Curse

byteme! · Dec 08, 2009, 02:15 AM // 02:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Alvito

It's simple. Time has value. Paying for a run can save you time.

Those of you that claim that people that buy runs are "lazy" are just wrong. Your time has value. If you play a given section of content, that time has an opportunity cost - what you could have otherwise been doing with that time.

If I can farm gold at 50k/hour (and am willing to do so), and I need to complete a section of content that will take me an hour to complete but will take a runner half an hour, then I should be willing to pay a runner any amount up to 25k less the expected value of the drops from completing the content. The half hour of my time is worth exactly that - half an hour of farming (25k) less the drops I forego by getting run instead of farming.

So if you're claiming that people that buy runs are "lazy", you're ignorant and prideful. Just saying.

There isn't anything "wrong" with buying runs, any more than there is anything "wrong" with stubbornly insisting on completing the content yourself every time you do it. They're just different sets of preferences, although your choice on the subject tends to say a lot about your ability to convert your time into in-game cash.

I was going to reply but after reading this I probably don't have to. If anyone thinks even for a second that the ONLY reason to get runs is because of laziness then that particular person is just ignorant.

I value my time far more then some virtual money. I mean what's a lousy 25k fake money worth if it could save you 1/2-1 hour of real time. I could be farming with that saved time. Heck I could go out and make a real living with the free time I created. If you really want to blow 2 hours on a dungeon thinking you're clever by all means go ahead. I was done hours ago and moving to bigger and better things. If you don't value your time that's your problem. See you at the finish line.

TIME AND EFFICIENCY IS EVERYTHING.

bigtime102 · Dec 08, 2009, 05:27 AM // 05:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by byteme!

I was going to reply but after reading this I probably don't have to. If anyone thinks even for a second that the ONLY reason to get runs is because of laziness then that particular person is just ignorant.

I value my time far more then some virtual money. I mean what's a lousy 25k fake money worth if it could save you 1/2-1 hour of real time. I could be farming with that saved time. Heck I could go out and make a real living with the free time I created. If you really want to blow 2 hours on a dungeon thinking you're clever by all means go ahead. I was done hours ago and moving to bigger and better things. If you don't value your time that's your problem. See you at the finish line.

TIME AND EFFICIENCY IS EVERYTHING.

Time is money, so you do value your virtual money. Thats the difference. Nothing wrong with that. But some people value their expeirience, the journey not the destination so to speak. Spending 2 hours beating a dungeon is more valuable than spending half a hour getting someone to do it for you and another 1.5 hours farming to some people.

For example, I fought my way solo from Beacons to Droks to get my max armor for the challenge, not for the gold or time savings. The epic 12 hours slug fest against all possible odds was more valuable to me than any gold or real money for that matter that I could have made in the same time. Experience > stuff for many people.

I think part of the anger that comes from people like OP is that people who enjoy the destination more than the journey wear the same badges as the people who actually gone through the journey. In otherwords everyone gets the same Rep or chest items in the end. It would be only fair to some how distinguish , seperate people who took a taxi cab through the boston marathon, and those that actually ran it.

The only way I could think of that would ensure such a distinction would be some sort of title track or armor or whatever thats only available through H/H'ing or soloing a place. Imagine a reward that actually recognized playing the game the way the developers worked so hard to carefuly design. They'd shed a tear. On the other side there could be rewards for how fast you beat the game or how efficiently you went through it.

The point being people play many different ways and in the end all are valid and deserve their due recognition.

Jensy · Dec 08, 2009, 05:57 AM // 05:57

I have never once paid for a run, so I don't know. My guild/alliance is filled with people who don't suck, and we work well together. We enjoy the challenge (or, well, it's not really a challenge at this point...) of HM dungeons, guardian missions, etc.

Reverend Dr · Dec 08, 2009, 07:01 AM // 07:01

Why are we calling it getting a run? You aren't getting run though anything, you are just paying one guy to organize a pug.

