Curse

ca_aok · Jul 01, 2007, 02:55 PM // 14:55

The Mo/R build is fun to play around with, but lacks the serious self defense from a /W or /A secondary, which is often crucial in both RA and TA (since teams tend to Monk stomp with little regard for anything else).

TheOneMephisto · Jul 01, 2007, 03:37 PM // 15:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by ca_aok

The Mo/R build is fun to play around with, but lacks the serious self defense from a /W or /A secondary, which is often crucial in both RA and TA (since teams tend to Monk stomp with little regard for anything else).

Are you kidding? You're running a FREAKING BOON-PROT. These are the guys that could survive on their own just fine and still go around using OoB. When you have a jacked-up RoF that heals 100 + RoF's effect on a 2-sec recharge 1/4 sec cast you don't need anything else. And the on top of that you have +X health regen from the conditions that they're probably putting on you and CoP; you're practically invincible.

Boon-prots are almost invincible as long as they don't run out of energy. That's their greatest strength.

Div · Jul 01, 2007, 05:03 PM // 17:03

On the topic of having self-heals vs no self-heals in RA:

Though it may be argued that having self heals is a good thing because you won't get a monk on your team a lot of the time, I really don't think that should be the main reason why you need to take self heals. If you don't have a monk and without self heals, you probably won't get 10 in a row (and even if everyone has self-heals, it will be difficult, but that's not the main point).

When do you get a monk on your team, he may not be fully specced to heal/prot you. You have to realize these are RA monks, not your top of the line Tommy or Red Bars monks. Having those self heals provide yourself with a way to survive when the monk is not perfect and allows for more damage in the long run and more leeway. Even when you get a pretty high-quality monk, there are situations where his/her build just happens to run into a perfect counter-build from the other team (for example Mo/W vs hex overload). In those cases, playing smart and using your self heal to relief pressure is very good (once I played a W/Mo with mend touch+purge and synched with a friend who played Mo/W and we still won against 3 hex overload teams on our way to 2 glad pts because my additional defense helped get us through just enough).

So I really think in the context of RA, one (or two) self-heal (or support) is usually a much stronger choice than taking another attack skill because survivability is key.

However, self-heal and support skills does NOT mean people should take W/Mo's with healing breeze and orison...don't get me wrong ^^

TLLOTS · Jul 02, 2007, 09:06 AM // 09:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by martialis

Yes, bringing heal sig instead of shock will be weaker when you have a monk on your team, but that's simply because you have too much healing, not any kind of conflict between heal sig and a monk. If you have a monk, then more damage is better, if you don't, then self-healing is better.

I don't disagree, but I'm much more interested in readying myself to fight strong opponents, and the simple fact is that I'm unlikely to beat a strong team with no Monk. As such, running a self-heal (at least when it costs me some strong offensive options) doesn't make much sense.

DreamWind · Jul 02, 2007, 09:45 AM // 09:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by TLLOTS

I don't disagree, but I'm much more interested in readying myself to fight strong opponents, and the simple fact is that I'm unlikely to beat a strong team with no Monk. As such, running a self-heal (at least when it costs me some strong offensive options) doesn't make much sense.

I actually agree with this statement overall. In RA, the play is generally bad enough that you don't really need self heal in my opinion, especially on a warrior who is almost never targeted. You can usually bring a heavy offense character and steamroll. Chances are if you are spending lots of time using self heals, your team is not going to win.

You are unlikely to beat a strong team without a decent monk anyways. It is also unlikely to get a glad point without a decent monk...which is why I almost always play monk in RA nowadays, even though its not my best/favorite class. I'd say 90% of my glad points are with monk...the other 10% I got lucky and had a decent monk or really good rit healer on my team. I have never got a point without a healer of some sort (even if it was a dervish healer bwahaha).

So monks are key to play really. You can get wins playing other stuff, but in my opinion its just more difficult and doesn't feel worth it to me.

Of course, if you playing to screw around with weird builds and have fun go for it...but if I was going to post a build in this thread (which I may if I'm bored someday), it would definately be a monk build.

TheOneMephisto · Jul 02, 2007, 03:39 PM // 15:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreamWind

I actually agree with this statement overall. In RA, the play is generally bad enough that you don't really need self heal in my opinion, especially on a warrior who is almost never targeted. You can usually bring a heavy offense character and steamroll. Chances are if you are spending lots of time using self heals, your team is not going to win.

You are unlikely to beat a strong team without a decent monk anyways. It is also unlikely to get a glad point without a decent monk...which is why I almost always play monk in RA nowadays, even though its not my best/favorite class. I'd say 90% of my glad points are with monk...the other 10% I got lucky and had a decent monk or really good rit healer on my team. I have never got a point without a healer of some sort (even if it was a dervish healer bwahaha).

