Curse

Zakarr · Aug 30, 2010, 09:22 AM // 09:22

I'm currently using this:

W/R

*OLD*

Strength 12+1+1
Tactics 9
Wilderness Survival 10

Melandru's Resilience (E)
Signet of Stamina
Endure Pain
Dolyak Signet
Troll Unguent
"To the Limit!"
"I Will Avenge You!"
Soldier's Speed

*NEW*

Strength 12+1+1
Swordmanship 8+1
Wilderness Survival 11

Melandru's Resilience (E)
Signet of Stamina
Endure Pain
Dolyak Signet
Troll Unguent
Counterattack
Poison Tip Signet
Sprint

Anything I could improve so mesmers can't kill me in few seconds? Usually I last like minute or two against couple players and turtle group, if there is not mesmer spamming Vision of Regret, Diversion, Energy Burn, etc.

Luminarus · Aug 30, 2010, 11:39 AM // 11:39

Your running WAY too much regen. You've got resilience which gives u 4 regen for every thing that can give you regen, then youve got troll unguent. Id go with a direct heal instead. I like lions comfort but then you cant use dolyak signet. If you get good at timing it so that you dont knock out dolyak signet, and only spam LC for a bit after then that would be gud.

Possibly lose signet of stamina for a spear to build adrenaline. Against mesmers, your best option is to rupt them. Grab a bow and throw d-shot on the bar. Swap to it versing mesmers, and only hit the skills that are important, and damaging.
Melandru's Resilience (E)
D-Shot
Endure Pain - I dont like this but cant think of anything to replace with.
Dolyak Signet
Lions Comfort
"To the Limit!" - Not sure what your going with from this. If its just the HP then same as above, if its the adrenaline then go nuts.
"I Will Avenge You!" - Do you bother when you dont have anything dead?
Soldier's Speed

The bar with adjustments I would run, and questions for you to consider.

kedde · Aug 30, 2010, 10:47 PM // 22:47

Why not just play something that might actually have a microscopic chance of being entertaining?

raddish · Aug 30, 2010, 10:53 PM // 22:53

It probably sounds fail, but the most effective war stopping turtles I ever saw was a w/mo. Take defy pain as your elite, and fit in Vigourous Spirit+Live Viacriously, giving you about 40 heals per hit. it works best if you use a scythe, since youll hit 3 people, meaning 120 heal per attack (zealous scythe will work best since youll get enough energy to fuel everything with it)

Premium Unleaded · Aug 30, 2010, 11:53 PM // 23:53

That was probably before defy pain got nerfed.

raddish · Aug 31, 2010, 12:27 AM // 00:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Premium Unleaded

That was probably before defy pain got nerfed.

ah yeah, my bad. Even now though it would still be quite effective for the health and armor bonus.

If not, could always take healing hands and be a true wammo

Zakarr · Aug 31, 2010, 01:22 PM // 13:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luminarus

Your running WAY too much regen. You've got resilience which gives u 4 regen for every thing that can give you regen, then youve got troll unguent. Id go with a direct heal instead. I like lions comfort but then you cant use dolyak signet. If you get good at timing it so that you dont knock out dolyak signet, and only spam LC for a bit after then that would be gud.

Possibly lose signet of stamina for a spear to build adrenaline. Against mesmers, your best option is to rupt them. Grab a bow and throw d-shot on the bar. Swap to it versing mesmers, and only hit the skills that are important, and damaging.
Melandru's Resilience (E)
D-Shot
Endure Pain - I dont like this but cant think of anything to replace with.
Dolyak Signet
Lions Comfort
"To the Limit!" - Not sure what your going with from this. If its just the HP then same as above, if its the adrenaline then go nuts.
"I Will Avenge You!" - Do you bother when you dont have anything dead?
Soldier's Speed

The bar with adjustments I would run, and questions for you to consider.

I had Lion's Comfort and didn't have Troll Unguent or "I Will Avenge You!" but experienced some problems. Certain players avoid using hexes and conditions when they see me using Melandru's Resilience so I have to have alternative healings. Sometimes rangers or mesmers interrupt Troll Unguent and avoid hexes/conditions, so I have to have something for healing. I use IWAY inside the Kurzick fortress, it cannot be interrupted or removed. Lion's Comfort is a bit tricky to time right and adrenaline building is very slow without attacking because Signet of Stamina does not allow you to attack. Attacking could be done when stamina signet has recharged to get some direct healing, but recharge is quite long for good heal.

