Curse

miprat · Jan 03, 2008, 03:40 PM // 15:40

Well thanks to the help I received from people on this board(Thanks alot) this is the build i made for my paragon. I seem to be running into both adrenaline and energy issues. I guess i am not using the skills in progression correctly. Any advice would be great.

Focused Anger
"Save Yourselves!"
"They're on Fire!"
"There's Nothing to Fear!"
Aggressive Refrain
"For Great Justice!"
Blazing Spear
Spear of Lightning
Attributes Leadership 12
Spear Mastery 14
Tactics 10

**also I tried to just copy and paste the build links in but that didnt work, anyone know how to do that? thanks

Turbobusa · Jan 03, 2008, 04:34 PM // 16:34

Try putting GftE in there replacing spear of lightning.
about adrenaline, I don't know, maybe you forgot to...attack?

Siirius Black · Jan 03, 2008, 04:38 PM // 16:38

Just copy the keys and in GW, use the template option
the template will dispay the build currently in use by your character, paste the new key replacing the old one, and you are ready to save it/ load it, etc.

odly · Jan 03, 2008, 04:53 PM // 16:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by miprat

Well thanks to the help I received from people on this board(Thanks alot) this is the build i made for my paragon. I seem to be running into both adrenaline and energy issues. I guess i am not using the skills in progression correctly. Any advice would be great.

Focused Anger
"Save Yourselves!"
"They're on Fire!"
"There's Nothing to Fear!"
Aggressive Refrain
"For Great Justice!"
Blazing Spear
Spear of Lightning
Attributes Leadership 12
Spear Mastery 14
Tactics 10

**also I tried to just copy and paste the build links in but that didnt work, anyone know how to do that? thanks

Paragon's use adrenalin shouts to generate their energy. The only skill you have that does that is "Save Yourselves!". At 8 adrenaline it's not the best at the job. Without energy you won't be able to reactivate "For Great Justice!" and "Focused Anger" which serve you to generate more adrenalin.

All those are good skills, but a badly balanced build.

You have 3 skills that give great passive defense : "Save yourselves", "They're on fire" and "There's nothhing to fear". You probably won't need all three.

You'll need another adrenalin shout. Most people use either "go for the eyes" or "watch yourself!" or both. You can basiclly drop any of the other skills you want for them. Drop one of the three protection ones and keep the attack skills for more damage. Keep all three protection ones and drop an attack for max party defense buff.

ToF is only good if you have Searing Flames elementalists in your party. If you were counting on Blazing spear, that simply does not cause enough burning for ToF to be good.

Since you're build seems designed for Save Yourselves upkeep I'd drop They're on Fire and take watch yourselves (fill up the gap's when SY is down) or Go for the eyes. You'll have to take your points out of tactics and put them in command then. (remember to switch shield too.)

Skye Marin · Jan 03, 2008, 05:15 PM // 17:15

Take out "They're on Fire" and put in "Go For the Eyes!" Or "Watch yourself!". You have no way to produce mass burning (unless you are paired with a few SF eles) and TNtF + Save Yourself is pretty good anyways.

Also, Focused Anger is bugged, so watch out. It won't go over 100% more adrenaline in-game.

Racthoh · Jan 03, 2008, 07:49 PM // 19:49

Why do you have 10 tactics?

I would change Blazing Spear for an energy spear attack. I'm going to assume you're hitting Blazing Spear as it fills meaning you're not using SY as often as possible meaning you will have energy issues. You'll also want everyone in your bubble so your energy return on SY is six.

Drop They're On Fire!; even if you have a way to produce burning you don't need it with roughly 90% reduction of damage. 12 leadership is enough to maintain Aggressive Refrain with just TNTF provided to know how to hit it on recharge (which is basically the best way to use it anyway).

Quote:

Originally Posted by odly

The only skill you have that does that is "Save Yourselves!". At 8 adrenaline it's not the best at the job.

With FA and FGJ, it's only every four attacks to fill. Under Aggressive Refrain that's less than five seconds for six energy. Follow up every SY with an attack skill and your energy should be fine, only unload them on recharge when you have a target that has to die.

Quote:

Originally Posted by odly

Since you're build seems designed for Save Yourselves upkeep I'd drop They're on Fire and take watch yourselves (fill up the gap's when SY is down) or Go for the eyes.