Eh, I've gotten glad points without monks before, however, it always seems to be in a team with a lot of spread-out healing. For instance, in a team of me on E/Rt mind blast, a derv with imbue, and 2 others with self heals (I think a heal sig and life siphon?). Sure for some games I was reduced to spamming mind blast and WoW/wielder's (pre-nerf), but it was still monkless.

Twinsoul · Jul 02, 2007, 03:47 PM // 15:47

Few fun builds I use here:

Mo/x SoR Bonding
14 Prot
13 Divine Favor

Reversal of Fortune
Shield of Absorbtion
Shield of Regeneration
Dismiss Condition
Deny Hexes
Blessed Signet
Life Bond
Balthazar's Spirit

Simple build here, only works in a place like RA. Prot with spells, Life Bond + Balth boosts your team's survivability and your own energy, Blessed Signet boosts Deny Hexes to remove 2 at the same time, Dismiss Condition provides a heal because your team is always enchanted. Pretty simple synergy-laden build here.

R/W Bunny Thumper
12 Hammer Mastery
12 Beast Mastery
10 Expertise

Irresistible Blow
Hammer Bash
Crushing Blow
Bestial Mauling
Rampage as One
Comfort Animal
Charm Animal
Resurrection Signet

Nothing like the classic for stomping faces in RA. Irresistible can be replaced with Wild Blow if you're having trouble with block stances. Usage is simple, RaO, build adrenaline, knockdown+deep wound+daze on monk, win.

Lightning Spiker E/A
16 Air Magic
11 Energy Storage (might be off)
6 Deadly Arts

Lightning Strike
Lightning Orb
Lightning Surge
Blinding Flash
Augury of Death
Air Attunement
Aura of Restoration
Resurrection Signet

Not as useful as the other two builds, but just plain FUN. Air Attunement helps keep your energy up, Aura covers the Attunement and gives you some healing, Blinding Flash deals with melee threats. The spike is Augury, Lightning Surge, Lightning Orb, Lightning Strike. Works wonders against inexperienced/low HP players in RA. Surge and Orb hit at the same time, usually dropping the enemy below 50%, which triggers Augury, causing deep wound, and then you can finish them with Lightning Strike while they are still getting up from the knockdown. Quite satisfying to splatter slow monks with this.

DreamWind · Jul 03, 2007, 05:10 AM // 05:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheOneMephisto

Eh, I've gotten glad points without monks before, however, it always seems to be in a team with a lot of spread-out healing. For instance, in a team of me on E/Rt mind blast, a derv with imbue, and 2 others with self heals (I think a heal sig and life siphon?). Sure for some games I was reduced to spamming mind blast and WoW/wielder's (pre-nerf), but it was still monkless.

Yea, its not impossible. Its just really difficult. Basically when I play anything other than monk, I really don't feel confident at all that I'm going to win in there. Its usually me, some warrior with mending (obv), and 2 non monk casters with balths pendalum or some other bad smiting thing, and some random necro hex I've never seen before that doesn't do anything. Either that or the casters are all attacking with axes. Then we get rolled by some team with a monk in about 2 seconds.

So I play monk and I feel confident that I'll win most of the time, even if my team is crap...I just keep them up until they kill something.

moko · Jul 03, 2007, 06:33 AM // 06:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Natural

No love for the paragon yet, so here's one:

P/D

Spear Mastery: 12+1+(1-3)
Earth Prayers: 10
Leadership: 8+1

Equipment: Pack an Earth Spear. Figure the rest out on your own

[skill]Aggressive Refrain[/skill][skill]Anthem of Flame[/skill][skill]Ebon Dust Aura[/skill][skill]resurrection signet[/skill][skill]spear of lightning[/skill][skill]blazing spear[/skill][skill]glowing signet[/skill][skill]barbed spear[/skill]

Pro:

- More damage than a B Surge
- Still a reasonable pressure build even if Ebon is stripped

Con:

- No cover enchant for Ebon
- Can be shutdown a little easier than a B Surger
- Some people think of Paragons as completely useless in Arenas, so you may be plagued by leavers (moreso)

8 earth, 8 leader, bit into command, get "go for the eyes!" instead of glowing, take barbed, vicious and mighty throw as attack skills and youre done. anthem+gfte+vicious=lolwutdamage.

i play a lot of stuff in RA, and all my builds end up having a lot of utility instead of selfheals. of course, if its possible ill stick in some heals, but usually its utility rather than that. if you are on a monkless team, chances that youll win arent increased by selfheal at all. RA stomps. if you have 4 bashing on you selfheal makes you die also, if you have a monk, theyll get stomped anyways, so you arent even in need of a heal.

