Curse

Tyla · Nov 17, 2007, 02:18 PM // 14:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Cytherea X

Agreed. ANet should revert every skill on the SP bar to its state at Nightfall release, and instead nerf all IAS so you get 1 duration if you have 0 attribute investment.

none of them were imbalanced at any point EXCEPT when coupled with an IAS.

in detail:
SP: 5e 1/4c 20r
ED: 10e 1c 10r
BLS: offhand that requires hex, gives 18e at 13cs
Hoto: 30ish damage
BSS: 5e, 30ish damage

ahhh those were the days ;_;

and put trampling ox back to its gw:en release state too

they should fire izzy and bring you in lol...

t h i n e eyes b l e e d · Nov 17, 2007, 04:41 PM // 16:41

OH YEAH! now I can finally play as assassin without beinbg imbarassed....

And I think i'm gunna go make one right away

dont feel no pain · Nov 17, 2007, 04:48 PM // 16:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sakura Az

I actualy started using AoD now.. came up wiht a chain that works and while it lacks a KD and doesn't always have enought power to kill a target outright. The mobility and versitality is what i've fallen in love with on it.

I was messing around with builds last night and came up with one use florish for the elite.. the build lacks deep wound.. but it was fun to do the combo and then go straight back thru the combo cause of florish.

oh and someone try this out..
[skill]Mark of Instability[/skill][skill]Black Spider Strike[/skill][skill]Twisting Fangs[/skill][skill]Falling Lotus Strike[/skill][skill]Blades of Steel[/skill]

gah, how many of these have i seen in AB since the nerf.. its even worse

Mist Walker Skarloc · Nov 17, 2007, 04:56 PM // 16:56

I haven't seen anything like that. Though, I have run and seen a lot of:
[skill]Shadow Prison[/skill]->[skill]Tiger Stance[/skill]->[skill]Black Mantis Thrust[/skill]->[skill]Jungle Strike[/skill]->Trampling Ox->[skill]Falling Spider[/skill] or Falling Lotus Strike->[skill]Twisting Fangs[/skill].

It seems to work no problem, so ANet haven't really achieved anything now, have they?

I also thought trying out a Shovesin would be a laugh: (make sure you're enchanted first, take 2 points from Dagger and put 8 into Tactics)
[skill]Flurry[/skill]->[skill]Shove[/skill]->[skill]Falling Spider[/skill] or Falling Lotus Strike->[skill]Twisting fangs[/skill]->[skill]Golden Phoenix Strike[/skill]->[skill]Blades of Steel[/skill].

It's strange, but the spike kills pretty often, which I find hard to believe. Perhaps all my targets suck?

ensoriki · Nov 17, 2007, 05:29 PM // 17:29

Ill stick to my old remix Sp sin >.>

AOD,MOI,GPS,Twisting Falling spider BOS Way of the Lotus... Dash

For my AB builds =P

And why are you people clinging to the BOA sin, like your going to die if you don't.

Mist Walker Skarloc · Nov 17, 2007, 06:02 PM // 18:02

Cool little build there, Ensoriki. I'll try it out soon.

As for your question, I guess it's because the BoA 'sin owned, and people want to continue the ownage.

Sir Pandra Pierva · Nov 17, 2007, 07:46 PM // 19:46

boa sin was funny and actually kinda easy for me to beat/

Sniffy · Nov 17, 2007, 10:10 PM // 22:10

Blades of Steel does not need a nerf. To get it to do it's damage you need a rather long chain, and if the person you're attacking can't figure it out and stop the chain or heal, that's their problem not the assassin's. My Vow of Strength Dervish hits for 100s quite consistently, and more while they're running away, while only essentially using one attack skill, without a long chain which can be messed up.
If they remove Sins from GW 2 I shall be very unhappy. They're the class that makes the game fun in my opinion.

ensoriki · Nov 17, 2007, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Blades of Steel with impale is a strong spike sniffy.

