it used to be, fun PvP area with many different teams and many players in it. Now it's quite empty, for example: every day during european morning and early afternoon time there are maybe 2 or 3 different teams playing (5 teams max in rarely occasions). So that leads to long waiting and recounting timers and with all these waiting players also don't get to play all the maps which are suposed to be played because u win Underworld, get several restarts, skip all maps and get to Hall of Heroes. Even during the most busy hour, Friday and Saturday evening there are also many map skips due to lack of teams so it's obvious that HA PvP part of the game is dying.

Anyway, Anet developers should do something about it. Maybe change format to 6v6 or maybe get back heroes to HA. You could make a poll, probably over 90% of HA community would want heroes back to HA because there would be something to do in the morning and so called "dead hour". Could just call an friend grab 6 heroes and have some fun...now without heroes it's impossible, people just go play other games and that's obviously not good for Guild Wars.

Other reason for bringing back heroes to HA is making the "low ranks" (Under R9 Hero title) get some rank up because nowadays that's impossible for them. It usually takes them at least 30 minutes to form a team of 8 people and to be honest they don't have much chance vs higher ranked teams and there are a lot more higher ranked teams out there than low rank teams. If there were heroes in HA it would be easier for them to grow in ranks because there would obviously be a lot more teams playing and it's much easier to win against heroes than human players.

It would be fair of forum admins not to close this thread until community express their opinion because community opinion should matter the most and by doing something community doesnt approve you just lose people who are playing the game so that's not good for anyone.

Thank you.

I'd also just like to add here it becomes a joke when you get restarts in HoH and your team has to end up waiting 12 minutes per restart. The other day our team got 4 restarts in HoH meaning waiting and doing nothing in HoH for 48 minutes. This morning, a team has been waiting in HoH for almost 2 hours with no other teams joining, then finally a team enters HoH and its the same team you beat before hand, which means they usually just resign and again you wait another hour or so waiting for a team to re-enter.

Infact, teams are now resigning there position in HoH because of the long waiting times.

Kook~NBK~ · Mar 01, 2010, 01:19 PM // 13:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by papryk

ps. join a r3+ guild instead of playing with PUGs...

You have to GET to R3 first! And because of the elitism in HA, the primary way for people who are new to it (whether they're skilled or not) is to PUG their way to R3.

New maps would revive interest for the established HA crowd, but wouldn't bring new players in. No new players (because of the elitist attitudes of so many HA players) to replace the people that have moved on = fewer people playing there.

Gift3d · Mar 01, 2010, 01:27 PM // 13:27

don't whine about "elitism". it's the pvers favorite word, but you can be some little unranked scumbag for all anyone cares, if you're good at game it's all good. the only thing is, 99.999% of people who whine about "elitism" are in reality terrible at game. go figure.

for example. we took an old r4 monk into my r9+ ha guild cause he was good. didn't give a damn about rank. he convinced us to join the group cause he didn't speak like a retard, told us to give him a chance and that he played well, we did, and now he's got more fame than me.

stop trying to use these ridiculous assumptions and definitions to dig yourself into a seemingly bottomless pit and if you want to do something, then figure out a way, cause it damn sure isn't impossible. everyone and their mother has gotten over this age old dilemma, and i say you can too karate kid.

and this is just my general advice to you, because unranked people who know nothing about the form of the game we know as heroes ascent making radical suggestions to better suit their inexperienced needs... well you guys know how many thousands of those threads we've seen before.

Eragon Selene · Mar 01, 2010, 01:55 PM // 13:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gift3d

for example. we took an old r4 monk into my r9+ ha guild cause he was good. didn't give a damn about rank. he convinced us to join the group cause he didn't speak like a retard, told us to give him a chance and that he played well, we did, and now he's got more fame than me.

Do more of that......

OblivionDanny · Mar 01, 2010, 02:10 PM // 14:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eragon Selene

People in HA and PvP killed HA themselves. Your arrogance with the REQ10+ teams limits your player availability. You unwillingness to teach others of lower rank is killing the part of the game you love.