generally, damage and utility > selfheal for RA. monking is of course, easymode if youre good at it. Mo/R works fine everywhere in RA, theres loads of hexes and many many many conditions (assassins, many deepwounds, blinds, not so many cripples, rangers, etc) making it way too easy against 99% off teams. and you know for teams that lack conditions..they usually lack heavy damage also, so i end up taking boon off. :P

__________________

Dual Exhaustion KD Fun ^_^

Hammer: 12+1+1
Strength: 9+1
Air: restttttttttt

Furious Hammer of fort
Sundering Hammer of fort
Vamp Hammer of fort

health insignias, stonefist

[skill]Shock[/skill][skill]Devastating Hammer[/skill][skill]Crushing Blow[/skill][skill]Hammer Bash[/skill][skill]Flail[/skill][skill]Rush[/skill][skill]Enraging Charge[/skill]FIRESTORM (aka rez)

was pre Enraging nerf so im not sure if you can still Shock - Deva - Crushing - Bash - Enraging - Bash - Shock in a full chain, but even if not its still great fun and works nicely. :P

and dont buttonsmash or the KD chain will fail, especially under Flail. ^_^ go get the feeling for it at the isles. :P

goodies for linebacking your casters also. ^_^

Skuld · Jul 03, 2007, 10:40 AM // 10:40

its shit, 3 clumsy stances and no bull's strike? noty

TheOneMephisto · Jul 03, 2007, 12:39 PM // 12:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

its shit, 3 clumsy stances and no bull's strike? noty

You've never seen the pre-nerf (not sure if they still use them) enraging-frenzy-rush stand warriors? It isn't horrible, they get an IAS, fast adrenaline, and constant rush. Enraging charge and rush work perfectly to negate each other's weaknesses (end on hit and requires adren).

Skuld · Jul 03, 2007, 01:27 PM // 13:27

They were good, but new enraging charge needs 14 strength, and flail is REALLY clumsy and unsuited to that bar.

moko · Jul 03, 2007, 01:34 PM // 13:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

They were good, but new enraging charge needs 14 strength, and flail is REALLY clumsy and unsuited to that bar.

so, you throw in a major strength and use 14 strength and kick flail for frenzy -- i did say it was pre nerf and i cant login atm to check but one hit more or less (although it shoudl be fine with 14 strength) doesnt matter much anyways. also, i took flail because i dont expect moist Ra people to know how-2-frenzy.

Riotgear · Jul 03, 2007, 01:44 PM // 13:44

It's 10 STR, not 14. You get 3 from Enraging Charge on top of the 1 you normally get for making a hit.

Of course, it used to be 8, and going from 8 to 10 gets a bit harsh on attribute spread. Shouldn't matter for that build though, unless you really need leet damage on Shock.

Ultimate Sacrifice · Jul 03, 2007, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mokone

8 earth, 8 leader, bit into command, get "go for the eyes!" instead of glowing, take barbed, vicious and mighty throw as attack skills and youre done. anthem+gfte+vicious=lolwutdamage.

i play a lot of stuff in RA, and all my builds end up having a lot of utility instead of selfheals. of course, if its possible ill stick in some heals, but usually its utility rather than that. if you are on a monkless team, chances that youll win arent increased by selfheal at all. RA stomps. if you have 4 bashing on you selfheal makes you die also, if you have a monk, theyll get stomped anyways, so you arent even in need of a heal.

generally, damage and utility > selfheal for RA. monking is of course, easymode if youre good at it. Mo/R works fine everywhere in RA, theres loads of hexes and many many many conditions (assassins, many deepwounds, blinds, not so many cripples, rangers, etc) making it way too easy against 99% off teams. and you know for teams that lack conditions..they usually lack heavy damage also, so i end up taking boon off. :P

__________________

Dual Exhaustion KD Fun ^_^

Hammer: 12+1+1
Strength: 9+1
Air: restttttttttt

Furious Hammer of fort
Sundering Hammer of fort
Vamp Hammer of fort

health insignias, stonefist

[skill]Shock[/skill][skill]Devastating Hammer[/skill][skill]Crushing Blow[/skill][skill]Hammer Bash[/skill][skill]Flail[/skill][skill]Rush[/skill][skill]Enraging Charge[/skill]FIRESTORM (aka rez)

was pre Enraging nerf so im not sure if you can still Shock - Deva - Crushing - Bash - Enraging - Bash - Shock in a full chain, but even if not its still great fun and works nicely. :P

and dont buttonsmash or the KD chain will fail, especially under Flail. ^_^ go get the feeling for it at the isles. :P

goodies for linebacking your casters also. ^_^

I ran Bull's Strike in place of Shock and Heavy Blow in place of Hammer Bash, very fun KD build to run. I also ran with 14 hammer mastery and 14 strength to get the 5 adren gain from enraging (including the 1 adren you get from hitting) instantly recharges heavy blow. FUN!