Bobby2 · Nov 18, 2007, 02:20 AM // 02:20

Rly!? Cuz I did BSS-Blades of Steel-Impale, and miraculously, the guy was still standing after that

Kaida the Heartless · Nov 18, 2007, 03:50 AM // 03:50

bos = 120 dmg
impale = 200 dmg

320 damage in 2 skills? word.

ensoriki · Nov 18, 2007, 04:20 AM // 04:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaida the Heartless

bos = 120 dmg
impale = 200 dmg

320 damage in 2 skills? word.

And the requirements for BOA
GPS...death blossom(using MOI) Falling spider Bos Impale >.>

420+ damage spike with degen...

Bobby2 · Nov 18, 2007, 04:34 AM // 04:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaida the Heartless

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

Rly!? Cuz I did BSS-Blades of Steel-Impale, and miraculously, the guy was still standing after that

bos = 120 dmg
impale = 200 dmg

320 damage in 2 skills? word.

You're missing my point!

For BoS to deal that amount of damage you need to have hit with 3 (!!!!!!!) attacks before that! Impale has a comparable restriction. If you suffer the whole combo when it's not boosted by an IAS, and you're not able to do anything about it, YOUR BUILD FAILS. Stop whining Sins are too powerful; our combos are damaging but they are not too difficult to disrupt if you know what you're doing.

ensoriki · Nov 18, 2007, 05:12 AM // 05:12

Bobby IMO, its that some sin builds are to powerful.

Also

Fail to all SP builds without MOI now =P

Well actually horns wasn't needed in many SP builds...but still!

Then they can nerf MOI >.> Although just like entangling asp....hasn't changed since factions.

craigrs84 · Nov 18, 2007, 05:34 AM // 05:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaida the Heartless

bos = 120 dmg
impale = 200 dmg

320 damage in 2 skills? word.

geez you guys always twist everything. no one is going to run an assasin with attributes to max out both dagger mastery and deadly arts to get that kind of damage.

so more like bos = 120, impale = 145. 265 damage at the end of a highly interruptable / blockable dagger chain with a now 1 second impale cast. not that terrible

Kaida the Heartless · Nov 18, 2007, 06:16 AM // 06:16

We'll I've been playing assassin for a while now and they are still packing massive damage with little drawback.

Re-evaluate your target choice if stances/interuptions are becomming a problem.

You say we twist everything, but all assassins are expecting a one combo, unblockable, 1.5 second character spike with 4 knockdowns in it. Sorry to burst your bubble, but it's not going to happen. You want to be able to kill a character in one combo, expect to have drawbacks.

Most of you are going to miss these next comments from raging but I'll say them anyways. Target evaluation is going to become a priority. No longer can an assassin teleport to a character at full health and expect to 'gib 'em. Watch the battlefield and strike at advantageous moments. You're not a pressure char (usually), go for the kill and stop unloading your combo every time it recharges.

Amazing!

Mist Walker Skarloc · Nov 18, 2007, 08:33 AM // 08:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sniffy

Blades of Steel does not need a nerf. To get it to do it's damage you need a rather long chain, and if the person you're attacking can't figure it out and stop the chain or heal, that's their problem not the assassin's. My Vow of Strength Dervish hits for 100s quite consistently, and more while they're running away, while only essentially using one attack skill, without a long chain which can be messed up.
If they remove Sins from GW 2 I shall be very unhappy. They're the class that makes the game fun in my opinion.

You're right, none of the Assassin skills used in any variation of the SP bar need nerfing other than SP's synergy with an IAS. Either make ALL IASes last for 1 second at 0 Mastery, or make SP cancel and disable Stances.

[skill]Heart of Fury[/skill] would be usable, but at the price of only being able to spike every 30 secs, or only having an IAS during every other spike.

