Curse

MasterSasori · May 02, 2008, 02:14 AM // 02:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Painbringer

...Enchantment rippers are the killers of my build

The reason why IW fails.

I much rather have a shutdown Mesmer.

Diversion > IW

Blkout · May 03, 2008, 10:46 PM // 22:46

I've never been able to get a decent build out of an IW Mesmer due to the reliance of IW to inflict damage and the low armor of a Mesmer in melee applications, however I have a VERY good IW Warrior build that works well in every area of PvE and some areas of PvP also. IW is not the total failure that some would like to believe, but I've found that you cannot rely on it as your only damage dealing skill, in case it gets stripped.

Kale Ironfist · May 04, 2008, 12:49 AM // 00:49

Warriors do more damage without IW than with it, so I don't see the point of ever bringing it in the first place.

Blkout · May 04, 2008, 02:25 PM // 14:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kale Ironfist

Warriors do more damage without IW than with it, so I don't see the point of ever bringing it in the first place.

Not in certain situations. I can point them out to you, but if you've played the game long enough, certainly you should know standard warrior melee counters.

Kale Ironfist · May 04, 2008, 03:53 PM // 15:53

Blind? Go /Rt and Sight Beyond Sight. Hexes? Your team brings hex removal, and if that's not enough, Purge Signet.

Standard anti-physical counters are also easily countered, and every team brings it anyway, so I don't see why people keep spouting that line. Heck, sometimes I've just played stubborn and fought with the counters still on me, and still won.

Physicals are just that good at dealing damage that it's worth cleaning them.

MasterSasori · May 04, 2008, 07:15 PM // 19:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blkout

Not in certain situations. I can point them out to you, but if you've played the game long enough, certainly you should know standard warrior melee counters.

Of course there are standard melee counters on the warrior, but the pressure they can apply makes them worth it. IW gives very little compared to what a normal W/E Shock Axe can do.

Besides enchant strip will own IW.

Hugh Manatee · May 05, 2008, 04:34 AM // 04:34

^cover enchants FTW!

MasterSasori · May 05, 2008, 05:41 AM // 05:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee

^cover enchants FTW!

[rend enchantment]

I think not.

Wouldn't even bother trying to cover enchant whoever is using IW anyway.

Blkout · May 05, 2008, 09:32 AM // 09:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by MasterSasori

Of course there are standard melee counters on the warrior, but the pressure they can apply makes them worth it. IW gives very little compared to what a normal W/E Shock Axe can do.

Besides enchant strip will own IW.

If you say so...to each his own.

Blkout · May 05, 2008, 09:34 AM // 09:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by MasterSasori

[rend enchantment]

I think not.

Wouldn't even bother trying to cover enchant whoever is using IW anyway.

There's a counter for every skill in the game, just because you post one skill after someone posts a skill suggestion or build doesn't mean that every person playing the game is going to be carrying that single skill. The game is designed to be able to counter any skill. My IW Warrior build just offers more flexibility than a standard melee warrior, which is all you can hope for.

Blkout · May 05, 2008, 09:36 AM // 09:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kale Ironfist

Blind? Go /Rt and Sight Beyond Sight. Hexes? Your team brings hex removal, and if that's not enough, Purge Signet.

Standard anti-physical counters are also easily countered, and every team brings it anyway, so I don't see why people keep spouting that line. Heck, sometimes I've just played stubborn and fought with the counters still on me, and still won.

Physicals are just that good at dealing damage that it's worth cleaning them.

Sure you can play stubborn and continue to fight with counters on you, or you could have IW available to you and kill quicker with melee counters on you. Ultimately, you may kill your enemy, my way just works quicker.

Kale Ironfist · May 05, 2008, 10:50 AM // 10:50

...

Or you could have your mid and backline clean your Warriors with the skills they already pack and not waste your elite? That's even faster.

isamu kurosawa · May 05, 2008, 11:06 AM // 11:06

All the IW discussion aside why did you decide to make a second mesmer just to run illusion as opposed to using the one you already have?

Attributes, 2nd professions, armour, weapons can be changed so its a good idea to do so, saving your char slots for different professions.

And to add, some of the best elites for mesmer are from other professions. A few include

[assassins promise]
[glyph of energy]
[glyph of renewal]

one of the best general purpose mes elites in pve is still
[mantra of recovery]

Tyla · May 05, 2008, 01:21 PM // 13:21

^I'm quite happy with E-Surge on my bar as a source of damage myself.

@Blkout -- I enchant removal your IW. I win.
If your build depends on an enchantment and not something that you can vary before the area and have that damage in your hands at that point, it's a bad build.

Not to mention you've got a huge dent in your survivability as a frontlining squishy, which can't get one of the best skills in the game to his / her disposal for: More pressure, make then sit on the ground and pummel them in, and that includes your entire party to take this advantage.

MasterSasori · May 05, 2008, 05:05 PM // 17:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blkout

Sure you can play stubborn and continue to fight with counters on you, or you could have IW available to you and kill quicker with melee counters on you. Ultimately, you may kill your enemy, my way just works quicker.

Spike v. 60 AL mesmer = Spike wins

I heard [diversion] was good

. Maybe you should stick with that.

gocall911 · May 05, 2008, 09:28 PM // 21:28

Wow... me and my friend run a similar argument all the time.. but both of us are too stubborn to admit that our builds are not PERFECT. you can counter any thing in this game, but certain weakneses slip by easily on a skill bar with 8 skills. No one can tell me they havent been in RA and come up with a team with no monks or against a team with no monks and they got rangers with blinds... IW gets through it, or you get that random necro that might possibly have rend enchantments and a war has to eat em... i see ppl posting trying to defend the war and saying that a certain skill can counter this and that, but what are the odds you dont have that skill when your running a different build. Like ppl have been saying this entire time the IW SPEEDS UP THE KILL, they have 7 more skills to to hex, condition and what not. your IW gets interupted/ stripped, oh look your a regular mesmer now!

isamu kurosawa · May 05, 2008, 09:39 PM // 21:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by gocall911

your IW gets interupted/ stripped, oh look your a regular mesmer now!

Without an elite.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

^I'm quite happy with E-Surge on my bar as a source of damage myself.

E-surge can be nice scince the damage increase but i just can't resist firing off multiple [[cry of pain]'s instead

gocall911 · May 05, 2008, 10:24 PM // 22:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by isamu kurosawa

Without an elite.

Like i said, cant be perfect =p

yum · May 06, 2008, 01:46 AM // 01:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blkout

There's a counter for every skill in the game, just because you post one skill after someone posts a skill suggestion or build doesn't mean that every person playing the game is going to be carrying that single skill. The game is designed to be able to counter any skill. My IW Warrior build just offers more flexibility than a standard melee warrior, which is all you can hope for.

In TA, almost every team and their mothers bring Rend.

mistokibbles · May 06, 2008, 03:10 AM // 03:10

For PvE though, I think IW would work decent. Me/D with a ton of cover enchants + damage reduction skills like Armor of Sanctity would help. That insignia to add armor while enchanted will help too. IW doesn't have a terribly long recharge time either so it's not too bad if it gets stripped. I still prefer Sabway to IW anyway though.