Curse

NecroticChanter · Apr 29, 2008, 02:05 AM // 02:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

Remember when you load into HA, wanting to experience how fun it is? Three hours later, you're still there, because everyone is spamming "LF r5+ monk" or "LF r9+ ele."

That sucked.

The hero title is one of the biggest symbols of grind (with a little skill), and Anet knows it already killed entry to higher end PvP. It turned players who won't accept someone of a lower rank into "elitist PvPers."

So why are they doing that for PvE now, with all these grind-necessary PvE skills? Are they wanting to turn those same people who cried about "elitist PvPers" into hypocrites when they go out and advertise "LF r8+ ursan" or "LF r3+ SY"? Because that's what happened. One minute, Bob Random posts in Riverside crying about how elitist PvPers are because they won't accept him into their HA groups since he's only rank 2. The next, he goes into DoA and rejects r7 norns because his group is a r8+ ursan group.

If Anet wants to be like WoW, at least they should make a point of it. You simply don't go out advertising that this is a grind-free game, and when a new player buys it, they find they can't play a large portion of the end-game because their lack of grinding makes it impossible for them to find groups. Sure they can join good guilds running balanced builds, but how likely is that given a very casual player? The direction GW (and GW2) is changing into is one that'll attract more players in general, but with their goal changes, they should also change their advertising.

Why the hell would you care? Ur in Dark Alley..one of the best guilds in the meta right now...GvG at least.

MasterSasori · Apr 29, 2008, 02:09 AM // 02:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by NecroticChanter

Why the hell would you care? Ur in Dark Alley..one of the best guilds in the meta right now...GvG at least.

Probably because he still gives a damn about the game and the people in it. It's not a difficult concept.

Being in a great GvG guild has nothing to do with caring/not caring.

Arkantos · Apr 29, 2008, 02:53 AM // 02:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by NecroticChanter

Why the hell would you care? Ur in Dark Alley..one of the best guilds in the meta right now...GvG at least.

Divine is a pro PvEr. He has gold walking amongst mortals. He's rly gud.

Njaiguni Blaze · Apr 29, 2008, 03:08 AM // 03:08

In GW you choose to grind. You choose to get fancy stuff, so you choose to grind. You choose to get titles maxed, so you choose to grind. There is no reason for you to grind to normally play the game.

And to comment on the whole rank thing: get a guild.

Myself I have just recently turned r5 (hero). I don't even think of joining pugs. Simple reason: sway. It was a nuisance at first to me, but people have helped me understand why pugs run it. Everyone knows what they're doing, vent is hardly needed, not much effort is need to be put in the team. This may sound "lazy" or "unskilled" or whatever, but it makes perfect sense. Try and put up balanced or a hexpressure with a pug. Teamplay isn't there because the team has not been playing with one another (enough), ragequitters after 2 losses, etc etc. You don't need titles to get into a DoA or UW clearance, you don't need titles to get into Halls. You need friends a.k.a. guildies.

Sab · Apr 29, 2008, 09:09 AM // 09:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by NecroticChanter

Why the hell would you care? Ur in Dark Alley..one of the best guilds in the meta right now...GvG at least.

He's a cape leecher. Speaking of which, wtb dR invite plz pm.

Div · Apr 29, 2008, 09:20 AM // 09:20

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Originally Posted by Sab

He's a cape leecher. Speaking of which, wtb dR invite plz pm.

Cape leeching ownzzzzzzzz. You need to come so we can PvE yeye? Still in Bite?

Speaking of which, we just had a fun kicking game where we kicked 4 members

BlackSephir · Apr 29, 2008, 11:23 AM // 11:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Njaiguni Blaze

In GW you choose to grind. You choose to get fancy stuff, so you choose to grind. You choose to get titles maxed, so you choose to grind.

And you don't see that there's something wrong with it? I want a better looking weapon, so I have to grind?
There's no choice if there's only one option, if you want better looking weapons, you're forced to grind. A choice would be if you could do a) grind b) series of quests.
Where is the choice in a) grind ?

