Curse

IMMORTAlMITCH · Nov 21, 2007, 09:47 AM // 09:47

Sins work fine without stances.

Shadow Prison itsself is the biggest problem skill imo, it's such a huge bar compression being shadowstep, hex and snare.

Yanman.be · Nov 21, 2007, 09:48 AM // 09:48

Shadow Prison: Teleport and yadayada yada ... and attack 33% slower..!

Saphatorael · Nov 21, 2007, 10:53 AM // 10:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

*sighs* thread is going in circles.
Camp 1: HotO damage nerf is relevant.
Camp 2: HotO damage nerf is irrelevant.

To all those in Camp 2: you are a Sin, you exist for the sole purpose of bringing a target from X to 0 in the least amount of time possible. This is balanced only by your own willingness to forego self-protection (whether in the form of disruption or personal buffs). If you argue that a damage nerf on a skill you use does not affect you YOU FAIL @ GW.

Just my 2cts. Requesting lock if at all possible.

If you'd play properly, the damage nerf on a skill won't affect you; apparantly it IS affecting you, so YOU must be the one failing, since I'm still able to kill stuff as easy as before the nerf. Must be the way I play.

I've been over this 3 times already, l2read. Just putting a bold statement, ignoring all my still uncountered arguments, is dumb. You're dumb. <3

/requestion a lock as well, this thread has diverted too much from the original subject -.-

Bobby2 · Nov 21, 2007, 11:01 AM // 11:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saphatorael

If you'd play properly, the damage nerf on a skill won't affect you; apparantly it IS affecting you, so YOU must be the one failing, since I'm still able to kill stuff as easy as before the nerf. Must be the way I play.

I've been over this 3 times already, l2read. Just putting a bold statement, ignoring all my still uncountered arguments, is dumb. You're dumb. <3

/requestion a lock as well, this thread has diverted too much from the original subject -.-

I guess I'll just have to be the 'bigger' person here.

fireflyry · Nov 21, 2007, 01:01 PM // 13:01

My new build is working sweet.

Screw posting it here.

X Cytherea X · Nov 21, 2007, 02:17 PM // 14:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saphatorael

If you'd play properly, the damage nerf on a skill won't affect you; apparantly it IS affecting you, so YOU must be the one failing, since I'm still able to kill stuff as easy as before the nerf. Must be the way I play.

I've been over this 3 times already, l2read. Just putting a bold statement, ignoring all my still uncountered arguments, is dumb. You're dumb. <3

/requestion a lock as well, this thread has diverted too much from the original subject -.-

OK look at it this way:

you have a "build" that you say if used properly, allows you to kill just fine, even with the nerf. now, if HotO damage was higher, wouldn't it make your "build" better?

for example, if with your current build, at the end of your combo your target has 10 health, with the old HotO it would be dead! get it through your thick skull!

moriz · Nov 21, 2007, 02:23 PM // 14:23

no single character should have the ability to bring a target from 600hp down to zero by itself by running a finger down the skill keys. anything that could should be immediately nerfed so that it no longer can.

Yanman.be · Nov 21, 2007, 02:27 PM // 14:27

The problem is ...that's what the sin is meant to do.

Saphatorael · Nov 21, 2007, 02:33 PM // 14:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

I guess I'll just have to be the 'bigger' person here.

No arguments anymore? Just misplaced arrogance towards the person who beat you in a debate?

I win, you lose.
Get out and stay out, you're worthless to this discussion now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Cytherea X

OK look at it this way:

you have a "build" that you say if used properly, allows you to kill just fine, even with the nerf. now, if HotO damage was higher, wouldn't it make your "build" better?

for example, if with your current build, at the end of your combo your target has 10 health, with the old HotO it would be dead! get it through your thick skull!

And you get through your thick skull that I don't attack targets that might survive the spike. If the spike fails, you're either facing very good/very coöperative opponents, or you screwed up, it's as simple as that.
If you screw up because of having 30 less damage in your spike, you're crap.

Also, the build being possibly 'better' than it could be, how is that relevant?
Stop trying to exaggerate things and stick to the facts: HotO got lower damage, but it's still good enough for killing. If you can't kill anyone anymore (since they have 10 hp left), you suck at playing an Assassin.

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriz

no single character should have the ability to bring a target from 600hp down to zero by itself by running a finger down the skill keys. anything that could should be immediately nerfed so that it no longer can.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yanman.be

The problem is ...that's what the sin is meant to do.

Sadly, yes. Even though Assassin's one of my fav professions, I wouldn't want to see it return in GW2, for the sake of rewarding skillful play in PvP.

X Cytherea X · Nov 21, 2007, 02:36 PM // 14:36

Quote:

no single character should have the ability to bring a target from 600hp down to zero by itself by running a finger down the skill keys.

on the contrary, more characters should be able to do this.

Quote:

And you get through your thick skull that I don't attack targets that might survive the spike. If the spike fails, you're either facing very good/very coöperative opponents, or you screwed up, it's as simple as that.
If you screw up because of having 30 less damage in your spike, you're crap.

now you're talking through your ass. you expect me to believe you succeed at every attempt to spike? with a better HotO you would have a wider selection of targets that wouldnt survive your combo!

Quote:

HotO got lower damage, but it's still good enough for killing. If you can't kill anyone anymore (since they have 10 hp left), you suck at playing an Assassin.

yes, yes it can still kill. i'm just trying to support the opinion that the nerf was stupid. and for the record im glad 7 and 2/3, mostly on sin.

Turtle222 · Nov 21, 2007, 02:51 PM // 14:51

/requestlock

this is getting off topic.

i think the SP sin has been damaged, but is still able to function (but not as incredible as it was before).