Practically when match starts, I just run to purple turtle group, go behind the hill so commander or luxon warriors cannot attack me, but turtle is not going anywhere. There is often 0-4 players which stay and try to kill me. Every second I stall them will benefit my team. Endure Pain is "just couple more seconds" skill which I will use, if dying anyway. "To the Limit!" is a bit more health and shout needed for Soldier's Speed.

Okay, I replaced IWAY with Lion's Comfort. Seems to be better although requires some timing.

Darth The Xx · Sep 01, 2010, 05:04 AM // 05:04

Any tactic that relies on ur opponent being completely retarded is just fail

Fawxy Lawxy · Sep 01, 2010, 07:58 AM // 07:58

Or just run a monk and spam prots on npc's. And win the whole match by yourself.

FoxBat · Sep 01, 2010, 09:28 AM // 09:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darth The Xx

Any tactic that relies on ur opponent being completely retarded is just fail

AI is reliably retarded.

Zakarr · Sep 01, 2010, 12:13 PM // 12:13

Every luxon team I have encountered so far, have stopped proceeding for a bit and try to kill me and follow, when I rush behind the hill close to purple commander. It means that kurzick team can get first wave of ambers safely inside the fortress.

When some luxon players give up and proceed, turtle group is still at the commander. Usually monk bots stay. That will hurt luxons no matter how good rest of them are. I can start killing the turtle with vampiric spear which takes a while. That also attract some other players to come and check.

If turtles are dead or other kurzicks can handle them, I start running amber and tank amber mine NPCs while others take it out.

I can also fool minions and often can tank a whole bunch of them outside or between inner and outer gate. Minion master just watch and can do nothing about it. His minions are useless this way.

Sometimes kurzick team is so bad or luxon have good healers and players, both turtles are next to kurzick teleporter. Then I can tank two turtles at the same time and whatever luxon warriors there is. That helps a lot and hopeless fights have turned to victory.

I could play for example ritualist protective spirit spammer which is ultra boring or playing monk which is not that boring but sometimes different roles make games better.

Shrimz · Sep 01, 2010, 01:37 PM // 13:37

What exactly are you even trying to do with this build?

Painbringer · Sep 01, 2010, 09:20 PM // 21:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrimz

What exactly are you even trying to do with this build?

Waste time for all.... I will chop you down with hundred blades

Honestly go with a damage approach and some defense all defense is a waste of time believe me I will attack you once and then not bother with you after that. Because you just made your team 7 against 8. So you can stop a turtle and hold it in place. I have 2 turtles. And really do not need a turtle to win. You would be better off running an amber running build that is much more effective in my opinion.

Jeydra · Sep 03, 2010, 08:53 AM // 08:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrimz

What exactly are you even trying to do with this build?

Easy. Hold the turtles and the NPC Warriors. Every (good) player who does FA on the Luxon side knows that the turtles are very important to winning; in fact against an equally skilled team you have zero chance of winning without the turtles. Turtles deal 300+ AoE damage and remove enchantments, and the 4 Luxon Warriors are big pressure as well. You cannot win without them barring a massive skill advantage. It is very much worth it to go 7v8 if you can hold 2 turtles, and arguably even if you can only hold one.

It's because turtles are so powerful that there exist dedicated turtle-killing builds on the Kurzick side. Of course the problem with that is that it only takes one Luxon Monk to stop turtles from dying (Monks can heal for so very much after all, and he'll always have 4 Luxon Warriors backing him up). On the other hand Monks can't do anything to stop a tank from holding the turtles, which is what this build's trying to achieve.

I think this strategy, although highly effective, is also incredibly stupid. I refuse to use it or give any opinions whatsoever on the best builds to do it. Still, people shouldn't pour scorn on this build. I swear, prior to the Defy Pain nerf I actually started bringing Diversion and Blackout on a Monk to deal with Defy Pain tanks.

wilson · Sep 03, 2010, 11:28 AM // 11:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeydra

I swear, prior to the Defy Pain nerf I actually started bringing Diversion and Blackout on a Monk to deal with Defy Pain tanks.

Heh, used to do something similar. Most Defy Tanks not bringing hex removal, I sometimes ran Soothing Images on my Monk. Good times.

