Curse

khanites · Dec 13, 2007, 02:30 PM // 14:30

i need some advice on the secondary. which is more effective to go for more damage , conjure frost on weapon or put curse on the monsters such as cracked armor? i.e W/E or W/N? I would prefer more damage since it looks and feels more good.

txs

thor thunder · Dec 13, 2007, 02:40 PM // 14:40

i hope your multiy posting was an acident its against the rules
i would go with W/E tho to answer OP

khanites · Dec 13, 2007, 02:52 PM // 14:52

yes the multipost was an accident and couldn't easily delete the other posts

thor thunder · Dec 13, 2007, 03:48 PM // 15:48

did you try edit > advanced > delete thread??

khanites · Dec 13, 2007, 03:54 PM // 15:54

also with regards the conjur spell, are there a lot of areas where the monster remove the enchantment so the conjur, 60 sec would be useless while the curse spell maybe better?

i will try to delete the other posts. sorry

iridescentfyre · Dec 13, 2007, 03:58 PM // 15:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by khanites

are there a lot of areas where the monster remove the enchantment

Not really. If you're going into such an area, just don't bring it. Don't be afraid to be "just" a warrior. Plus, by the time you'll start running into any considerable enchantment removal, you'll be able to change your secondary anyway.

thor thunder · Dec 13, 2007, 04:58 PM // 16:58

yeah ench removel is very uncommin in PvE.
/N isnt that bad but the enegry costs kill you necros dont have many signets or low cost energy skills that are good for warriors.

MercenaryK · Dec 13, 2007, 06:22 PM // 18:22

Plague Touch is about the one or few good Necro skills it can be used.

No need to put points in to Curse

What I used to do with W/E for PvE is

[skill]Conjure Flame[/skill]
[skill]Inferno[/skill]

khanites · Dec 13, 2007, 06:32 PM // 18:32

i will continue with W/E but to conjure, which is the best and why, fire, frost or earth in terms of EFFECT and VISUALS (i will be going with full fire elementalist player so some variation would be good) and difficulty in getting good appropriate weapons. Am right in thinking, fire tends to be more damage and frost is more armor? how about air?

txs

iridescentfyre · Dec 13, 2007, 07:02 PM // 19:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by khanites

Am right in thinking, fire tends to be more damage and frost is more armor? how about air?

No. The damage from Conjure Flame = Conjure Frost = Conjure Lightning assuming equal points in Fire/Air/Water magic. The only difference is what damage type its dealing. Some things are more vulnerable to one damage type over another (i.e. ice creatures are obviously vulnerable to fire, plants to slashing and cold damage, skeletons to blunt damage), but generally its such a minor factor you don't need to be bothered with it. Some warrior enemies in PvE appear to be more vulnerable to elemental damage in general, but that includes all four elements.

As for visuals, aside from the silly casting animation there is none. If you expect your sword to be bathed in fire from Conjure Flame, you'll be disappointed.

Personally I run Conjure Flame if anything, because my ele heroes frequently carry Mark of Rodgort and Earthen Shackles.

Solus Spartan · Dec 14, 2007, 02:45 AM // 02:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by MercenaryK

Plague Touch is about the one or few good Necro skills it can be used.

No need to put points in to Curse

What I used to do with W/E for PvE is

[skill]Conjure Flame[/skill]
[skill]Inferno[/skill]

And no [skill]Fire Storm[/skill]?

Disgrace to Hamstorm.

You can't see me · Dec 14, 2007, 03:07 AM // 03:07

W/N, if either of the two. Plague touch is very nice, and IMO, will come in more handy than Firestorm, Inferno, and Conjure spells.

Savio · Dec 14, 2007, 04:17 AM // 04:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by You can't see me

W/N, if either of the two. Plague touch is very nice, and IMO, will come in more handy than Firestorm, Inferno, and Conjure spells.

Conjure boosts your damage. Boosting your damage is good.

Plague Touch removes a condition. While good, you have monks who can do that for you.

skydrake · Dec 14, 2007, 07:41 AM // 07:41

I recommend you'd be W/N. If you are asking this question, chances are you are starting up, meaning you don't have weapon with elemental mod, nor the money to buy one from player. Therefore conjure X spell is out of the question. By the time you can get one, you should be able to change your secondary job.

W/N on the other hand, comes with Plague Touch which you can use without any special equipments.

draxynnic · Dec 14, 2007, 09:02 AM // 09:02

Hey! I managed!

On the question of choosing element... since all the Conjures have identical effects, I'd suggest looking at the other skills available for the element - since if you're only going to be using the conjure, you might as well just spend it putting more points in Strength. Of the various elements, I take Fire more often than not for the more efficient PBAOE close-range blasts - and for the extra burning if there are Marks of Rodgort floating around. Since Inferno is Core, going Fire should work regardless of campaign. For the others, what campaigns you have access to starts to make a big difference.