[skill]Whirling Charge[/skill] would be usable as an IAS with some points in Wind Prayers if ANet took the '1 sec IAS' approach, so I believe the most sensible idea would be to stop SP working with IASes.

Should we have a poll asking people which solution is best? :P
1) Leave everything as is
2) Put everything as it was pre BLS and HotO nerf
3) Make all IASes last for 1 second at 0 mastery
4) Make SP cancel and disable stances
5) Both of the above (so no Heart of Fury)
6) Make SP cancel and disable Weapon Spells

Weapon of Aggresion, however gives an IAS that is unremovable and not in a primary attribute, so 'sins could invest some points in Channeling for it. Although it's only a 25% IAS, it's still an IAS. Perhaps SP should also cancel and disable Weapon Spells? It would be strange, but it would completely stop any IAS working with SP unless a party member could time WoA to land on you just after you cast SP. The 2 exceptions to this are RaO and IWAY!, but I simply don't see A/Rs with pets (would take up too many skill slots, RaO would also take away SP or any other Elite Hex), nor an IWAY! team purely to give an SP 'sin an IAS.

PS: Yeah, I sure hope Assassins are in GW2. I want my Charr 'sin, I've already thought up a cool, charr-like name for him.

EDIT: I agree Kaida, choosing your target and timing of your spike is what makes you a good 'sin (or not, in some cases.) It's not always a good idea to charge at the enemy monk in a "hi, i r guna spike u now" fashion, wait 'till the warriors/dervishes/pressure 'sins on your team start hassling the enemy monk, then go pwn the enemy Mesmer that almost has your Monk in tears.

Bobby2 · Nov 18, 2007, 08:39 AM // 08:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaida the Heartless

No longer can an assassin teleport to a character at full health and expect to 'gib 'em.

They should, you know, cuz that's what Assassins are for. An unprotted target at full health shouldn't be a problem. I'm making sure, of course, that my builds can still do that. Forced me to be creative, blah blah, that's all true but! IMO by nerfing the wrong skills, ANet is only taking away some of the little versatility Sins have.

HotO-Moebius has become significantly weaker because one never walks alone, so to speak. It's only (partial!) shutdown until the first little health boost now. Still good, but not great, because 'the kill' does not occur quickly enough. Given the amount of quick (self-) prots and spike heals in the game, I feel that's kinda harsh on us.

As for re-evaluating my target... WTH when did you start playing? That's like, the name of the game when you're playing a Sin

More Gank Sins to follow!

edit: 5)

Mist Walker Skarloc · Nov 18, 2007, 08:45 AM // 08:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

They should, you know, cuz that's what Assassins are for.

/Agree. Surprisingly enough, drumroll please!.... Assassins are meant to.... (spoiler alert)
ASSASSINATE PEOPLE! *shock horror*

But isn't waving at an enemy for them to be in shreds at your feet moments later a little overpowered? I like this, but I'm not sure Warriors appreciate the need to pressure Monks and co-ordinate adrenaline spikes, while we just go "Boo!"

Bobby2 · Nov 18, 2007, 09:02 AM // 09:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mist Walker Skarloc

But isn't waving at an enemy for them to be in shreds at your feet moments later a little overpowered? I like this, but I'm not sure Warriors appreciate the need to pressure Monks and co-ordinate adrenaline spikes, while we just go "Boo!"

To answer your question, apart from bad taste, no. I'm against the whole SP thing, don't get me wrong - but the KD nerfs (which are why I am complaining) do nothing to stop them. There are major problems concerning the power level of Assassins, I'm aware of that, but ANet is hitting the class in the wrong spot.

The BLS nerf was a good one, I think, taking some speed/energy gain out of the spike. People die to SP Sins because they have no time to react, the longer an enemy survives the more likely a spike is to fail. So it had to be 'moments later' after they waved at you because if it would have taken any longer, it would have been their hide instead. Can't expect to survive after a failed combo (all the more humiliating, if they waved...) while Warriors are usually still quite fit.