Curse

Free Wind · Jun 04, 2007, 01:59 PM // 13:59

I've tried everything to make Tahlkora use Signet of Devotion and she never ever used it.
Even if it's the only skill on her bar - she'll let you die from anything (degen, direct damage, environment effects, anything)

Racthoh, can you confirm your hero monks use it?

Racthoh · Jun 04, 2007, 06:32 PM // 18:32

The only monk build there with SoD was the bar I was controlling, I could never get my own heroes to use it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Batou of Nine

My bars and suggestions were more in terms of when in heavy pressure in Hard Mode, or simply harder normal mode areas like Realm of Torment, Desolation, Fire Islands, Eternal Grove and beyond, etc.

I guess my advice would be for everyone to just use the henchmen monks then; no need to worry yourself to death over a monk bar for an area that they can work well enough in. Realm of Torment; each mission hero/henched first try with masters (the exception being Gates of Madness because I forgot to capture the Balthazar Shrine ><), Fire Islands ditto all done with one attempt, and I got Poisoned Outcrops out of the way being vanquished (hearing a number of people talk about the difficulty there) but managed it with the henchmen monks for all of those areas. Eternal Grove... had to take a second human, but we still used the henchmen monks to fulfill that role.

To clarify, I've only used those monks on Istan, up to and including Crystal Desert, and Minister Cho's Estate (Zen Daijun has the rit and monk henchmen) on Hard Mode. I never used my hero monks when there were two henchmen available to fulfill the healing roll.

Evilsod · Jun 05, 2007, 12:32 AM // 00:32

I thought they used SigoDev when they were on low energy only? Never given it them to test it out but i'm sure i heard that somewhere.

Free Wind · Jun 05, 2007, 06:34 AM // 06:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

I thought they used SigoDev when they were on low energy only? Never given it them to test it out but i'm sure i heard that somewhere.

To my observation, heroes AI is written in such a way that they always prefer energy based skills over signets and adrenaline skills and they will never use signets if they have energy and ready-to-use energy spells. But as I’ve seen it, hero will never use Signet Devotion even if it’s the only skill in their skill bar. Looks like a bug to me

Jedi Battousai · Jun 11, 2007, 01:20 AM // 01:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

MMs i've gone back to using Flesh Golem and a load of melee. I might change to OoU but i'm not sure i trust heros to use it without suiciding. I give him Dark Bond anyway, had several party wipes where MoW survived just because they couldn't get through Dark Bond ^^

I haven't had any problems running OoU with Master. I usually run Jagged Bones in areas with not as many corpses and/or some undead mobs but OoU everywhere else where I don't need to make sure minions stay alive since there enough bodies. Basically, you can run OoU and your AI monks will be able to pick up any stray saccing. You can also give him healing breeze or mystic regen depending on how many enchants you use with him to counter the saccing. You may need to manually cast them but the heroes are generally smart enough to use them to counter the sac.

LouAl · Jun 11, 2007, 07:21 PM // 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Wind

To my observation, heroes AI is written in such a way that they always prefer energy based skills over signets and adrenaline skills and they will never use signets if they have energy and ready-to-use energy spells. But as I’ve seen it, hero will never use Signet Devotion even if it’s the only skill in their skill bar. Looks like a bug to me

They do like to use the energy skills... Your heroes will use SoD however, BUT they must be at 0 energy. I only noticed this when a hero monk rebirthed someone and immediately cast Sig of Devo on them. After some testing after that, it appears to be the only time that I can come up with that they will use it. The sad thing is that if they are at 0 energy and need to heal someone, it is likely that the 2 second cast is much to long and the size of the heal is much to small. Oh well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rista blodorn

...Hell's Precipice w/ incompetent PuGs I think that will be my next conquest just need to figure out what hero/hench combination to take with.

Not to hijack the thread or anything, but the incompetence/total lack of people in Hell's Precipice is a little sad. I put up this thread and then started reading through this one.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10166981
It is a decent hero setup to get through Hell's, if a bit uncreative since all my heroes were set up essentially the same. It made very easy work of the bonus (I didn't try to complete the mission because I had already done it al long time ago, but I can't imagine that it would be very difficult with this setup)

Batou of Nine · Jun 12, 2007, 06:19 AM // 06:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

The only monk build there with SoD was the bar I was controlling, I could never get my own heroes to use it.

I guess my advice would be for everyone to just use the henchmen monks then; no need to worry yourself to death over a monk bar for an area that they can work well enough in. Realm of Torment; each mission hero/henched first try with masters (the exception being Gates of Madness because I forgot to capture the Balthazar Shrine ><), Fire Islands ditto all done with one attempt, and I got Poisoned Outcrops out of the way being vanquished (hearing a number of people talk about the difficulty there) but managed it with the henchmen monks for all of those areas. Eternal Grove... had to take a second human, but we still used the henchmen monks to fulfill that role.

To clarify, I've only used those monks on Istan, up to and including Crystal Desert, and Minister Cho's Estate (Zen Daijun has the rit and monk henchmen) on Hard Mode. I never used my hero monks when there were two henchmen available to fulfill the healing roll.

Ah, i see. I really wasn't all that worried about general hero monking. I in fact also use the monk henchies almost exclusively when i am 8 manning alone. The ONLY time i use hero monks are when i am playing with at least one other person who can also bring heros...

