Curse

ArKaiN · Jun 13, 2007, 03:25 PM // 15:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by red orc

4. corrupt facing 2 sins is so much fun. You put reckless haste + fail + p-bond on one, insidious parasite + p-bond on 2, you still has fainthart to put on someone, then you use your corrupt on anyone. What can the 2 sin do ?
attack me ? lol, one misses 3/4 with 43 hit points and the other I steal 43 each time he attackes. By all means attack please, it will end much faster.

1,2 and 3: Your healing hands-eviscerate analogy implies noobness on SS's.

4: I'm not sure you've ever faced a BoA sin before. As soon as they get on cast range they shadowstep and start combo'ing.

red orc · Jun 14, 2007, 09:01 AM // 09:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArKaiN

1,2 and 3: Your healing hands-eviscerate analogy implies noobness on SS's.

4: I'm not sure you've ever faced a BoA sin before. As soon as they get on cast range they shadowstep and start combo'ing.

As I said: my last 40+ glad points I got with that specific build. Since BOA sin is a very popular build, I think I killed quite a few handreds of them. I know how much damage they can inflict.
The funny thing is: the boa is not even number 2 on my list. Foe number 1 is a ranger. If he gets to interrupt reckless I've lost tons of pressure + I'm going to go down easy. Foe number 2 is the warrior. Because of the synergy with the hits he manage to lend and the amount of damage he can do. For number 3 in the sin.
Anyways on sin I just put insidious parasite + p-bond. Once I do that I can take his whole combo and lol (for every hit he makes he looses 43 health and I gain 43 health). I've yes to find a sin that can take down such a necro. If he's stupid enough to try, he's left with 1/4 of his health, then he push some health regen, in response I push corrupt enhance and the sin is dead.

In most groups I run, I expose myself in front of the group. I try to lure the sin to attack me and not the other casters which come with less armor and less health.

IIIPowerIII · Jun 14, 2007, 05:50 PM // 17:50

If you fight a real sin, you wont even have time to cast Insidious and you'll be KD then degen then dead...

As a necro, Sin is my priority... War are nothing, just slap insidious on them and they'll heal me...

glountz · Jun 14, 2007, 06:08 PM // 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by red orc

As I said: my last 40+ glad points I got with that specific build. Since BOA sin is a very popular build, I think I killed quite a few handreds of them. I know how much damage they can inflict.
The funny thing is: the boa is not even number 2 on my list. Foe number 1 is a ranger. If he gets to interrupt reckless I've lost tons of pressure + I'm going to go down easy. Foe number 2 is the warrior. Because of the synergy with the hits he manage to lend and the amount of damage he can do. For number 3 in the sin.
Anyways on sin I just put insidious parasite + p-bond. Once I do that I can take his whole combo and lol (for every hit he makes he looses 43 health and I gain 43 health). I've yes to find a sin that can take down such a necro. If he's stupid enough to try, he's left with 1/4 of his health, then he push some health regen, in response I push corrupt enhance and the sin is dead.

In most groups I run, I expose myself in front of the group. I try to lure the sin to attack me and not the other casters which come with less armor and less health.

A sin targeting you will own you before you have the time to cast your hexes, especially if you don't target him first. If you happen to own him it is because they generally go after the monk that is nicely healing you, letting you have plenty of time hexing them.
As a BoA sin, if I see a necro, I don't even take the time to hit expose defenses, as you don't have any evade, I SP you and kill you before you finish your hex.
Maybe you can own one sin on a mistake from them. But two, such as you claim? You're not serious.

I'm with ArKain on this.

On Op's buid:
By far Rits spirit spamming are superior to yours IMHO. You have a nice SR bonus, but your spirits die fast, too fast to be of any use if you face an ele cleaner with, say, Savannah heat.