Bringing other adrenaline skills adds to the time that SY is down. +100 AL > me getting some energy back.

miprat · Jan 03, 2008, 09:03 PM // 21:03

I only had 10 in tactics because I had a tactics shield and had exta points.
I must say I really like playing this paragon even though of my 9 characters it seems the most complicated one I have.
Ok so let me get this straight. AF should always be my first cast to start things off then TNTF is next? At what point in my sequence should I be casting Focused Anger? I have been casting it 3rd or am I supposed to be casting attacks before i cast that?

kullwarrior · Jan 03, 2008, 11:27 PM // 23:27

I just have this and I get too much energy mostly:
Pure support ftw!
"Fall Back!"
"Never Surrender!"
"They're on Fire!"
"Save Yourselves!"
Focused Anger
"For Great Justice!"
Aggressive Refrain
"There's Nothing to fear!"
Leadership 12+3+1
Command 12+1
Spear 3

Deathless Anthem · Jan 04, 2008, 12:10 AM // 00:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by kullwarrior

I just have this and I get too much energy mostly:
Pure support ftw!
"Fall Back!"
"Never Surrender!"
"They're on Fire!"
"Save Yourselves!"
Focused Anger
"For Great Justice!"
Aggressive Refrain
"There's Nothing to fear!"
Leadership 12+3+1
Command 12+1
Spear 3

That's the best build for pure support for a para imho

Arkantos · Jan 04, 2008, 12:13 AM // 00:13

With FA and SY, you should never run into energy problems unless you're not hitting things.

Racthoh · Jan 04, 2008, 12:53 AM // 00:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deathless Anthem

That's the best build for pure support for a para imho

Pretty sure 'best' and 'pure support' cannot go in the same sentence.

Ensign · Jan 04, 2008, 02:26 AM // 02:26

I'm sure there's a best 'pure support' bar, but it's kinda like being the best daggergon - sure, you've optimized something, but does it matter at all?

Terraban · Jan 04, 2008, 03:17 AM // 03:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deathless Anthem

That's the best build for pure support for a para imho

Congratulations, you just won in the Special Olympics!

blue.rellik · Jan 04, 2008, 04:57 AM // 04:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by miprat

I only had 10 in tactics because I had a tactics shield and had exta points.
I must say I really like playing this paragon even though of my 9 characters it seems the most complicated one I have.
Ok so let me get this straight. AF should always be my first cast to start things off then TNTF is next? At what point in my sequence should I be casting Focused Anger? I have been casting it 3rd or am I supposed to be casting attacks before i cast that?

Why do you have a tactics shield?

Are you too good for a Command one?

ShadowbaneX · Jan 04, 2008, 07:10 AM // 07:10

my para build is something like this

[skill]Spear of Lightning[/skill][skill]Barbed Spear[/skill][skill]Cruel Spear[/skill][skill]Anthem of Flame[/skill][skill]"There's Nothing to Fear!"[/skill][skill]"Watch Yourself!"[/skill][skill]Aggressive Refrain[/skill][skill]Sunspear Rebirth Signet[/skill]

Leadership 11+1
Spear Mastery 10+1+1
Tactics 10

I've found that for proper energy maintenance on a paragon you need either "Watch Yourself!" or "Go for the Eyes!" (there's a reason why these skills were recently given a recharge). With 12 Leadership (and enough people nearby) you get 6 energy back every time you use it, which is, rather often. You only need energy for Anthem of Flame, "TNtF!" and Spear of Lightning as Aggressive Refain is fairly easy to keep up (although damn it's cracked armour). Given that you gain energy on Anthem of Flame, that's pretty much a non-isses. "TNtF!" is only used every 20 seconds or so, in combat, so that's no problem. Which just leaves you tossing away 5 energy every once in a while for Spear of Lightning.

odly · Jan 04, 2008, 08:22 AM // 08:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

With FA and FGJ, it's only every four attacks to fill. Under Aggressive Refrain that's less than five seconds for six energy.

Although that feels right to me it shouldn't be.

8 adrenalin for SY.
1 attack --> 1 adrenalin
1 attack under FA --> 2 adrenalin.
1 attack under FA and FGJ --> 4 adrenalin.

2 attacks should be enough to fill SY. But it certainly feels longer to me.
Doesn't FGJ double the adrenalin from FA ?
[note to self]I must go test this on Isle of the nameless when I get home this evening.[/note]
But since both have downtime is it better to alternate them instead of overlapping them ?
Has anyone tried the asuran benefits skill on this to get faster skill recharge on FGJ and FA ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

Bringing other adrenaline skills adds to the time that SY is down. +100 AL > me getting some energy back.