Njaiguni Blaze · Apr 29, 2008, 01:04 PM // 13:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Njaiguni Blaze

There is no reason for you to grind to normally play the game.

Don't quote me out of context. I haven't said anything about whether grinding is fun, good, bad or whatever. People like it, people don't. They advertised for this game to have no grind to play the game. They still hold on to that. You can roll a PvP and jump right into battle, you can roll a PvE and begin the storyline right away. You don't need a maxed out Ursan title to play the game. You don't need an Elemental Sword of Pwnitude. Also, if these things would just fall in your lap by completing a quest, what's the whole accomplishment behind it? Aren't these things supposed to be special? (Can't wait for people to post with Raptor farming screenshots. Don't, it's an example.)

BlackSephir · Apr 29, 2008, 02:44 PM // 14:44

And I was talking about this whole "choice", not about whether grind is bad or not. So gg.

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You don't need a maxed

OF COURSE I DON'T. But YOU were talking about CHOICE here. So, what's the choice if I decided that I-Want-Maxed-Norn rank? Ye, there's no choice, the only way to do it is by grind. There are no alternatives, other possibilities. There is no choice.

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Also, if these things would just fall in your lap by completing a quest, what's the whole accomplishment behind it? Aren't these things supposed to be special?

Utter bs. You talk about accomplishments and yet you put completing a quest UNDER grind? Under c-spacing? Under a thing that retarded 8 year old could do? Crap, people can even make a macro that will farm you SS/LB points in Nightfall. This is when things fall in your lap.
Yeah, I see you understand the concept of "skill over time", you just chose to ignore it.
And of course I haven't said anything about things falling in your laps. I've said about completing a series of quests, not necessarily easy ones. But it's easier to put shrines and blessings that give you magical points instead of designing original and hard quest.

V: You god damn tard, WHERE did I say that you said that completing a quest was a grind? You compared grind and completing a quest and even then you put grind above completing quests. It's pretty pathetic when it comes from a guy who says "read, comprehend and then post". My work here is done. You're an idiot.

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. You get no benefits out of grinding.

Go to GW Wiki, look what titles do and shut up.

Njaiguni Blaze · Apr 29, 2008, 02:59 PM // 14:59

Read, comprehend and then post. I didn't say completing a quest was a grind.

And saying I ignored the concept of skill over time is a flaw. Fancy weapons and titles don't make you skilled.

It's even in the title of this very thread: why grinding for benefits is bad for PvE. You get no benefits out of grinding. It doesn't make you a better player.

Tyla · Apr 29, 2008, 03:09 PM // 15:09

Well titles not making you skilled is obvious, especially with all the crappy gimmicks in TA and HA.
Same goes for PvE (Ursan) in most cases (PuGs), because you are REQUIRED to have rank 10 Ursan. Even if that mission is plain easy, they still use it.

I've always understood why people want to PuG for: Making friends for anything and everything, to be a little more talkative (Heck, I see the argument against heroes being this, yet you are required to grind grind grind to max your rep?).

And yeah, some people want those fancy weapon skins and titles, because they're there. They also enhance your character on a viewable basis, which is good.

It's down to player skill in the end, although that was mainly for PvP, who said it wouldn't be bad to incorperate a little more skill and less predictability in PvE?
I would rather PLAY for my sexy weaponskins and all that ect, instead of GRIND.

Njaiguni Blaze · Apr 29, 2008, 03:35 PM // 15:35

You get no benefit out of titles. Lockpicks, buffs and e-penises get a benefit out of it. That's my point.

Tyla · Apr 29, 2008, 04:11 PM // 16:11

Lightbringer, Sunspear, GW:EN Rep titles, Alliegance.
They all offer benefit, to PvE skills and some of them give character bonuses depending on where you are or what you're against.