Xiaxhou of Trinity · Jun 14, 2007, 07:01 PM // 19:01

"FLAME ON!!!!!11!!"
-Human Torch

If you've been seriously pvping for glad points and dont know about N/RT SR abuse builds......then I have to say you are near total ignorance. It was one of those abused gimmick builds in HA, and the reason you don't see many in RA is because most people there run the most obvious builds (RaO, purge war, mystic regen enchant abuse derv, standard air spike, SF eles). Also, hope you noticed not many people like to play as healers in there <.<

Rit primary attribute is pretty much completely useless unless going spirit spammer, but I like to play rit primary for the runes. Some builds I picked up and is hilarious how it works too well:
Preservation [E]
Mend Body and Soul
Spirit LIght
Riposte
Deadly Riposte
Bonnetti's Defense
Flesh of My Flesh/optional
Rez Sig/optional

Although it has skills that you just wtf? why are you even in pvp with flesh of my flesh bla bla bla. Flesh is reusable rez, preservation and spirit light cover your health lost, war skills for obvious defense and energy management, rez sig for when you can't afford to use flesh of my flesh. The build is too relient on the spirit, but in RA people go for the rit and not the spirit---idiots. Sometimes I bring draw spirit instead of flesh of my flesh when I'm not messing around and want a glad pt lol.

Yes, a good sin would kill you before you could throw up hexes. My solution? block his *ss with stance/enchant (yay for N/A lol) or you could bring mending touch and grenths balance, but i like to use those for blood builds =]

Lord Natural · Jun 14, 2007, 07:23 PM // 19:23

I don't understand why people bother with these Rt/ and /Rt healer builds. The exception would be N/Rt pre-SR nerf, but now even that build makes as little sense as the others. There's nothing in that Rt build that a monk can't do twice as well. For starters, you have no hex removal at all. This alone means that your glad points will depend entirely on luck -- That is, you'd better hope you don't face 1 or more curses necros which will completely shutdown your melee offense. I've seen some decent Rt/Me support builds using expel, but these are usually designed with weapon spells as well, to buff melee and suppliment a monk.

I can understand running these builds for fun, but running them under the guise of 'glad point farmers' is retarded. Winning with these builds depends on luck (not facing the wrong build), or getting a monk as well (2 healer builds aren't practical). Monking in RA recently, the main problem that presents itself to me is not keeping the team alive, but keeping the offense hex-free. This is why you see more and more monks running dual hex removal (veil+purge, etc.). That's not to say you can't get glad points with Rt/ or /Rt healers, because I have. It's just that more things have to go right for this to happen, which imo defeats the purpose.

phool · Jun 14, 2007, 08:03 PM // 20:03

^agree, rt and n/rt pure healer is more people who fail at monk. So much less versatility, all these builds can do generally if make bars go up. They do it, conditionally on having spirits alive, which are basically just adrenaline fodder for a warrior - they drop as fast as they go up, but gain the warrior adrenaline while costing you energy.

a ritualist can heal effectively without dedicating their bar to it. Go offering of spirit channeling-resto and you can bring a lot to assist both your meleers (warmonger's) and monks (weapon of warding, healing them when they're being shutdown+spiked e.g. hammer warrior) in a 4v4 environment. Alternatively, vengeful weapon+weapon of remedy can be very effective assistance to a monk which goes a long way to reduce pressure (and owns monkless teams, considering this is RA). They also excel at making red bars go up which is of secondary importance (especially on a team of people who actually know how to kite), but still useful. Just don't try to replace them because it doesn't work, I eat people who make this mistake every day in this kind of arena. As an necro you will be helping your monk out a lot more - as well as your offense - running a standard faintheartedness style build; pressure on the other team and makes your monk's job far easier. The direction I'd go with an n/rt is a good array of hexes like reaper's mark, faintheartedness, and then supplement that with restoration heals. Hardly a unique idea, you see a lot of these tiresome teams in TA running multiple hexers and spirits.