Yes I stand corrected.

If I don't use SY all the time, it's exactly because of this. I feel it limits me too much in what other skills I can bring. Any adrenalin skill will add to SY downtime. Any skills with activation time (songs/anthems...) also add to SY downtime because you're not attacking. So basically I'm reduced to a couple (low) energy (instant activation) shouts and energy attacks. But SY doesn't give enough energy to hit multiple energy attacks on recharge. It pays for just one. Well maybe 2 if you use spear of fury under FA and FGJ the adrenalin gain wil pay back for the energy cost.

Hmm, if I'm totally honnest with myself, I must admit that I don't use SY because I have just a lowly rank 1 allegiance and I hate the fact that my skill is sub-optimal because I refuse to grind for it. But the above statement is part of the reason too. :-)

What does your basic SY skill bar look like these days Racthoh ?

Arkantos · Jan 04, 2008, 12:08 PM // 12:08

Adrenaline cap is 100%, FA and FGJ don't stack. FGJ is used when FA is down.

odly · Jan 04, 2008, 12:47 PM // 12:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

Adrenaline cap is 100%, FA and FGJ don't stack. FGJ is used when FA is down.

Does that mean using a furious spear mod with one these skills active is absolutelly useless ?

Arkantos · Jan 04, 2008, 12:50 PM // 12:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by odly

Does that mean using a furious spear mod with one these skills active is absolutelly useless ?

FA/FGJ give xxx% more adrenaline, while the effect of furious is double adrenaline. I think they do, but I may be wrong.

Racthoh · Jan 04, 2008, 12:54 PM // 12:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by odly

But since both have downtime is it better to alternate them instead of overlapping them ?

As Arkantos said you bring both to maintain a 100% adrenaline gain all the time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by odly

I feel it limits me too much in what other skills I can bring.

Somewhat. The first five skills are basically set in stone; Aggressive Refrain, "Save Yourselves!", Focused Anger, "There's Nothing To Fear!", For "Great Justice!". You have three slots left. Most players will take Signet of Return so we're down to two. Fill them with attack skills. At this point you're limited in general as paragons do not have many decent attack skills to choose from. Vicious Attack and Spear of Lightning are going to be your best route.

Quote:

Originally Posted by odly

Well maybe 2 if you use spear of fury under FA and FGJ the adrenalin gain wil pay back for the energy cost.

This is another option of course. Spear of Fury + one other energy attack skill should allow you to just mash on recharge. It really isn't needed though unless there is a target that has to die you should be able to just pace your usage.

Quote:

Originally Posted by odly

What does your basic SY skill bar look like these days Racthoh ?

Basically what I wrote above:

Aggressive Refrain
Save Yourselves!
Focused Anger {E}
There's Nothing To Fear!
For Great Justice!
Vicious Attack/Wild Throw
Spear of Lightning/Swift Javelin
Ebon Battle Standard of Honor/I Am The Strongest!

Spear Mastery: 12 + 1 + 1
Leadership: 11 + 1
Motivation: 6 + 1 (I have a req 7 15 AL shield)

If I'm playing hero hench I have a hero that maintains Dark Fury and Order of Pain a lot resulting in an SY every two attacks. It results in a lot of energy so I can hit my energy attacks as often as I want. When I have this hero I use Swift Javelin as Spear of Lightning does not benefit from Order of Pain (it converts all the damage to elemental).

I will bring Wild Throw in an instance where I am with a full to near-full human group, that is heavy on physicals, and we're expecting a good number of enemies with an evasion stance to speed up the killing. Otherwise I stick with Vicious Attack and give both my paragon heroes Wild Throw microing as necessary.

I take "I Am The Strongest!" again when in those full to near-full human situations. Without the Dark Fury spamming hero the energy becomes a little tighter when dropping a 10 energy spell on recharge. With the Dark Fury hero it creates a large enough window to drop the ward, and maintain SY with no downtime. My typical H/H setup is all ranged making Ebon Battle Standard of Honor a very powerful skill (+15 damage to everything).

There is no res on my bar for the same reason a monk shouldn't carry a res. If I am using an Essence of Celerity however I will drop For Great Justice! for Signet of Return because I can't think of anything else to bring.