Curse

Lishy · Mar 12, 2008, 07:43 PM // 19:43

Mesmers for pve are only useful after you own all campaigns and do a bit of faction grinding.
I myself play a mesmer, and though they can do massive aoe degen and armor ignoring damage, as well as blow up the casters, the rit is a much better choice if you don't want complications.

upier · Mar 12, 2008, 08:22 PM // 20:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by noneedforclevernames

BTW, I have played both and I find Mesmer to be more fun.

The age old misunderstanding.
Whether something is "fun" is NEVER the question.

RiKio · Mar 12, 2008, 09:17 PM // 21:17

Well, sirs, the guys who says PvE Mesmers fail, fail ( the guys)

I know some chars can do a better job than Mesmers, but take a look at this : Izzy is buffing Mesmers AoE damage. This means that probably Mesmers will have a better AoE damage. The buff of Clumsiness, for example. Now give the old Recharge Time (4) and, voila!: A super AoE damage Machine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

ooh,, super duper you have 4 skills. i hope that works out well for you.

SoI is one of the options. What I really want to test is a build using Pain Inverter and [skill]Mantra of Recovery[/skill] or [skill]Assassin´s Promise[/skill]. That means unlimited, high damage, especially for foes that use AoE.

And this doesn´t stop here. Take a look at this, for example. You see, high DPS damage is in the build.

In conclusion: Mesmers are not bad after all, but now they will get buffed.

upier · Mar 12, 2008, 09:22 PM // 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by RiKio

Well, sirs, the guys who says PvE Mesmers fail, fail ( the guys)

I know some chars can do a better job than Mesmers, but take a look at this : Izzy is buffing Mesmers AoE damage. This means that probably Mesmers will have a better AoE damage. The buff of Clumsiness, for example. Now give the old Recharge Time (4) and, voila!: A super AoE damage Machine.

You do understand why it became AoE don't you?

Coloneh · Mar 12, 2008, 09:33 PM // 21:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by noneedforclevernames

wana stop posting? all you are doing is showing everyone how much you lack knowledge of the game.
Good players generally do not give their builds out BECAUSE they do not want them getting nerfed. That is why you arn't seeing any good Mesmer builds. I have made a few great Mesmer builds for PVE, and there are plenty of great PVP Mesmer builds that are open to the public...

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.....

wow....

I love stupid people. what would the world be like without them?

seriously. mesmers will never good until the entire design of the class and the main attribute is move away from "shutdown".

shutting things down in pve is useless when the rest of your team drops them in 4 seconds.

cgruber · Mar 12, 2008, 09:51 PM // 21:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.....

wow....

I love stupid people. what would the world be like without them?

seriously. mesmers will never good until the entire design of the class and the main attribute is move away from "shutdown".

shutting things down in pve is useless when the rest of your team drops them in 4 seconds.

Run the build I posted and tell me you aren't killign something. 2 level 22 Sins comboing on an enemy with barbs on it will send more yellow numbers across the screen than just about any build.

DarkSpirit · Mar 12, 2008, 11:00 PM // 23:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

seriously. mesmers will never good until the entire design of the class and the main attribute is move away from "shutdown".

shutting things down in pve is useless when the rest of your team drops them in 4 seconds.

Mesmers do not necessarily have to be shutdown, just like necros do not necessarily have to be MMs.

Think of other viable builds a mesmer can play. SoI is one of them that has good potential. Here is mine:

Me/Rt

16 Illusion
13 FC
rest channeling

SoI
EVAS
Summon Mursaat
Arcane Echo
EBSOH (to help your backline casters)/EBSOC (if you need more defense)
Res
Energetic was Lee Sa (for the energy)
Renewing Surge (instant recharge if you are holding an item)

Cast SoI then AE then EVAS. This way, you can have up to 3 level 21 Assassins at the same time plus an Asuran Summon.

Energetic was Lee Sa is a Spawning power item spell which is of limited use on secondary Rts, a SoI mesmer however, is different.

The other build aspect that a mesmer can make use of, is a good signet build, which I am still researching into, now that FC also affects signets, mesmers do not need to worry about energy in a signet build and benefit from Artificier's Insignia (no need for Radiant). But I am looking into this as a mesmer hero signet interrupting build since heroes are great with that.

Terraban · Mar 13, 2008, 12:17 AM // 00:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief

Diversion has a 3 second cast time. If you take a N/Me with said spell, and they cast it, a ranger (as you stated, they are amazing at interrupting) will simply interrupt that said 3 second cast unless they are a blind, deaf, dumb twit who has a ping over 900 constantly.

I quit reading here...

Monsters don't have ping, and rarely have interrupts. If theres enough things with interrupts to matter, that either means you have triple aggroed, or there is nothing worth the Diversion anyway. Oh, and if something in PvE DOES have an interrupt, a 1.5 second cast is just as likely to get interrupted as a 3 seconds cast.