"this build must be good, look at my screenshots of glad points!!" really doesn't help me take someone seriously. I have a screenshot I love from ascalon arena of a wammo with mending, pre buff power attack and endure pain, who has 155 wins. I don't have an RA equivalent saved but I've certainly gladded with some appalling builds back in the day, especially before glad titles.

A curses necro can absolutely certainly save themselves form an SP sin btw, whether they're running tiger stance+hoto or not. The reality is, running all minors will save you from an SP sin... or even in most cases a single major. Add insidious (1 second cast) and it's not even funny. Sticking something like price may not only prevent them spiking effectively again for the duration, it'll prevent them auto-attacking. An autoattacking sin at high DM and vamp daggers is a little underated, it'll do a good 500-600 damage in the 15 seconds between spikes and force protting or at the very least kiting from the other team.

Div · Jun 15, 2007, 04:48 AM // 04:48

Maybe I should start posting ZB monk healers and SoR bonders and follow it up with lots of screenshots of me getting glad pts ^^

red orc · Jun 16, 2007, 11:27 AM // 11:27

So maybe you can comment what a corrupt enhance necro can do to your offense and then to you as a sor bonder.
BTW, If you run this kind of necro, use only minors (you have 590 health). Also use melee+5 armor an shield +5 armor and +armor armor. No BOA sin is a to worry about.
Also if the ppl who thinks BOA sins are so strong, please post how many glad points did they bring them.

ArKaiN · Jun 16, 2007, 04:56 PM // 16:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by red orc

So maybe you can comment what a corrupt enhance necro can do to your offense and then to you as a sor bonder.
BTW, If you run this kind of necro, use only minors (you have 590 health). Also use melee+5 armor an shield +5 armor and +armor armor. No BOA sin is a to worry about.
Also if the ppl who thinks BOA sins are so strong, please post how many glad points did they bring them.

BoA(Actually now Tiger Stance) sins are very, VERY strong, specially if used against someone who doesn't know exactly what they do or how fast the spike can be.
The basic build got me 12 glad points so far. My sin is 15 days old.

red orc · Jun 16, 2007, 06:32 PM // 18:32

1. If you want to advocate the sin build you use, please do it in the sin section.
2. I've already got all the glad points I was interested in. All I'm trying to do here is help other ppl use a good necro build for getting glad point, and help them use it wisely. I share what I've learned, cause it will also help them get the glad points.
3. I stongly feel that if you want to get glad points it is better using a strong support character that melee (Using a monk also helps). The reasoning behind it is that unless you're exeptionaly good as melee, the difference in skill (vs the foe) will not grant you 10 wins. But if you're a good support you can close all the missing holes in your group build and have much better chance at 10 wins. I got all my glad points using ele and necro.
4. Even RA is won on a team effort, so you have to look at what you do in that sense. I can try to help see what is going on and why my targetting priority is done that way:
- The most dangarous character for the necro is the one that shuts him down. There for a dom mesmer or an interrupt ranger is foe #1. About the mes, there is nothing I can do, but the ranger I can try to shutdown him before he does it to me.
- Now lets look at the melee: warrior, sin, dervish. I can shutdown upto 2 of them using recless+price and insidious. If I use reckless+price on warrior he cannot gain adrn therefore he cannot use power attacks therefore I get more out of those spells using them on him than on the other character. Now since it is a long process puting them, i want to do it asap. Therefore warrior is #2.

ArKaiN · Jun 16, 2007, 07:29 PM // 19:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by red orc

Also if the ppl who thinks BOA sins are so strong, please post how many glad points did they bring them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by red orc

1. If you want to advocate the sin build you use, please do it in the sin section.

Are you high? I did exactly what you asked me to do.

red orc · Jun 17, 2007, 07:56 AM // 07:56

Let me sum up what you say: sins can cause you harm. OK.
Now if anybody want to comment something constructive as to how necros gain glad points and with what build and how to run it, please do....
but be sure that you've actually gained enough glad points with that build, so you know what you're talking about.

