Curse

Mournblade · May 05, 2007, 12:53 AM // 00:53

I'm partial to Furious myself, but I carry a Vamp and an Elemental weapon with me at all times.

Diddy bow · May 05, 2007, 01:38 AM // 01:38

Vamp is my fav, furious if im felling lazy. Zelous is nice on some builds to though and an ele switch is handy. conditions lentheners are a bit usless most of the time, cripple and daze can be good but mosly rubbish :P

20/20, it relies to much on chance so you thinking "so deos furious n00b" but no matter what hit furious comes on you will get 2 strikes. 20/20 needs to activate at a key moment to be usful, admitedly if it deos it can do nice damage

kumarshah · May 05, 2007, 04:22 AM // 04:22

I run furious and vamp right now.

Darkpower Alchemist · May 05, 2007, 04:58 AM // 04:58

I am a fan of furious, but what about the differences between elemental hilts? Shock hilts should, in elemental respects, do more penetration at a more consistant rate than any sundering mod. Not to mention the use of Conjure Lightning.

That alone makes an elemental hilt superior to any sundering mod.

Lutae · May 05, 2007, 04:59 AM // 04:59

In PvE, an elemental weapon is almost neccessary in order to be a decent warrior against those things with unnaturally high armor against physical damage (such as jade armors).

Marksmen of Hell · May 05, 2007, 05:37 AM // 05:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkpower Alchemist

I am a fan of furious, but what about the differences between elemental hilts? Shock hilts should, in elemental respects, do more penetration at a more consistant rate than any sundering mod. Not to mention the use of Conjure Lightning.

That alone makes an elemental hilt superior to any sundering mod.

I may be misunderstanding your comment, here, but, unlike most air magic spells that do lightning damage, i dont think that the shocking upgrades do an aditional armor penetration, unless you are talking about using it vs a warrior that has a lower armor level vs any elemental damage than with physical damage.

I personally, like those before me, like a vampiric for the added dmg, elemental vs warriors, furious when running high adrenaline builds (when it comes into efect after using Dragon Slash is pretty cool), and zelous for high energy builds (usually use it on my Triple chop, Cyclone axe axe build as that way i can reclaim energy faster). Never been too much of a fan with the sundering (or even fortitude, but thats another issue).

farmpig · May 05, 2007, 05:39 AM // 05:39

agreed fort mods are a waste of time

Baba_Beast · May 05, 2007, 05:55 AM // 05:55

In my opinion: elemental>all (in PVP)
just think about it: what is the only class who got a better defense against elemental than physical? rangers. and what class is the less played in GVGs? rangers.

elemental is simply the best cause of armor ignoring VS the other warriors and all the conjure skills that aplly alot of pressure

just check it: with a conjure skill you do around 15 more damage per hit
with sundering you'll do about 40 more damage 1hit/5

5x15=75>40

also sundering is just luck. you cannot time your eviscerate with your sundering cause you just dont know when its gonna happen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by farmpig

agreed fort mods are a waste of time

+30 health is maybe the last second you will survive to let your monk time to use ZB. it is not THAT good but I dont see any other mods that are better.
+5 armor is good, but VS high degens it's useless, when fortitude is handy in all kind of situation.

farmpig · May 05, 2007, 06:22 AM // 06:22

with a -7 or -8 health degen +30 hp is gone even faster than ur hero's AI could react or any experience player monk for that matter jus make sure u have above 500 hp if u r worried of high degen area..

iridescentfyre · May 05, 2007, 06:35 AM // 06:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkpower Alchemist

I am a fan of furious, but what about the differences between elemental hilts? Shock hilts should, in elemental respects, do more penetration at a more consistant rate than any sundering mod. Not to mention the use of Conjure Lightning.

That alone makes an elemental hilt superior to any sundering mod.

I see what your logic here is, but I think you're assuming that that 25% Armor Penetration in most Air Magic spells is a universal, innate stat that occurs in all Lightning damage. To the best of my knowledge, that isn't the case... only the Air Magic spells that specifically say that they have 25% penetration actually have it. The elemental weapon mods don't do anything more than convert your damage from Physical slashing/blunt/piercing to the basic elemental damage. They'll do more damage to targets with less armor vs. that (or any) element, but nothing more.

As for the decision about WHICH element mod to use, that depends entirely on what your target will be. In pve, some enemies are vulnerable to fire or cold. In pvp, Earth damage mods seem the most popular since if a player has extra armor vs. an element, its generally not Earth for some reason. But against another Warrior, it only matters that you're using any elemental mod.

Darkpower Alchemist · May 05, 2007, 08:45 AM // 08:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by iridescentfyre

I see what your logic here is, but I think you're assuming that that 25% Armor Penetration in most Air Magic spells is a universal, innate stat that occurs in all Lightning damage. To the best of my knowledge, that isn't the case... only the Air Magic spells that specifically say that they have 25% penetration actually have it. The elemental weapon mods don't do anything more than convert your damage from Physical slashing/blunt/piercing to the basic elemental damage. They'll do more damage to targets with less armor vs. that (or any) element, but nothing more.