DDL · Nov 21, 2007, 02:54 PM // 14:54

Quote:

And you get through your thick skull that I don't attack targets that might survive the spike. If the spike fails, you're either facing very good/very coöperative opponents, or you screwed up, it's as simple as that.
If you screw up because of having 30 less damage in your spike, you're crap.

....thus, by your own admittance, you're less useful than you used to be.

If you only attack people you know you will kill, that number of people is now smaller, as you do less damage. So you're less useful, since the rest of your team (if present) will either have to deal with people you would otherwise have been able to tackle, or will have to pre-soften people for you.

And if you only ever attacked people you knew you could kill with a sufficient excess of damage to make any damage nerfing irrelevant, then you've ALWAYS been less useful to your team than someone who WAS taking advantage of the extra damage.

More damage is GOOD. It's ALWAYS good. Surely you can see this?

As noted, the whole point of this was to (apparently) hinder the SP sin, which it hasn't done. Also, note it's called the SP sin, not the HoTO sin: the problem was NOT HoTO, and it's STILL not HoTO. The problem is SP, and it IS still a problem.

So yes: end result is "lowered damage for no real good reason", which is (in my book) sufficient grounds for irritation.

Saphatorael · Nov 21, 2007, 02:59 PM // 14:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Cytherea X

on the contrary, more characters should be able to do this.

... no. IF that happens, people will just the other profession the whole time, since those won't need entire skillbars to solo spike their target, rending the Assassin pointless to run.

Quote:

now you're talking through your ass. you expect me to believe you succeed at every attempt to spike? with a better HotO you would have a wider selection of targets that wouldnt survive your combo!

Of course not all attempts succeed. I screw up as well, by timing it badly. This is entirely my fault, by underestimating them, or having not paid enough attention. But it's not the build.
Also, with a better HotO, of course I'd have a wider selection. But if you'd be able to finish anyone on the other team without even having to think (you just spike whoever you want), there's no need for much thought... people would just spike Warriors first, then, and still succeed... Or, to use an old Warrior saying: c+space = win. Only here just c+1+2+3+4+5+6= kill.
I prefer the 'skillful way': Scan the opponents, find their weaknesses, catch them in a weak moment, punish them for it by taking one down; Instead of 'Hey look it's an opponent I'll go spike him then run away lolol'

Quote:

yes, yes it can still kill. i'm just trying to support the opinion that the nerf was stupid. and for the record im glad 7 and 2/3, mostly on sin.

Maybe it was stupid and unneeded, but it hasn't rendered most builds useless. It still kills, that's a sign that it's still viable, thus balanced. It's not much better nor worse than other Dual Attacks.

Also, RA much?

EDIT

Quote:

....thus, by your own admittance, you're less useful than you used to be.

... learn to friggin' read.
I'm not denying the lower damage. But it's still viable. It is STILL USEFUL IN A SPIKE.
Less useful != Worthless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turtle222

/requestlock

this is getting off topic.

/signed, but Inde isn't here right now -.-

Cloud5646 · Nov 21, 2007, 03:15 PM // 15:15

LOL Shadow Prison > Anet

It's so hilarious how they just can't nerft it! they keep trying and trying but always fail... that makes me doubt of their balancing skills... Everyone knows all they gotta do is nerf IAS.

They are just too proud and won't hear the community before they completly kill the class trying to nerf a single build.

Cloud5646 · Nov 21, 2007, 04:36 PM // 16:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriz

no single character should have the ability to bring a target from 600hp down to zero by itself by running a finger down the skill keys. anything that could should be immediately nerfed so that it no longer can.

Give brutal weapon to a warrior, or even a derv, with 5 attack skills and a IAS and they will do it even better then the sin does after the nerf.

Wow do you guys really thing the other melee classes can't spike down a foe?
Warrior:
Sword build: Crippling Slash, Gash, Galrath Slash, Sun and moon strike, Final thrust, IAS.
Axe: Eviscerate, Executioner's strike, Agonizing chop, Furious axe, Penetrating Blow, IAS.
A hammer warrior just need 4: Devastating Hammer, Crushing Blow, Fierce Blow, Mighty Blow, IAS.

Dervish: Radiant Scythe, Crippling Victory, Chilling victory, Reaper's sweep, Victorious sweep, Pious Fury.

The Hammer build is the strongest and doesn't even need Brutal Weapon. Put in the good an old Bull's strike to make it even stronger.
So please guys, start runnin any of those builds in HB so Anet leave sins alone.

Saphatorael · Nov 21, 2007, 05:24 PM // 17:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cloud5646

Give brutal weapon to a warrior, or even a derv, with 5 attack skills and a IAS and they will do it even better as the sin does after the nerf.

You're implying there's a Ritualist on the team... why wouldn't that Ritualist give Brutal Weapon to Assassins?

Cloud5646 · Nov 21, 2007, 06:04 PM // 18:04

lol, they always do... 99% of the sins bring a brutal weapon rit.
I AM assuming the assassin's have brutal weapon.

XiaoTheBlade · Nov 21, 2007, 06:34 PM // 18:34

With my shadow prison build I ran A/Rt and never A/W.

Weapon of aggression
sp
bls
hoto
fs
bos
ancestors rage/impale
resss siggg

Think i ran it with 8 channeling, 10 + 1 + 1 dagger, 12+1 crit

BLS NERF RUINED THIS

Inde · Nov 21, 2007, 07:35 PM // 19:35

Way too many flames and yes, this thread has gone off topic as well. Closed