MasterSasori · Apr 29, 2008, 09:13 PM // 21:13

At least Defender of Ascalon is out of the paws of UBers.

thibault the monk · Apr 29, 2008, 09:42 PM // 21:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

Ye, there's no choice, the only way to do it is by grind. There are no alternatives, other possibilities. There is no choice.

This is false, there are other ways, you can do quests to get the norn rank up, its just extremely inefficient. You could just do all of the dungeons on nm and hm, and all of the quests on nm and hm to get your norn rank at least close to max if not max.

Also it is your choice to want the norn rank, gw doesn't require u to have that and not all groups require you to have that. It is no secret that most people will want it and most people will want high ones, but that is LIFE. There are discriminations everywhere in life, why should a game be any different. Its simple if you do not want to spend the time to get good in order to get into good groups then you dont deserve to be there anyway.

Tyla · Apr 29, 2008, 09:49 PM // 21:49

Notice the word "Most" in your post.
Rarely do I see people asking for below Rank 10.

And yeah, people don't want to spend time grinding because they don't like grinding and don't think it's fun.
If you're not playing for fun, why are you playing?

BlackSephir · Apr 29, 2008, 11:06 PM // 23:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by thibault the monk

This is false, there are other ways, you can do quests to get the norn rank up, its just extremely inefficient.

I've done all of the EoTN quests. No rank 10 anywhere.
Bah, I can do the Norn tournament, right? Too bad that after a while you just repeat everything in it... it's like...
OH SHI-! ITS GRIND!

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. There are discriminations everywhere in life, why should a game be any different.

Probably because it's not the same. Games are for entertainment. Life is for living. Really.

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Its simple if you do not want to spend the time

YES! FINALLY! I don't want to gain something by sacrificing my time, I'd rather gain it by proving that I'm a good player, not a pathetic bot that keeps doing the same things over and over.

thibault the monk · May 01, 2008, 01:43 AM // 01:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

I've done all of the EoTN quests. No rank 10 anywhere.

Plz do the math, look at the dungeon guides and heros handbooks, 60,000 + 40,000 + 20,000 + 30,000 = 150,000 = max rank. Anet did think before adding those, thats why they did add them to make it so that people who didn't want to do massive grinding for the points don't have to.

Also Tyla, you shouldn't speak for everyone when you say that people don't like grinding, i find it very relaxing to go out and just mindlessly kill stuff, and thats why I actually like to play this game for 3 years now, for the farming. Its a simple matter of preference, some people like it some people dont. If the few grinds are still there then it is quite obvious that most people that play either like the grind or don't mind it, otherwise Anet would lose money from people not buying the game at all or future campaigns and would be forced to take out the grinds. Point is, dont speak for everyone when saying grinding = bad.

Sab · May 01, 2008, 02:02 AM // 02:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by thibault the monk

Plz do the math, look at the dungeon guides and heros handbooks, 60,000 + 40,000 + 20,000 + 30,000 = 150,000 = max rank. Anet did think before adding those, thats why they did add them to make it so that people who didn't want to do massive grinding for the points don't have to.

So you should complete every mission and dungeon to get the points you need so you can join PUGs for completing missions and dungeons?

FlamingMetroid · May 01, 2008, 02:08 AM // 02:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by thibault the monk

Also Tyla, you shouldn't speak for everyone when you say that people don't like grinding, i find it very relaxing to go out and just mindlessly kill stuff, and thats why I actually like to play this game for 3 years now, for the farming. Its a simple matter of preference, some people like it some people dont. If the few grinds are still there then it is quite obvious that most people that play either like the grind or don't mind it, otherwise Anet would lose money from people not buying the game at all or future campaigns and would be forced to take out the grinds. Point is, dont speak for everyone when saying grinding = bad.

Play WoW, its much more fun if your into grinding. And I don't mean that as an insult, WoW is really fun, but I personally dont play it because of the grind. Guild Wars was a game built away from the standard MMO fair, and therefore away from grinding. In Guild Wars, grinding should = bad. If you play GW for grinding, find a another game, you'll have more fun.