Well, the fact is that no one has ever discussed or studied that line of thinking, due to the thought that elemental damage is universal, which it obviously can't be since every lightning skill/spell causes a natural 25% armor penatration. That being the case, logically, shock mods would also have such armor penatration bonuses as well. If not, then they should.

Though no facts are presented beyond logical thinking, that only means that if this is not the case, then the guy who made the mechanic wasn't being very logical. Either way, it doesn't change anything currently.

isamu kurosawa · May 05, 2007, 12:21 PM // 12:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkpower Alchemist

Well, the fact is that no one has ever discussed or studied that line of thinking, due to the thought that elemental damage is universal, which it obviously can't be since every lightning skill/spell causes a natural 25% armor penatration. That being the case, logically, shock mods would also have such armor penatration bonuses as well. If not, then they should.

Though no facts are presented beyond logical thinking, that only means that if this is not the case, then the guy who made the mechanic wasn't being very logical. Either way, it doesn't change anything currently.

Well lightning surge doesnt have 25%AP, and neither does a shocking mod. The only bonus' they have agianst each other are triggering other skills such as shocking=glimmering mark/thunderclap, icy=spinal shivers, ebon=ebon dust aura, firey=mark of rodgort.

I personaly use a zamp, zealous, furious and icy for every weapon, though i use ebon for my sin and firey for ranger.

i used to use mostly defence mods, but am switching to fortitude as prot hero's are amazing

iridescentfyre · May 05, 2007, 09:53 PM // 21:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkpower Alchemist

Well, the fact is that no one has ever discussed or studied that line of thinking, due to the thought that elemental damage is universal, which it obviously can't be since every lightning skill/spell causes a natural 25% armor penatration. That being the case, logically, shock mods would also have such armor penatration bonuses as well. If not, then they should.

Though no facts are presented beyond logical thinking, that only means that if this is not the case, then the guy who made the mechanic wasn't being very logical. Either way, it doesn't change anything currently.

Take a little run over to the Isle of the Nameless and compare damage from a Shocking mod to a Fiery/Ebon/Icy mod. It may be logical that it has 25% AP from a realistic standpoint, but not from a game balance one. Why put 20/20 Sundering mods into the game if a 25/100 one already existed? And how much cash do you think the player economy would demand for such a mod? Shocking mods currently go for 500g or less.

Besides, 25% Shocking damage already does insane damage to Warriors from the Elementalist spells that use it. Imagine someone with a 25% AP all-the-time elemental weapon. They'd be doing 100+ damage per hit to a fully-armored warrior. That doesn't seem logical to me at all.

Utaku · May 05, 2007, 10:34 PM // 22:34

Channeling spells deal lightning damage without armor penetration, so the argument "lightning always has armor penetration" is wrong anyway.

blue.rellik · May 06, 2007, 04:12 AM // 04:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by farmpig

with a -7 or -8 health degen +30 hp is gone even faster than ur hero's AI could react or any experience player monk for that matter jus make sure u have above 500 hp if u r worried of high degen area..

Well +30 hp is the best hilt you could have against degen

Both defense and hp have their ups and downs

farmpig · May 06, 2007, 04:29 AM // 04:29

people tend to forget they are still constantly taking damage form other sources when they have degen on then and those dam can be reduced with an armour mod ..... havent any1 considered that lol.

unless all creatures in the mob only do degen damage without hitting u than that would make the +30 a fraction of a second better off

blue.rellik · May 06, 2007, 04:50 AM // 04:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by farmpig

people tend to forget they are still constantly taking damage form other sources when they have degen on then and those dam can be reduced with an armour mod ..... havent any1 considered that lol.

unless all creatures in the mob only do degen damage without hitting u than that would make the +30 a faction of a second better off

And you forget a warrior generally will have a monk behind him

farmpig · May 06, 2007, 07:49 AM // 07:49

what has a monk behind the warrior got to do with a warrior taking damage while under degen lol

i wonder what the monk is doing "behind" the warrior btw lol

Don Zardeone · May 06, 2007, 10:45 PM // 22:45

A warrior is heavily armoured.
After the armour that he wears, the insignias, the absorption, the skills he uses and the shields... after all that, those +5 al really don't make that much of a difference anymore.

In fact, those +30health are nice to give your monk a big area to heal into.

500+health is what a warrior should have imo so if you can fit in another +5 defense.. fine fine.

iridescentfyre · May 07, 2007, 03:45 AM // 03:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by farmpig

what has a monk behind the warrior got to do with a warrior taking damage while under degen lol

Errr.. you do play this game, right?