I have played this game for over 3 years now, most of that PvE. I have wanted over the years to play PvP but each time I have tried in the past the attitudes of the PvP community drove me away. You would say “start your own lower rank team and learn”. Then you pick up a random way team and get smashed so bad you just quit.

If you higher ranking teams would take a few seconds to teach others of lower rank the amount of teams and players in PvP would increase. Keep up your arrogance and you will kill it.

I am currently R3 Glad, R3 Hero and getting close to R4. I have snuck into R9+ Sways as an expel Rit and just 2 nights ago played Fooz for a R10+ team. I can out play a lot of R9+ players, some are gods and are 10 times better then me…….but most teams wont give us a chance though.

I have Foozed for GvG and beat high rated teams…….but most PvP players are so hung on there own stats they think you cant play PvP if you don’t have the rank.

Let’s be honest folks, if you can monk…..you can monk. Monking is keeping bars Red. I know there ARE differences between the strategies in PvP and just monking in PvE. Stay in the backline, keep the Mesmer as far away from you as possible, have shield sets. We could go on and on but if you would take a few precious seconds of your time and teach some lower ranking people you might find more teams in PvP/HA. Instead of waiting for the timer to run 12min, spend those 12min tutoring a new guildy in the art of HA. Accept that lower ranking player into the guild and teach them.

Im not saying take ever noob out there and teach them. Some people don’t have a clue and are beyond that. But some of us do have a clue……..we just don’t have your R10+

Don’t and you will kill it…..

I agree with you on some parts, however people need to get out of their heads that "req9/10+ whatever" are being arrogant, I know alot of people that do accept lower ranks like r4/5+ even though they spam r9/10+... Not everyone is being arrogant on the case here, instead its just presumed by many lower ranks. It doesn't take more then a couple of seconds to PM someone and say "Hey, I'm only rank "x" but can you please take me and let me try?"

Personally anyone that has ever said that to me I have given the chance to them, however its when you get some lower ranks that say "WHY R9/10+ IM JUST AS GOOD BLAH BLAH BLAH" or start flaming you otherwise as if they're trying to defend themself from something not directly made towards them. Its rude and therefore have just lost there chance at all to be honest.

I'd also just like to mention here, this topic needs to go back to the point of HA dying and how it can be improved to make new people want to join it. Because im pretty sure that when ursan was popular in PvE it didn't make people want to stop playing PvE because they didnt have the correct norn rank to teams that wanted maxed rankings of it.

But again, this topic is not about PvE and nor should it be about the people in PvP.

papryk · Mar 01, 2010, 02:42 PM // 14:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kook~NBK~

You have to GET to R3 first! And because of the elitism in HA, the primary way for people who are new to it (whether they're skilled or not) is to PUG their way to R3.

because it's so hard to get r3....even if u play with some unranked ppl u can get it pretty fast playing some shit like RTL or IWAY...
make friends..play with them...or even make a guild for unranked ppl
there is always a way to make some fame...

Warvic · Mar 01, 2010, 02:55 PM // 14:55

And once again it's an discussion about ranks. I think Ranks was a good idea. Because if you are very good in the game, and you want to make an strong team, you want to get good players. And ranks show the experience of players. And this is mostly a good indication about the player skill.

I'm not a high rank myself. Some times I'm winning alot with certain pugs/low guild teams. And sometimes I lose everything. One thing I noticed is, that the higher the groups are the more you win.

@people who think ranks are bad. Would you think it's fun in pve. When you want to speed clear stuff to get records and nice loot whatever. Alot of newbs join the party and after a while they are all dead. You wasted time and money. You wouldn't like that either. Actually i'm pretty sure that all those pve noobs in here were asking for r10 ursans a while back. And now they cry coz they can't get in high ranked HA teams. Pathetic..

We all know that ranks will favor the old players in the long run, and this is very bad for new and low rank players. So I hope they will have a better system in GW2.