Lord Natural · Jul 04, 2007, 05:02 PM // 17:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mokone

8 earth, 8 leader, bit into command, get "go for the eyes!" instead of glowing, take barbed, vicious and mighty throw as attack skills and youre done. anthem+gfte+vicious=lolwutdamage.

Without glowing sig you just won't have the energy to maintain ebon dust, not to mention if your aggressive refrain ends for whatever reason, the only way you're getting it back in a hurry is with glowing sig. The only alternative would be maybe a zealous spear, but that's not an option with ebon.

I've tried some variations of the build in the past, but pretty much everything fails in maintaining ebon and aggressive, other than glowing sig. Considering the crappiness of leadership in arenas, anthem of flame and gfte can't be considered reliable e-management. Even with a well speced leadership, you'll only be getting a +2 return most of the time.

RandomEngy · Jul 06, 2007, 02:40 AM // 02:40

I cribbed this build from someone a while back, and it was actually pretty effective even before the resilience buff. The skills complement each other rather well. You've got your team bonded, so you're getting energy from that and blessed signet, you have pretty good self protection with the ability to chain-cast booned guardians (and the insane self regen from resilience), and good protection for others with bonds and booned draws and reversals. Interrupted blessed signet and stripped resilience are the main downfalls of the build, but overall it's really fun.

16 Divine favor, 8 Wilderness survival (for 15 second resilience), rest in prot.
[skill]Reversal of Fortune[/skill][skill]Guardian[/skill][skill]Blessed Signet[/skill][skill]Melandru's Resilience[/skill][skill]Draw Conditions[/skill][skill]Divine Boon[/skill][skill]Balthazar's Spirit[/skill][skill]Life Bond[/skill]

I usually start the match with Balth's Spirit->LB->LB->Blessed signet->wait->boon->LB->Blessed signet. That way boon stays on if you run out of energy.

I Brother Bloood I · Jul 06, 2007, 03:49 AM // 03:49

Major on sins plx. Run w/e armor u want as long as it works. Zealous daggers unless combo fails for some reason then use vamp for xtra dmg.

Zealous axe. Dont fail.

Hammer bash -> Crushing -> Protectors = secondary combo. Dont try to pull a zealous hammer.

Gl on this. 40/40 set, +5 nrg +5al(6.25% less dmg every 5 armor)that shield or full 16 is good(http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Farzi), -nrg, +nrg(lol). Hope u get the 1/4 cast on divert when ur migrained.

Watch hex breaker so u can get double preventions. U can use prot spirit but u have little heals already. U could run gole if u go in american ra(lol). If u suck alot u can swap spirit for goh, deny for veil and, hex breaker for gole 10-10-14 attri with that.

Shaz · Jul 06, 2007, 03:55 PM // 15:55

Something I run for fun

Me/Mo
12 Smite
10+1+1 Inspiration
8+1 Fast Cast

Signet Of Judgment
Signet Of Humility
Signet Of Disenchantment
Purge Signet
Mantra Of Inscription
Strength Of Honor
Balthazar's Spirit
Ressurection Signet

Fun if you get 2 melee and a monk, though one melee is fine. SoH on melee, Bal's Spirits on Monk and other including yourself. Killed one of those Shadow Form Sin today with Sig of Disenchantment + SoJ = dead Sin

. Ok hex control with Purge every ~10 sec, and shut monk down with Humility and Disenchantment while your melee pound on him.

For the elite you can swap out SoJ for Signet Of Midnight, but any decent monk can just draw that off. I find the disruption of SoJ is much better. Good for stopping a Sin spike or melee spike and key spirit of a Rit(wanderlous, disenchantment, etc.). Also, as a monk, getting KD every 10 sec is no fun, hehe.

-Pluto- · Jul 06, 2007, 09:24 PM // 21:24

Quote:

In RA, the play is generally bad enough that you don't really need self heal in my opinion, especially on a warrior who is almost never targeted.

I must be playing in the wrong RA. I can't go into it as a warrior without being targeted. It's always some mesmer with empathy, or a necro, or a warrior with dual riposte and glad's defense, or an air ele who uses bsurge on you every 4 seconds...

I also tend to leeroy in because I hate the common RA practice of standing around to "set up our defenses" before they even think about attacking. Consequently, I end up getting attacked by all the sins, fire eles, and earth tanks in the game too. Even the monks start wanding me.

It makes me sad... because then I can't use frenzy

Anyway, the hexes are the main reason I usually take a healsig in RA. Being able to healsig the damage from price of failure and empathy makes it more likely that you can keep attacking without straining your (usually bad) monk.