Bye now.

Coloneh · Mar 13, 2008, 01:06 AM // 01:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by cgruber

Run the build I posted and tell me you aren't killign something. 2 level 22 Sins comboing on an enemy with barbs on it will send more yellow numbers across the screen than just about any build.

necros do barbs better. its a very effective skill on on caster bar when there are minions running around. that dosnt make your build good.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Mesmers do not necessarily have to be shutdown, just like necros do not necessarily have to be MMs.

the primary design and attribute of necros is not just for MMing. soul reaping has an effect which is always useful.
Mesmers however do not have this. fast casting is only useful for interrupting (and spike healing i suppose, but it dosnt really compare to divine favor at all)

Quote:

Think of other viable builds a mesmer can play. SoI is one of them that has good potential.

what variable builds? the only mesmer build that can even hope to be slightly effective is an SOI build abusing PVE skills.

Quote:

good signet build

oxymoron

DarkSpirit · Mar 13, 2008, 02:55 AM // 02:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

necros do barbs better. its a very effective skill on on caster bar when there are minions running around. that dosnt make your build good.

Necros are different. Necros tend to also have some of the slowest casting/recharge spells in the game which means, they are very susceptible to interrupts.

Quote:

Mesmers however do not have this. fast casting is only useful for interrupting (and spike healing i suppose, but it dosnt really compare to divine favor at all)

And casting a spell/signet fast not only makes it easier to you dodge interrupts, it also makes it easier for the mesmer to interrupt others. As long as the mesmer can obtain sufficient energy and has the means for good spell recharge, the ability to cast fast is still better than casting slow, even in PvE. It provides greater damage over time because of fast casting and healing/protection spells being cast faster can't be that bad.

This is why, in my build, I maxed my FC, max Illusion for the power, and provided faster spell recharge and good energy management skills.

Quote:

what variable builds? the only mesmer build that can even hope to be slightly effective is an SOI build abusing PVE skills.

If you can't think outside of the cookie-cutter holy trinity boxed-up PUG mindset then, of course, mesmers can never ever be good enough for you.

blue.rellik · Mar 13, 2008, 03:25 AM // 03:25

Also another reason to pick rits

They're hot

RavagerOfDreams · Mar 13, 2008, 05:06 AM // 05:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue.rellik

Also another reason to pick rits

They're hot

i dunno man mezzy's are purty hot

JDRyder · Mar 13, 2008, 06:18 AM // 06:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

oxymoron

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

"fast casting is only useful for interrupting"oxymoron

are you on crack... the mesmer interupts are alrdy 1/4 sec casts... fast casting will cut a 1 sec cast in haft and a 3 sec to a 1.86 sec cast. fast casting is usfeul .....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

"the only mesmer build that can even hope to be slightly effective is an SOI build abusing PVE skills."oxymoron

energy surge, energy burn, cry of frustration, power leak, power drain, signet of humility, drain enchantment, w/e rez you want. i also bet you didnt know what SoI was before i posted it

as for DarkSpirit talking about thinking out side cookie cutter, its that AND rethink of tactics. see ppl saying "things die in 4secs dont need mesmer" ever thing of putting the mesmer on other targets? as your team is bashing away on w/e a mesmer can shut down other targets doing DPS "or healing" taking big part of the DPS out of the NPCs. this takes pressure off you team and monks. before any 1 replys to this i know ppl are going to say "you need mind wrank in that build you need this, you dont need that ect" people need to learn what the main part of a build is. for the energy surge i showed theres a ton of ways you can use it. the build is flexible, theres more then 1 way to interupt or remove a enchant. it just seems to me on guru ppl dont get that other skills can be used in posted builds, any build has optional skills for both pvp and pve builds. learn creativity

Kyomi Tachibana · Mar 13, 2008, 07:00 AM // 07:00

Slap Assassin's Promise and Finish Him! on a mesmer and you have a killing machine once a battle gets going, FC reduces the casting of AP to make sure you actually get it on the target, damage+Deepwound from FH!, and if that doesn't cut it, bring an extra damage skill, I like the Assassins support PvE skill from EotN. Other than that, bring some e-management, and I toss in Unnatural signet, since AP counters the long recharge and it can also be used to push the enemy to death, as well as kill nasty spirits.

I've tried playing rits and find them quite boring, personally, but they can be rather useful for some added damage/back up healing.

RiKio · Mar 13, 2008, 02:55 PM // 14:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

You do understand why it became AoE don't you?

Yes. But IMO Clumsiness is only half-buffed. I think the REAL update is coming...