Hugh Manatee · Sep 03, 2010, 11:55 AM // 11:55

^while the "we needz teh turtals, tehy go bigboombad" logic tends to pervade FA on the luxon side, turtle humping is in fact responsible for about 90% of the losses on their side. I've played this from both sides, it works like this, regardless of the turtles, healers or tanks, kurzicks lose when the luxons pressure the gates and win when the luxons don't. I've won no healer matches on kurz specifically because the luxons don't try to effectively pressure the npcs(they either trickle in 1 at a time and get skullredengined, halt at the inner gate in a stalemate with the turtles shooting into the walls, or PvP), and lost games where we've had several healers specifically because a few of them knew how to push and kill npcs. The gate NPCs are soft, very soft, pee on them and they fall over, pack expunge, rend or gaze or well of the profane, no amount of red bar pushing will save them. There's even tricks melee can do to kill their typically anti-melee type builds. But you're right, luxons are stupid enough to believe they have to rely on their turtles and so crap like the stall tanks "work", they waste several seconds or even minutes trying to kill a guy who comes back in 20 seconds.

BTW, did you know if the Jugg gets pulled in the green gate it won't close, and if you piss off the keepers they don't take amber? Same principles as the turtle stall bar, you just need a bit more situational awareness, defy pain/melres/HH your way into the gate(works best with a shadowstep to close the gaps), pull the jugg into the door(try and get out of range of the mesmers), then camp. This is best accomplished at the first "amber rush". Follow the runners in, if they're stupid enough to try the turtle stalling crap they're stupid enough to open the doors for you, you should be able to tank long enough for one of them to try and sneak in(at worst you've stalled the amber run at the inner gate for awhile). Though a better option might be to just try and waste the keepers if you get in there, they're soft.

Zakarr · Oct 11, 2010, 06:23 PM // 18:23

This is my new build:

Strength 12+1+1
Swordmanship 8+1
Wilderness Survival 11

Melandru's Resilience (E)
Signet of Stamina
Endure Pain
Dolyak Signet
Troll Unguent
Counterattack
Poison Tip Signet
Sprint

It is working pretty well. I rush to purple turtle squad spawning point and it adds often confusion where luxon players forget to proceed and tries to kill me. If there is not good mesmer around, I can stay alive like minute or so. If there is 4 players bombarding, usually 30 seconds or so.

If players ignore me, I start to kill turtle with poison signet and vampiric spear. This force one of the luxon healers to stay if they wanna keep turtle alive. Usually this attracts some player(s) to stay too.

When I have killed the turtle, I proceed to take mines back by using Counterattack, poison and auto-attack. When some luxon player(s) spawn there, they usually don't ignore me but stay until I'm dead. That takes usually long. If I can take mine back and no luxons around, I just run amber inside or stall purple turtle again if there is coming one.

When all things go bad, I can tank both turtles on the middle Kurzick teleport. They attack me instead. That has sometimes turned the fight. No monk healers can do anything about it.

Delete HB Already · Oct 17, 2010, 06:30 PM // 18:30

I use a burning arrows/apply poison/hunters shot/lightning reflexes on a standard burning arrows ranger to hold up the siege turtles. You can stand about half way between both portals while still in your base (at the upper deck) and shoot arrows at the turtle below from the right gate. It dies pretty fast with degen but a monk could save it. If theres a monk then I just stand there which still causes the turtle to not move and fire 50 damage attacks. Once the monk gets far enough away from the turtle I then start attacking the turtle and kill it. Then I go very close to the left portal but don't go through it and I can make that turtle stand still and try to hit me through a wall dealing 0 damage forever. Sometimes I can get the left turtle to glitch and have it unable to move at all (with the luxon wars blocking it) and in that case I no longer have to stand still and I can fight until the other siege respawns which I will then shoot down again from the upper deck.

Zakarr · Oct 18, 2010, 06:08 PM // 18:08

That works too and I have played similar ranger for a long time, but it can't take much damage from other players or attract them. Usually I end up with stopped turtle squad and sometimes healer healing it. However, when you are camping in turtle squad spawning point with turtle firing on you and couple luxon players tries to kill you while your team safely gathers amber, that is quite good shutdown for some time.

It is pretty amazing how often there is dumb players which stop playing the mission and tries to kill me instead. Some kurzicks have asked from team chat why luxons aren't attacking the fortress =)