Curse

rike1 · Mar 25, 2008, 02:43 AM // 02:43

I run a W/Me general PvE tank and the only question ive ever had about his gear is the sword hilt.

I currently use a vampiric hilt because after asking around and not knowing what to use myself, people said it was the best.

But I just don't see it. I just really cannot see the benefit. I always find myself losing more health in a fray from attacks and regen than I EVER gain back from the life steal.

I do not need a zealous hilt or any that make things last 33% longer.

This leaves me with a sundering hilt, furious hilt, and elemental hilts.

Or is vampiric the best way to go?

1. I'd like to try and do this without switching weapons.
2. If I cannot, what do I need to use for what situation?

Might as well edit in skills:

Galrath slash
Final thrust
disrupting blow

These are my attack skills. Rest are defense/res/stances/shouts ^_^

Gift3d · Mar 25, 2008, 02:49 AM // 02:49

People just like to agree with what goes around. See elitism(n), also known as (96% of users on this website).

Since you obviously will not be constantly attacking in critical situations with your warrior where that extra 3 damage will matter, vampiric probably isn't the best way to go because, as you said, you will wind up losing more health in the long run. Since the extra 3 damage honestly isn't crap, i'd go with Furious or Sundering. Furious if you use a lot of adrenaline skills, especially Dragon Slash. Sundering for anything else, as it doesn't have any downside to it.

Savio · Mar 25, 2008, 03:03 AM // 03:03

If you're hitting at least 60% of the time, you'll break even health-wise with vampiric. But worrying about health in most situations is pointless, as monks usually overheal you anyway.

Furious is bad because the way adrenaline works, the extra strike does little in the long run, and builds that revolve around high adrenaline gain like Dragon Slash already have ways of doubling adrenaline.

As far as sundering goes, it does about half the damage vampiric does in the long term. It's usable, but if you thought vampiric damage was crap, you'll like sundering damage less.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rike1

Galrath slash
Final thrust
disrupting blow

These are my attack skills. Rest are defense/res/stances/shouts ^_^

That's not the greatest build ever, post your full build and where you're at in the game.

rike1 · Mar 25, 2008, 03:07 AM // 03:07

My main attack skills cost 8 and 10 adrenaline respectively - but all i hear is sundering is crap for me.

Anyone know the actually increase in damage ill do with a 20/20 sundering sword? Will the damage output be more than if i used a furious hilt to gain more adrenaline to use my attack skills?

Well, I use:

galrath slash
final thrust
disrupting blow
ether feast
dolyak signet
defy pain
elemental resistance
ressurection

For my attacks, i switch between glarath/final thrust and gash/sever artery based on whether or not i fight fleshy monsters.

The rest is for tanking. My gear enables me high defense/life in stance.

How does vampiric give me more damage over anything else? And if i constantly find myself losing more life than gaining, how does it help?

**Marty Silverblade** · Mar 25, 2008, 03:34 AM // 03:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by rike1

My main attack skills cost 8 and 10 adrenaline respectively - but all i hear is sundering is crap for me.

Sundering is bad on swords because of the narrow damage range. The 20% AP won't do as much to boost the damage as vampiric will. Weapons with wider damage ranges such as axes and scythes benefit much more from it.

Quote:

Anyone know the actually increase in damage ill do with a 20/20 sundering sword? Will the damage output be more than if i used a furious hilt to gain more adrenaline to use my attack skills?

Furious isn't much use. Think of it this way: Over 10 hits you'll get an extra 30 damage with vampiric or an extra point of adr with furious. Furious isn't reliable for building adrenaline; if you're going to run an adrenaline machine take "For Great Justice!" and Dragon Slash.

Quote:

galrath slash
final thrust
disrupting blow
ether feast
dolyak signet
defy pain
elemental resistance
ressurection

Ether Feast is a bad self-heal, putting ~50 attribute points into inspiration is a waste. If you want a self-heal, take Healing Signet or Lion's Comfort (not to mention your shield is str or tactics based).

Dolyak Signet is bad. If you can hit things, you do no damage. If you do no damage, you're useless to your team.

Defy Pain is a bad elite, some farming builds use it but thats as far as it's usefulness goes. If you're trying to tank, don't. You're much, much more useful if you kill things.