For Air, you'd be looking at Lightning Touch (if you have an ally using Water Magic), Shock (use it carefully due to exhaustion, but good for unconditional knockdowns on demand), Windborne Speed, and Whirlwind (lacks the exhaustion of Shock and has an area effect, but not as reliable for the knockdowns) in Prophecies. Factions just gives you Teinei's Wind, while Nightfall just has Storm Djinn's Haste.

For Water, you only get a PBAOE in Prophecies (Frozen Burst), and in my experience it's too expensive to be practical. It has a general function for snaring, but that's rarely needed in PvE. More important are the armour enchantments: Prophecies gives Armor of Frost and Armor of Mist, which are both decent as prebuffs before charging in (but have the disadvantage of having shorter durations then recharge). The most important is probably Frigid Armour in Nightfall - being immune to being set on fire can save you a lot of hurt in some areas.

While it doesn't have a Conjure skill, don't underestimate Earth: It's possibly the most useful for a W/E, second only (if second at all) to Fire. Armor of Earth is an impressive armour bonus if you don't expect to have to be quick on your feet, and there's always the infamous Hammer/Aftershock combination - and carrying a Ward or two on your bar will save the squishy Elementalist from having to run in and cast it for you. Individual campaigns each have their own additions to the Earth line that are useful to the W/E, but for a starting W/E I'd recommend getting Armor of Earth early on (not hard in Prophecies and Factions) and relying on that until you get an elemental weapon to use Conjure on.

Alternatively, I made my way from Ascalon until I got my first fiery sword (somewhere in Southern Kryta, I believe... it was a while ago) off Lava Font and Phoenix, and then off Inferno and Phoenix - it gets a few funny looks, but it works. However, if you go all-out with the PBAOEs in this fashion you will be using a lot of energy, so make sure your Warrior skills are mostly adrenal-based (and even then you may want extra energy reserves, energy management, or both).

Comparing to a W/N: I don't have much experience with a W/N, so I can't really comment. My general feeling, however, is that having the warrior pre-hex the targets is using time that can be used bashing the targets - it's better to have the hexes come off a dedicated hexer, who therefor isn't splitting their attributes so much to do so. That said, Skydrake has a good point regarding Plague Touch, which is certainly a popular option - but my gut feeling is that if you start as a W/N and decide to switch to W/E you'll find yourself with more catchup skill purchases to pay for (due to missing out on getting them for free through questing on the way) than going the other way around.

So, to summarise: My (admittedly biased) suggestion is to go W/E: you can probably use Earth until you get an elemental weapon. Once you get a choice of weapons, Fire is probably the best choice for using with Conjure for most situations, as the Fire PBAOEs are more useful to a W/E then any of the Air or Water skills... unless you specifically want one of those skills.

Also, as a footnote: It might be worth occasionally advertising to offer to buy a weapon of the elemental type you need once you get to the higher-end areas, if you don't already have one. Elemental warrior weapons get merched regularly, so if you manage to catch someone about to do so you might be able to pick one up cheaply.

MercenaryK · Dec 14, 2007, 09:28 AM // 09:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solus Spartan

And no [skill]Fire Storm[/skill]?

Disgrace to Hamstorm.

I am ashamed

kobey · Dec 14, 2007, 09:48 AM // 09:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by MercenaryK

I am ashamed

Nothing wrong with bringing Firestorm as a W/E just for the fun of it. :P

I recently brought Mending + Healing Breeze on my Whammo while running a customer through GOP. It was funny though, had a good laugh and was trying to think how were whammos in the past able to cast healing breeze... cos i never had a chance to cast it (always below 10 energy)

If you are maximising dmg, go for efficient builds, if you are bored and wants to try 'funny' builds, Firestorm warrior is not that bad :P

At least you can laugh at the responses of the pug u r with when u cast tat :P

LightningHell · Dec 14, 2007, 09:58 AM // 09:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by draxynnic

On the question of choosing element... since all the Conjures have identical effects, I'd suggest looking at the other skills available for the element - since if you're only going to be using the conjure, you might as well just spend it putting more points in Strength. Of the various elements, I take Fire more often than not for the more efficient PBAOE close-range blasts - and for the extra burning if there are Marks of Rodgort floating around. Since Inferno is Core, going Fire should work regardless of campaign. For the others, what campaigns you have access to starts to make a big difference.

The only reason why you would spend points into Strength is if you have a few powerhouse skills there. And more often than not, you don't need an awful amount of strength, so you can spec decently into the element of your choice just for Conjure. A Warrior doesn't/can't use Elementalist spells effectively for damage.

If you're going to take Fire PBAoEs, you might as well go run Warrior skills.