Nereyda Shoaal · Dec 08, 2009, 08:40 AM // 08:40

To save time.
And time is money.

upier · Dec 08, 2009, 08:52 AM // 08:52

Lvl 3 ranger in Kama.
1k to the Docks.
2k to LA.
From there, got to Kaineng on my own.
Wasting 3k was a better choice since it gave me the ability of running around in the armour I LOVE and having the ability to go to Shing Jea to charm my Tigger than playing the game normally and having to waste money on upgrading (REALLY ugly) armour and having to play with a pet I do not want.

Runs give me the ability to bypass the content that I do not enjoy so that I can spend more time on content that I do.

Malice Black · Dec 08, 2009, 11:35 AM // 11:35

Quote:

Runs give me the ability to bypass the content that I do not enjoy so that I can spend more time on content that I do.

That covers it really.

shaygo · Dec 08, 2009, 01:35 PM // 13:35

I never thought that so many responses would be written in less than 24 hours. So I probably touched a tender point.
first of all, I would like to emphasize that I meant mainly dungeon runs and not "shortcut to X destination" runs.
to those who claim that time is money, why do you play GW at all, if you don't enjoy the playing ? of course that there are other, maybe better things to do with your time but isn't reading and responding in those forums considered a waste of time as well ? and you still do it. so either you don't get near GW and play tennis instead, or don't complain obout the time loss if you chose to do play. IMHO at least.

the best thing I got from this thread is that I'm going to find myself a better guild

, fast ! I enjoy playing (the journey and not the destination, as Bigtime102 said so clearly), and I would like to do it along with other competent players.

qvtkc · Dec 08, 2009, 01:38 PM // 13:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

Runs give me the ability to bypass the content that I do not enjoy so that I can spend more time on content that I do.

Indeed, runs are for cheaters. But early runs are not important, and not what OP is asking about. Endgame-area runs, including EotN dungeons and even Zaishen mission runs, are pure cheating and doesn't allow you to "bypass" content to reach something that's after it, since there is no "after". It just gives you the end reward without playing for it.

glacialphoenix · Dec 08, 2009, 01:39 PM // 13:39

Hmm.

I think I paid for a dungeon run once so I could cap three skills I wanted off it. It'd have taken me far, far longer to cap them the ordinary way. I can't remember which dungeon it was, but it was one of the cheaper ones. Murakai, I think.

But I generally don't enjoy getting runs - and I mean runs, not ferries, because I do like playing through the dungeons on different characters.

Shadowspawn X · Dec 08, 2009, 02:22 PM // 14:22

Paying for runs is done because its there. Its there because of anets neglect and failure at balancing pve.

upier · Dec 08, 2009, 02:44 PM // 14:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by qvtkc

Indeed, runs are for cheaters. But early runs are not important, and not what OP is asking about. Endgame-area runs, including EotN dungeons and even Zaishen mission runs, are pure cheating and doesn't allow you to "bypass" content to reach something that's after it, since there is no "after". It just gives you the end reward without playing for it.

In that case, paying for runs is just the easiest way of farming.

Garbad_the_Weak · Dec 08, 2009, 02:56 PM // 14:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by kajusbonus

"Why do ppl prefer to pay for runs ? "
They are Lazy.

Q: Why do people pay for runs?
A: To skip the crap and get to the parts of the game they prefer.

That's all there is to it. Maybe I don't feel like fighting my way through the Magumma again and I just want to try my new necro in SF.

Tom Swift · Dec 08, 2009, 03:24 PM // 15:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by qvtkc

Indeed, runs are for cheaters. But early runs are not important, and not what OP is asking about. Endgame-area runs, including EotN dungeons and even Zaishen mission runs, are pure cheating and doesn't allow you to "bypass" content to reach something that's after it, since there is no "after". It just gives you the end reward without playing for it.

