Curse

Tyla · Oct 23, 2007, 10:03 PM // 22:03

Ok here goes
[skill]apply poison[/skill] -4 health degeneration.covers conditions.no downsides.easily reapplyable.core.

[skill]barbed arrows[/skill] -3 health degen.covers conditions.easily reapplyable.less duration.easily interruptable.energy cost dear for bad results(interrupts easily,less duration).only effects arrows.

Please discuss!!!

Channel_V93 · Oct 23, 2007, 10:09 PM // 22:09

If you make a proportion the 24 second for 15 energy is the same for keeping up Barbed Arrows up for 24 seconds so yeah Apply Poison obviously.

Tyla · Oct 23, 2007, 10:15 PM // 22:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Channel_V93

If you make a proportion the 24 second for 15 energy is the same for keeping up Barbed Arrows up for 24 seconds so yeah Apply Poison obviously.

my main point is,barbed arrows is also easily interruptable

Seraphim of Chaos · Oct 23, 2007, 10:17 PM // 22:17

The only reason Barbed Arrows is a skill is to make Poison Arrow look better.

Marverick · Oct 23, 2007, 10:19 PM // 22:19

But it still sucks...

Tyla · Oct 23, 2007, 10:19 PM // 22:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seraphim of Chaos

The only reason Barbed Arrows is a skill is to make Poison Arrow look better.

but in that case,running apply poison+screaming shot will give you the same for more.expertise will just keep you up energywise

iridescentfyre · Oct 24, 2007, 02:13 AM // 02:13

Not much to discuss. Barbed Arrows makes little sense as a skill. Lower prep duration, less degen, and more easily interrupted than Apply Poison? There is absolutely no good reason why Barbed Arrows shouldn't simply be a cheaper version of Apply Poison. At least then someone might actually use it once in a while, though I think Apply would still see more use.

Its almost like Anet was afraid that adding Barbed Arrows would make Apply Poison unpopular, and overcompensated badly.

Lord Natural · Oct 24, 2007, 05:27 AM // 05:27

Barbed has limitations so that poison arrow + barbed isn't an overpowered combo. They probably went a little overboard on its drawbacks, since the combo sees almost no use outside of arenas. If they removed the easily interruptable, and allowed 1 sec bow attacks to be cancelled mid-attack, the combo might give crip shot a run for its money in some condition builds. But right now the difficulty in maintaining barbed, and the ease of getting poison arrow spam distracted/disabled, make the combo less attractive than your standard crip shot.

Outside of that pairing, barbed makes little sense. Maybe in a multiple ranger pressure build there'd be a way to fit it in, but it'd be a stretch.

distilledwill · Oct 24, 2007, 07:50 AM // 07:50

The energy cost means very little to a ranger, even if it was reduced to 5e I doubt it would be used over Apply, it just simply isnt worth it.

Even if a person only has nightfall, apply is a core skill and so is still available.

Maybe if they added a minor damage increase, like +6-10 damage when the arrow strikes, it might become a little bit more popular.

iridescentfyre · Oct 24, 2007, 01:23 PM // 13:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Natural

Barbed has limitations so that poison arrow + barbed isn't an overpowered combo.

I don't know why they bothered trying to make that balanced when they allowed Burning Arrow + Apply Poison in the very same campaign as Barbed Arrows.

The low duration of the Burn would make Poison Arrow + Barbed much more attractive if Barbed weren't so damned overbalanced.

A. Noid · Oct 24, 2007, 01:48 PM // 13:48

Yeah,

Barbed arrows is inferior, but it does allow for variation in builds- which is always a good thing. Beyond this, pair it up with a ranger hero and you've got a whole lot of mass applied degen.