Div · Jun 18, 2007, 05:42 AM // 05:42

Getting glad points means nothing. RA is basically just luck in seeing how good of a team you can get and hoping to not face anything that devastates your team. Sure your build and skill will slightly raise the chance of getting a glad point, but it's only 1/8 of the equation.

red orc · Jun 18, 2007, 08:05 AM // 08:05

After seeing the finals of last tornument I dont think RA is much different, only the palyer level is somewhat weaker. Playing GW you can alway find yourself Vs a build there is nothing you can do about. Therefore the whole issue of RA build is to reduce the probability of that happenning. From the days I played bridge, I know that luck always goes with the better player. This is simply bacause he's palying the odds better.
Now since RA is infested with melee, an anti melee build will improve your odds. On the other hand, you can face a groups that are not melee. say of 3 ele+ monk, what build will enable you to win ? Will the SS do or the corrupt enhance ?

Since current meta has a plethora of builds bringing a very flexible build but still a strong one will help you get more glad points faster.

around · Jun 18, 2007, 08:46 AM // 08:46

Quote:

After seeing the finals of last tornument I dont think RA is much different, only the palyer level is somewhat weaker

lolwut

123456

glountz · Jun 18, 2007, 09:13 AM // 09:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

Getting glad points means nothing. RA is basically just luck in seeing how good of a team you can get and hoping to not face anything that devastates your team. Sure your build and skill will slightly raise the chance of getting a glad point, but it's only 1/8 of the equation.

Don't agree.
Some builds definetively outclass others in terms of glad points farming.
Any melee build is hampered by the large sum of anti-melee hate around there.

BoA sins are an exception however. Expose defense nullify half the melee defense by preventing the blocking, and you kill astonishly fast, adding degen and disruption (KD from falling spiders) in the equation.

You say about monking, but I must say your build will be less central than your monking skill.

So far, spirit spamming communing rits are the builds that gave me the most glad points. THey are simply too strong for RA, where the battlefield is so tiny that you can't easily hide, and where the only objective is to kill (you don't care about mobility).
But also Illusion mesmers. A lot more than Domination ones. You have limited melee defense through distortion, and the average RA character is not prepared to deal with slowing hexes.
What don't work is, for example, warriors. They can be killing machines, but relies on their teamates to be hex/condi/block free. Which you don't have in RA.

phool · Jun 18, 2007, 12:44 PM // 12:44

I get most my RA glad points as a hammer warrior or sp sin. While the success rate is lower than builds like a sor bonder you glad a lot faster with teams that have what it takes. I hate relying on my team to kill, especially against teams with multiple monks, a lot more than I hate relying on team mates to keep me fairly hex/con free. Better to lose 2/3 matches and have a 20 min glad than win 3/4 and have a 40 min glad. Rt spirits tend to promote relatively drawn out matches, especially comm spirits, so I avoid them. And I find them boring to play.

ArKaiN · Jun 18, 2007, 04:36 PM // 16:36

Illusion mesmers weren't that hot until they made freaking clumsiness recharge at that speed.
I've had a mesmed do the following to me as a warrior:
attack-interrupted by clumsiness
attack-interrupted by clumsiness
attack-Interrupted by ineptitude
...mending touch-interrupted by power leech

Seriously, gay.

XvArchonvX · Jun 18, 2007, 05:09 PM // 17:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArKaiN

Illusion mesmers weren't that hot until they made freaking clumsiness recharge at that speed.
I've had a mesmed do the following to me as a warrior:
attack-interrupted by clumsiness
attack-interrupted by clumsiness
attack-Interrupted by ineptitude
...mending touch-interrupted by power leech

Seriously, gay.

Well any good warrior runs with Mantra of Resolve and Diversion!! Duh!!!

LoL, yea, as fun as Clumsiness is, I think it's a bit too much since there's enough melee hate out there as it is.