Not quite. You statement would be true if dungeons were not tied to skill (or Zaishen to the coins required for the heavy pack)

Because the effectiveness of EotN skills are tied to rep level, in order to get a high rep you have limited options. Dungeons are one of the better ways to max dwarven so you need to go through dungeons again and again on each individual character both for the dwarven points in the dungeons themselves and to get that hm book filled to turn it in. I've already done all the dungeons myself on one character. I don't want to endure them repeatedly on each character just to get r10 dwarven per toon.

So yes, you are bypassing content in order to get something after that - the skills you wish to use elsewhere.

karlik · Dec 08, 2009, 04:01 PM // 16:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

Runs give me the ability to bypass the content that I do not enjoy so that I can spend more time on content that I do.

Exactly. My Ranger is my title toon. She made the trip to Drok and has the cartography title. My ele, on the hand, is a stoneguard and exists almost entirely to farm for Nicholas. I didn’t want to spend the time getting her from Beacons to Drok just so she could farm in Mineral Springs for Nic so I paid for a run to Drok. I got my gifts and was able to go back to playing my Ranger.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend Dr

What I don't understand is why people are paying 15K for runs where the runner requires them to bring certain skills and kill mobs as well. Isn't that. . . an organized pug?

I was in Abaddons gate and saw a guy selling an Abaddon run in HM for 2k. I had already done it in HM, but I wanted to see how he was able to run that mission, so I paid the 2k. Exactly as you described, he called targets, drew us lines on the compass, and really was just party leader – it was not a “run”. I figure I got what I paid for, I just wanted to see how he did it. Not sure about how the rest of the party felt.

snaek · Dec 08, 2009, 04:12 PM // 16:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

Runs give me the ability to bypass the content that I do not enjoy so that I can spend more time on content that I do.

the op implied dungeon runs, which is not required content; therefore, you can completely ignore the content altogether, but no, you want the shiny reward with 0 effort.

if this was directed towards a general definition of "run" (i.e. getting ran through low-end areas to progress through storyline or new outposts), then i would agree with you. but even then, i personally would not get a run because low-end content is so ridiculously easy.

back to op: if it was in regards to getting missions and dungeons ran, then i do think its because the mishy or dungy is too hard for them or they are too lazy. with the few exception of dungeons like cof or soo, where you will get ran through multiple times not for the sake of completion, but for the sake of "farming".

Martin Alvito · Dec 08, 2009, 04:35 PM // 16:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

In that case, paying for runs is just the easiest way of farming.

Other way around. Getting people to pay you for runs is the easiest (ie: most efficient) form of farming.

upier · Dec 08, 2009, 04:36 PM // 16:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Alvito

Other way around. Getting people to pay you for runs is the easiest (ie: most efficient) form of farming.

Depends what you are farming.
If you are farming gold - then yes.
If on the other hand you farming something that can only be obtained by "playing" - such as advancing reputation titles, then no.

Martin Alvito · Dec 08, 2009, 04:43 PM // 16:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

Depends what you are farming.
If you are farming gold - then yes.
If on the other hand you farming something that can only be obtained by "playing" - such as advancing reputation titles, then no.

Even then it still is. You're better off getting people to pay you for runs, then turn around and purchase the rep via runs.

SithLord2064 · Dec 08, 2009, 05:27 PM // 17:27

For me, the answer is very simple. I am two missions away from Legendary Guardian. I've tried MANY times to finish one of those missions with Masters. While many people say "It can be done with H/H team", personally, I'm having a LOT of problems with it. I've prolly blown 20k in consumables trying to do it myself. So, if someone were to tell me they'd run it for 20k, I'd gladly pay them at this point. I play at a time when most of my guild/alliance is asleep. And the few friends I have that still play are either A) asleep B) PvPing or C) Working on another character and too "busy" to help.

It's Jennur's Horde, in case you were wondering, that is totally kicking my ass. Can't beat it for the life of me. And believe me, I've tried it 3 or 4 different ways.