I wouldn't mind Heroes in HA again either. I actually think that is a good idea. Alot more teams will join then. It won't happen tho

OblivionDanny · Mar 01, 2010, 03:22 PM // 15:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by papryk

because it's so hard to get r3....even if u play with some unranked ppl u can get it pretty fast playing some shit like RTL or IWAY...

This assumption of certain builds being bad or good is also another reason people dislike HA. It needs to stop. No build is good or bad, its 100% personal opinion, I know if I came on here saying "Balanced" is bad I'd get flamed to hell, because the definition of bad is wrongly used.

The truth of it all, is that, people hate certain builds because they get beat by it or deem it "OP".

For example, the majority of people whom played balanced hated the Shattered R/As because they were deemed OP because of the fact they could "roll their heads on the keyboard" to win. The fact is, people who played R/As knew they were OP too, that is why they used them, they were good. It doesnt matter how much "skill" is required to use or not use them. Its hard to believe but some people could still fail at playing them.

Personally, I dont play balanced and I dont like playing balanced either, not because its bad, but because I find it boring to play. Thats my choice and its my opinion therefore its not wrong but its not right either.

And thats the reason new players feel like theres so much "hostility" in HA.

Moving onto the ranks, everyone was unranked at some point, everyone was r3 at some point and r6 at some point and etc...

The easiest way is to join numerous groups, find a bunch of people you get along with and play with them, thats what I did and thats what many people do, new players expect to grow ranks within a couple of minutes or hours, but the truth is it "could" take you up to a week and many people are not prepared to put that much commitment or time in and they don't. They expect higher ranks to teach them and help them in their way, which fair enough they can and some do. It doesn't mean it should happen all the time though, when higher ranks were unranked, they were able to find people and stick together and its what you should be trying to do as well if you expect to get far in HA.

Now really, the discussion needs to go back to making HA more appealing to people and getting more people in HA.

For example, I bet if there was a permanent Double Fame, the amount of players joining HA would increase drastically. But it doesnt mean a permanent Double Fame should happen. So... Ideas?

Killed u man · Mar 01, 2010, 03:45 PM // 15:45

Short anwser: No

Long anwser: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

6v6 and Heroes are what destroyed HA in the first place. If you want to make HA active again, start with removing these shitconditions in HoH, and reintroduce the old, fun, maps.

Secondly, elitism didn't kill HA. When I first joined HA, though I was in the first wave, there was just as much discrimination as there is now. Heck, there was ALOT MORE because there was alot more players people could choose from.

If all those PvE'ers got off their lazy asses, and stopped pretending that getting carried by other players/heroes is a viable way of playing a competitive game, they wouldn't be here bitchin about discrimation. It's been told a hundred times before, and I will be for atleast another hundred more: if you can't someone to farm HA for you, do it yourself. You have the wiki, you have a brain and you, hopefully, have 2 hands.

Lastly a personal, curious question towards the OP:

Why do you even post this? By playing nothing but sway all day, you make people leave aswell, because it simply isn't fun to play against.
"Were too bad to play balanced, and these R/A's keep steamrolling us, so we run it all day ourselves" simply isn't a valid excuse to be running it.
Not to get into a flamewar any further, I felt it had to be said. I myself, and ALOT of other people left HA, because it's one shitmeta after the other one, getting abused by every PvE'er and their mom.

And it's not even a question of people not beating it, because sway, aswell as hexway, can be beaten by applying simple strategies (there gimmicks after all), it's just that facing the same build, playing the exact same strategy over and over again simply isn't fun. (Same reason why bspam killed GvG ladder)

But yeah, you raised a "valid" question, and I gave you a valid anwser that noone who has got a clue about HA will argue with:

Don't bring heroes back to HA.
Don't revert HA back to 6v6.