Coloneh · Mar 14, 2008, 03:53 AM // 03:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Necros are different. Necros tend to also have some of the slowest casting/recharge spells in the game which means, they are very susceptible to interrupts.

did you just use "necroes get interrupted" as a reason to use mesmers in PvE?
seriously?

Quote:

And casting a spell/signet fast not only makes it easier to you dodge interrupts, it also makes it easier for the mesmer to interrupt others. As long as the mesmer can obtain sufficient energy and has the means for good spell recharge, the ability to cast fast is still better than casting slow, even in PvE. It provides greater damage over time because of fast casting and healing/protection spells being cast faster can't be that bad.

This is why, in my build, I maxed my FC, max Illusion for the power, and provided faster spell recharge and good energy management skills.

1. you dont get interrupted in PvE.
2. rangers can interrupt better than you.
3. anything can interrupt with a 1/4 second cast skill.
4. yes, casing fast is better than casting slow. but its not even as close to as good as unlimited energy or throwing an extra ~30 health on your heals.

Quote:

If you can't think outside of the cookie-cutter holy trinity boxed-up PUG mindset then, of course, mesmers can never ever be good enough for you.

yeah, thats totally my problem.
Not sure why you brought up the 'holy trinity' this really had nothing to do with it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDRyder

are you on crack... the mesmer interupts are alrdy 1/4 sec casts... fast casting will cut a 1 sec cast in haft and a 3 sec to a 1.86 sec cast. fast casting is usfeul .....

name one reason that fast casting would be better than soul reaping

Quote:

energy surge, energy burn, cry of frustration, power leak, power drain, signet of humility, drain enchantment, w/e rez you want. i also bet you didnt know what SoI was before i posted it

sucks, sucks, no need for mesmer primary, same thing, same, useless, no need for mesmer primary.

and i did know what SOI was thank you very much. I actually know quite a bit about the game.

Quote:

as for DarkSpirit talking about thinking out side cookie cutter, its that AND rethink of tactics. see ppl saying "things die in 4secs dont need mesmer" ever thing of putting the mesmer on other targets? as your team is bashing away on w/e a mesmer can shut down other targets doing DPS "or healing" taking big part of the DPS out of the NPCs. this takes pressure off you team and monks. before any 1 replys to this i know ppl are going to say "you need mind wrank in that build you need this, you dont need that ect" people need to learn what the main part of a build is. for the energy surge i showed theres a ton of ways you can use it. the build is flexible, theres more then 1 way to interupt or remove a enchant. it just seems to me on guru ppl dont get that other skills can be used in posted builds, any build has optional skills for both pvp and pve builds. learn creativity

that was alot of mumbling, but i think you were going for something along the lines of 'switch targets'.... duh. the thing is, any priority target that needs to be shut down, the rest of your team will be 'shutting down', as in killing them. so you are left back being useless, or shutting down a ranger or something really useful like that...

DarkSpirit · Mar 14, 2008, 04:05 AM // 04:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

1. you dont get interrupted in PvE.

Yes you do.

Quote:

2. rangers can interrupt better than you.

Not really. Ranger interrupts certainly have some advantages over those of the mesmer's but there are some disadvantages too.

For example, ranger interrupts need line of sight, while mesmers can simply hide behind a wall of protection and still interrupt the hell out of you. But unfortunately not everyone knows this and knows how to make use of this powerful fact. So, they always think that ranger interrupts are superior to the mesmer's in every way.

Quote:

3. anything can interrupt with a 1/4 second cast skill.

4. yes, casing fast is better than casting slow. but its not even as close to as good as unlimited energy or throwing an extra ~30 health on your heals.

Who says you need unlimited energy? As long as you have enough energy when you need it, that should be fine.

Quote:

name one reason that fast casting would be better than soul reaping

Uh...they dont need to wait for something to die?

Quote:

and i did know what SOI was thank you very much. I actually know quite a bit about the game.

Sure you do.

Terraban · Mar 14, 2008, 04:12 AM // 04:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Uh...they dont need to wait for something to die?

Yeah...because things rarely die in PvE...

I guess that might be the case with a few Mesmers on your team, but for normal intelligent teams, things die pretty quickly.

Really...what can a Mesmer do in PvE?

Interrupt, and can skip title grinding.

Yay?

Or are you guys strong believers in the "FC Nuker" "FC SS" "FC Healer"? Yeah...the Mesmer owns, he can imitate another profession and not be as effective as them at their job...woot.

masterrikku · Mar 14, 2008, 04:24 AM // 04:24

Coloneh has been marked a noob by Anet for: fighting with several people about useless crap.

Mesmer FTW!

JDRyder · Mar 14, 2008, 04:35 AM // 04:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDRyder

fast casting will cut a 1 sec cast in haft and a 3 sec to a 1.86 sec cast. fast casting is usfeul

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

name one reason that fast casting would be better than soul reaping

self owned?

do you really need the energy?