LoL, i guess i should also clarify that my modification ideas were simply for player/hero teams, not when a person is 8-manning with only hero/henchies. The setup focuses on general pressure relief in high pressure situations for groups of 2 players or more that need to rely on healer Ai. anywhoo, just a background to my ideas that i didnt quite clarify correctly.

Again, great guide! A good general base for players.

Cheers

Voltar · Jun 15, 2007, 11:56 PM // 23:56

thanks evilsod for making me not feel like an idiot for using the golem (at least in hm). i also second leaving the healing to henchmen in 6 or 8-man areas (because dps is way more important to make each fight shorter and save the monks' energy). generally hench monks only pose a problem if you're melee and you drag them up front with you. prot hench do some silly crap though since factions (where they run up to shortbow range...why do they do that?).

thanks for posting a full-hero set of builds. that should help out the frustrated and stir some ideas in the more experienced players. i've never used norgu (since the quest for him and goren irritate me and they're not required to further the quests). that's pretty much what i'd expect him to be good at since i really hate the ai use of mesmer spells.

pingu666 · Jun 23, 2007, 04:18 AM // 04:18

i use the healer henchies alot, even when i was going for ledgendary survivor on my warrior, only hadto run away once i think :O.

mow/olias use blood ritual really really well, so its well worth chucking that on there bars

payne · Jun 25, 2007, 11:36 AM // 11:36

/agree hench/hero AI is aweful....

i was just wondering what hench and heroes you would reccomend to take when it comes to vanquishing Istan?

if you could tell me i'd be really grateful..

Porkchop Sandwhiches · Jul 10, 2007, 01:46 AM // 01:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by pingu666

mow/olias use blood ritual really really well, so its well worth chucking that on there bars

Also, I don't know if anyone else has said this either, but I make my MM bring holy veil so to help with hex removal (seeing how they cancel veil right away and will only use smite hex near mobs). And when I bring monk heros sometimes I make them /Me with some inspiration interrupts like power drain or leech signet because they are amazing at interrupting, lol.

ibex333 · Aug 04, 2007, 08:48 PM // 20:48

@OP

Now when you given us these great hero builds, why not give us some combinations? What's your most used combo? 2 monks 1 war? 2 necs 1 para?

I don't spend as much time as you thinking about this stuff so I don't know what to do. Call me lazy, but if you were nice enough to give the builds, I bet you're nice enough to give combos. Thanx in advance!

Evilsod · Aug 07, 2007, 12:07 AM // 00:07

In my long line of completely overbuffing my melee attackers i've moved onto using Razah along with Dunkoro...

15 Channeling, (12+3)
12 Restoration, (11+1)
7 Spawning, (6+1)

[skill]Splinter Weapon[/skill][skill]Warmonger's Weapon[/skill][skill]Offering of Spirit[/skill][skill]Mend Body and Soul[/skill][skill]Spirit Light[/skill][skill]Life[/skill][skill]Recuperation[/skill][skill]Flesh of my Flesh[/skill]

Just turn off Warmongers/Splinter... so he doesn't spam them randomly. Only really worth using if you have a Scythe or the usual range of multi-hit axe skills. Warmongers if you feel you need to decimate a few casters and Splinter Weapon works perfectly if you bodyblock things properly round a corner letting you destroy the entire mob in 2 attacks.

Course this isn't for everyone... i've just found completely overbuffing my Dervish and letting minions take the hits and blow up works like a charm for killing pretty much everything... backfires nicely though when you try to kill 3 Azure Shadows and end up taking about 210 damage each attack.

YunSooJin · Aug 14, 2007, 09:44 AM // 09:44

If Racthoh is still responding to this thread: What build did you use for 4man HM in Ascalon? The grawls wont farking die.

Avatara · Aug 15, 2007, 07:49 PM // 19:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by YunSooJin

If Racthoh is still responding to this thread: What build did you use for 4man HM in Ascalon? The grawls wont farking die.

As a warrior I'm using the ele, ritualist and the monk. However areas like the eastern fronier really need 6 players if you ask me...

I changed to DS with enduring harmony myself in order to get enough damage to kill the healers.

karunpav · Aug 16, 2007, 02:36 AM // 02:36

I just went hammer with Backbreaker, should be even easier now with the buff to FGJ, just keep the monks on their butts while you pull the two grawls to him and cast SS on both. They blow up.

Novalon · Sep 15, 2007, 07:11 PM // 19:11

These are wonderful builds, and I have used them (or some derivation) to play through a few areas. If I had any excellent builds to add, I would post them myself, but I still have bugs to work out of my own before I feel I can post them.

Seriously though, this thread deserves to be at the top.

jimmyboveto · Sep 18, 2007, 09:15 PM // 21:15

Nice builds there. I have been going through Cantha doing some vanquishing and HM missions. I have especially grown fond of paragons and jagged bones mm's. Oh ya, and there's one hero build thats totally hax for HM...

Dunkoro
----------
Protection Prayers-16
divine favor-13

Life barrier
Blessed Signet

So ya, dissable both skills, have dunk put LB up on every person in the party, and then enable blessed signet. Even though he'll have -3 ernergy degen, blessed signet will allow him to keep his bar full for the whole time. 50% damage reduction for the whole team is incredibly cheap, especially when most areas don't have enchant removal in PvE.