Quote:

For Air, you'd be looking at Lightning Touch (if you have an ally using Water Magic), Shock (use it carefully due to exhaustion, but good for unconditional knockdowns on demand), Windborne Speed, and Whirlwind (lacks the exhaustion of Shock and has an area effect, but not as reliable for the knockdowns) in Prophecies. Factions just gives you Teinei's Wind, while Nightfall just has Storm Djinn's Haste.

The only spell here that is worth looking at is Shock, and that's mostly for PvP as anti-kiting and disruption.

Quote:

For Water, you only get a PBAOE in Prophecies (Frozen Burst), and in my experience it's too expensive to be practical. It has a general function for snaring, but that's rarely needed in PvE. More important are the armour enchantments: Prophecies gives Armor of Frost and Armor of Mist, which are both decent as prebuffs before charging in (but have the disadvantage of having shorter durations then recharge). The most important is probably Frigid Armour in Nightfall - being immune to being set on fire can save you a lot of hurt in some areas.

Generally a Warrior shouldn't need to use armor buffs. If you need to use armor buffs, either you're playing badly, or your party's playing badly, or both. SY! should be more than enough.

Quote:

While it doesn't have a Conjure skill, don't underestimate Earth: It's possibly the most useful for a W/E, second only (if second at all) to Fire. Armor of Earth is an impressive armour bonus if you don't expect to have to be quick on your feet, and there's always the infamous Hammer/Aftershock combination - and carrying a Ward or two on your bar will save the squishy Elementalist from having to run in and cast it for you. Individual campaigns each have their own additions to the Earth line that are useful to the W/E, but for a starting W/E I'd recommend getting Armor of Earth early on (not hard in Prophecies and Factions) and relying on that until you get an elemental weapon to use Conjure on.

I echo the above. Carrying a ward or two generally depletes your mana, as well as not being as useful when cast on a midline.

Quote:

So, to summarise: My (admittedly biased) suggestion is to go W/E: you can probably use Earth until you get an elemental weapon. Once you get a choice of weapons, Fire is probably the best choice for using with Conjure for most situations, as the Fire PBAOEs are more useful to a W/E then any of the Air or Water skills... unless you specifically want one of those skills.

So, to summarise: My (admittedly biased) suggestion is that your Warrior should only take a Conjure from the Elementalist line in PvE.

MercenaryK · Dec 14, 2007, 10:39 AM // 10:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

The only reason why you would spend points into Strength is if you have a few powerhouse skills there. And more often than not, you don't need an awful amount of strength, so you can spec decently into the element of your choice just for Conjure. A Warrior doesn't/can't use Elementalist spells effectively for damage.

If you're going to take Fire PBAoEs, you might as well go run Warrior skills.

The only spell here that is worth looking at is Shock, and that's mostly for PvP as anti-kiting and disruption.

Generally a Warrior shouldn't need to use armor buffs. If you need to use armor buffs, either you're playing badly, or your party's playing badly, or both. SY! should be more than enough.

I echo the above. Carrying a ward or two generally depletes your mana, as well as not being as useful when cast on a midline.

So, to summarise: My (admittedly biased) suggestion is that your Warrior should only take a Conjure from the Elementalist line in PvE.

Actually, PBAoE from the fire branch can serve a good purpose on a warrior build; a bar with Conjure Flame + Inferno/Flame Burst is good. I go with Inferno since it needs less Fire Magic to do high damage.

Slap that on a bar full of adrenaline and all your energy goes towards those spells. I mean, doing 100+ damage to surrounding foes, what Warrior skill can do that much reliable damage to all adjacent foes? Sure it isn't spammable, but you have the benefit that you'll do extra damage, and it gets around block/blind.

And using armor skills on a Warrior is no shame. Using just one that has low draw backs is suitable; Doylak Signet and Armor of Earth, unless you're trying to tank, aren't worth using. The Water Magic armor spells are very nice. Most are +physical rather than +armor. The anti-burning & +armor spell is freaking amazing. Situational? Yes. Damn useful? Oh yeah.

But it is true that WY! or SY! is more beneficial since those also buff the party.

LightningHell · Dec 14, 2007, 12:19 PM // 12:19

[skill]Dragon Slash[/skill][skill]Flail[/skill][skill]"Save Yourselves!"[/skill][skill]Enraging Charge[/skill][skill]Conjure Flame[/skill][skill]Enduring Harmony[/skill][skill]"For Great Justice!"[/skill][skill]Resurrection Signet[/skill]

What skill are you going to drop for a PBAoE? Also, PBAoEs have a terrible aftercast.

Quote:

I mean, doing 100+ damage to surrounding foes, what Warrior skill can do that much reliable damage to all adjacent foes?

[skill]Whirlwind Attack[/skill][skill]Triple Chop[/skill]