-ANoid

Monk of Myrodin · Oct 24, 2007, 03:57 PM // 15:57

The only reason I run in on my ranger is that I take 2 rangers one with the [card]burning arrow[/card] + [card]apply poison[/card] combo and the other with the [card]broad head arrow[/card] + [card]barbed arrows[/card] combo. It acts as a cover condition and is a little overkill for degen, but once the burning is off the target still has -7 degen for 10-15 seconds. Or I combine with a [card]virulence[/card] necro and take the BHA+Barbed. So it has its uses, you just have to look for them. And before you say screaming arrow pawns it, you have to factor in that barbed reapplies acting as a cover condition.

squirrels_from_hell · Oct 24, 2007, 04:56 PM // 16:56

well... in PvE cover conditions aren't as much a problem in most places.
There is one good thing about Barbed Arrows in PvE: AI monsters use it (where they might have had poison arrows if barbed never existed). Yay for wand-interrupting!

Tyla · Oct 24, 2007, 08:15 PM // 20:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monk of Myrodin

The only reason I run in on my ranger is that I take 2 rangers one with the [card]burning arrow[/card] + [card]apply poison[/card] combo and the other with the [card]broad head arrow[/card] + [card]barbed arrows[/card] combo. It acts as a cover condition and is a little overkill for degen, but once the burning is off the target still has -7 degen for 10-15 seconds. Or I combine with a [card]virulence[/card] necro and take the BHA+Barbed. So it has its uses, you just have to look for them. And before you say screaming arrow pawns it, you have to factor in that barbed reapplies acting as a cover condition.

ah but your forgetting apply poison lasts longer+covers conditions as well,so its worth BA/apply/screaming

lennymon · Oct 24, 2007, 08:45 PM // 20:45

screaming arrow + poison tip signet/apply poison + signet of infection > any condition + virulence

The elite necro condition expansion just isn't a good buy when compared to say.... SS or SV. You wanna massive condition ranger, just go R/mes with apply poison, broadhead arrow, screaming shot and sig of infection... oh... and epidemic.

Bowstring Badass · Oct 24, 2007, 08:57 PM // 20:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Natural

Barbed has limitations so that poison arrow + barbed isn't an overpowered combo. They probably went a little overboard on its drawbacks, since the combo sees almost no use outside of arenas. If they removed the easily interruptable, and allowed sec bow att1 acks to be cancelled mid-attack, the combo might give crip shot a run for its money in some condition builds. But right now the difficulty in maintaining barbed, and the ease of getting poison arrow spam distracted/disabled, make the combo less attractive than your standard crip shot.

Outside of that pairing, barbed makes little sense. Maybe in a multiple ranger pressure build there'd be a way to fit it in, but it'd be a stretch.

Who cares it is overpowered now... Barbed Arrows+Poison Tip Signet= awesome if used right.

Edit: Barbed is a better choice for Broad Head Arrows because the energy from Broad Head sucks up most of the energy and making apply harder to keep up then barbed.

lennymon · Oct 25, 2007, 02:20 AM // 02:20

^^ what, you running 4 expertise?

Quaker · Oct 25, 2007, 03:07 AM // 03:07

I'd say that Apply Poison is obviously better for a single ranger, but if you are in a group with two or more Rangers (or other classes with poisoning), you may want some of them to bring Barbed. I'm not entirely sure if bleeding and poison "stack", but I do know that two people hitting the same target with poisoning does not increase the degen rate.

Another nice thing about Apply Poison is that it works with all Physical attacks - swords, spears, daggers, scythes, etc.

Dirty Savage · Oct 25, 2007, 04:32 AM // 04:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by lennymon

^^ what, you running 4 expertise?

That person must be, as I run at 13 expertise and have absolutely no problems with energy while using BHA + Apply Poison.

distilledwill · Oct 25, 2007, 11:41 AM // 11:41

The only advantage that Barbed has over Apply is the lower energy cost, and seeing as you don't have to reapply Apply as often, that energy cost is negated.
As mentioned, the only time it becomes useful is when someone has pinged apply in their build before you, therefore making you change.