Both are large culprits in killing HA in the first place, embracing them now would be plain retarded. (But I gues there's nostalgic reasons for you Anna, cuz you started playing during 6v6, so I understand why you would want 6v6 back, but no, it was plain shit compared to old school 8v8)

X Ghoul · Mar 01, 2010, 03:48 PM // 15:48

Heroes were taken out for a reason and no, not 90% of the ha community wants heroes back. Why? Lets face it, your not going to be taking a warrior or derv hero with you (unless its randomway) your going to choose heroes that were the REASON they were taken away. Some examples include: tease gwen, prot heroes, tainter necs.
edit: Oh and since mods love destroying our forum I can see the eminent closure of this thread 8[

Fedetic · Mar 01, 2010, 03:54 PM // 15:54

I'd like to see an active HA again. I ain't playing the game so long as you guys do, so I haven't experienced HA yet, what's a pity

Missmelady · Mar 01, 2010, 04:02 PM // 16:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gift3d

don't whine about "elitism". it's the pvers favorite word, but you can be some little unranked scumbag for all anyone cares, if you're good at game it's all good. the only thing is, 99.999% of people who whine about "elitism" are in reality terrible at game. go figure.

for example. we took an old r4 monk into my r9+ ha guild cause he was good. didn't give a damn about rank. he convinced us to join the group cause he didn't speak like a retard, told us to give him a chance and that he played well, we did, and now he's got more fame than me.

stop trying to use these ridiculous assumptions and definitions to dig yourself into a seemingly bottomless pit and if you want to do something, then figure out a way, cause it damn sure isn't impossible. everyone and their mother has gotten over this age old dilemma, and i say you can too karate kid.

and this is just my general advice to you, because unranked people who know nothing about the form of the game we know as heroes ascent making radical suggestions to better suit their inexperienced needs... well you guys know how many thousands of those threads we've seen before.

This post is full of win. 99.9999 % of the people complaining about elitism are those that prolly asked for certain rank ursans or certain rank lightbringer in doa at some point.

Typcially in Ha (not always) Rank depicts skill and knoweledge of the maps and tactics.

The problem isnt so much the elitism of Ha but the lack of skill by 99 % of the player base. The people that are under r 3 do not seem to realise that joining a guild or making a unranked guild is the best way to get fame.
(hint: Pugs are a terrible Idea) Get in a guild start playing REGULARLY with the SAME 8 people. You will begin to understand each others play styles and that will help you gain some sort of knoweledge on that form of pvp. (From a gvg standpoint- Don't think that a top 100 guild was thrown together in a day. Most guilds in top 100 have had there core teams play together for quite awhile)

As for that I will gladely take some people into ha if they want. Currently r 9 and I don't honestly care about fame nor do I do anything in the game nowadays cept ra, jq, fa. In game name is Pokemon M Aster.

Oh and as for the title of this thread.

NO HA isnt dying. Its already dead and were just poking its lifeless corpse with a stick at this point.

Kook~NBK~ · Mar 01, 2010, 04:10 PM // 16:10

I'm not complaining - I've lived without playing in HA for 4-1/2+ years, not my cup of tea. But I do talk to people who would like to get into HA and their #1 reason for not bothering is because of the rank discrimination that goes on there. Whether it's really a problem or not, that's the perception of the rest of the GW community and it's the main reason why there aren't many new faces there. I know better than to assume that all HA players are elitists, and I also know better than to believe there aren't any out there.

mattybadger · Mar 01, 2010, 04:13 PM // 16:13

I think the main reason it is dead is that HA is one of the 'elite' pvp areas. I think the model was complete PvE, play random arena, play team arena, play Tombs (HA) then GvG. Although most hard core PvP'ers just went straight into HA or GvG. Now there is not really a defined path into PvP imo.

I there is a major lack of players compared to a few years ago in Guild Wars overall, this will have had a large knock on effect for HA. I personally don't think letting hero's back would help much (it would a little but not alot). I enjoyed going into HA with a few mates and hero's back in the day but there were still far more players.

I personally think due to the nature of HA unless a player can convince their guild or find a bunch of like minded players trying to establish themselves in HA in the sparsely populated game that it is unlikely a player can really move foward with rank/fame. This will put most players off, the very players that HA now needs to rejuvenate it. If you changed the fundalmentals of HA to make it more accessable then it would alienate the existing HA'ers.