Elemental Resistance is yet another bad skill. Warriors have the best armor (AL wise, at least), so buffing this further is wasted. Not to mention, it's a stance, meaning no IAS.

Quote:

For my attacks, i switch between glarath/final thrust and gash/sever artery based on whether or not i fight fleshy monsters.

You'll want more than 2 attacks, you're doing barely any damage, not to mention you can't spam any of them.

Quote:

The rest is for tanking. My gear enables me high defense/life in stance.

Tanking is bad, as previously mentioned. You'll survive much better and do things much quicker if you kill things instead.

Quote:

How does vampiric give me more damage over anything else? And if i constantly find myself losing more life than gaining, how does it help?

Once you drop Dolyak Sig and add an IAS, you'll be hitting roughly every second. Thats 3 health per second gained, against -1 health degen (2 health lost per second). So really, you're gaining 1 health per second. It won't save you from anything, and you won't be self sufficient, but you're not losing health.

---------------------------------------

This may seem a bit harsh, but you're new, so just try and get on the right path before you waste time tanking or anything like that.

Read me.

masta_yoda · Mar 25, 2008, 03:35 AM // 03:35

vamps made for damage , unconditional damage, adds the best dps following conjures

Savio · Mar 25, 2008, 03:45 AM // 03:45

For raw damage, vampiric > sundering > furious.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Silverblade

Sundering is bad on swords because of the narrow damage range.

It's not the damage range, it's the max damage. The raw damage gain for sundering swords isn't so bad compared to axes and hammers, but you don't really use swords for spiking stuff.

masta_yoda · Mar 25, 2008, 03:50 AM // 03:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

For raw damage, vampiric > sundering > furious.

It's not the damage range, it's the max damage. The raw damage gain for sundering swords isn't so bad compared to axes and hammers, but you don't really use swords for spiking stuff.

yeh and swords dont have a insta deepwound attack and u can tell when a spike is coming, when bleed applies

Richardt · Mar 25, 2008, 04:00 AM // 04:00

I would use vampiric.

I made the switch on my spear and loved it so much I did it on my warrior.

Absolutely love it.

rike1 · Mar 25, 2008, 04:08 AM // 04:08

Alright, ill stick with the vampiric, but I am also sticking with my skills.

I know the build im using.

Sir Pandra Pierva · Mar 25, 2008, 04:14 AM // 04:14

warriors are easy to play and anyone who wants to argue that can post a build and not explain and i will try to figure out what is supposed to do.

Weapon switching is your friend with any non caster class

Savio · Mar 25, 2008, 04:28 AM // 04:28

Weapon switching is important for any class, caster or non-caster.

Scary Raebbit · Mar 25, 2008, 04:30 AM // 04:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by rike1

Alright, ill stick with the vampiric, but I am also sticking with my skills.

I know the build im using.

Dolyak sucks shit. You are there to do damage, not sit around with your thumb up your ass futilely chasing monsters around.
Ether Feast is bad. You are speccing into a secondary that you can accomplish with a STR/Tactic heal. Or you could just trust monks.
Defy Pain is shit. Sucks adrenaline and is not even worth the slot compared to other Elites like D-Slash. I guess you can use this if you can't find any other elites, but still... Prophecies has Charge, Battle Rage, or Hundred Blades. Factions has D-Slash. EotN has Crip Slash. And that is just for swords. There also might even be better elites.
Elemental Resistance sucks. No IAS and you are easier to kill if you get targeted by something that doesn't deal elemental damage. Also no cancel stance in case of the above situation.

blue.rellik · Mar 25, 2008, 04:43 AM // 04:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by rike1

Alright, ill stick with the vampiric, but I am also sticking with my skills.

I know the build im using.

Why did you ask help with your silly build if you're going to be stubborn and not accept good advice?

rike1 · Mar 25, 2008, 04:49 AM // 04:49

I know everyone thinks the skills are shit, but with the gear I run, i take virtually no damage.

I will swap out ether feast for a better healing skill.

I will also swap out dolyak for something- maybe another attack spell or watch yourselves.

However, with defy pain and elemental resistance, plus 5 sentry signets and a 45/-2 shield, and a +5 armor pommel, I take virtually no damage, while having over 700 health.

And with switching some skills around, i can now deal out a fair amount of damage.

Savio · Mar 25, 2008, 05:09 AM // 05:09

It's the monks' job to deal with damage, not yours. Warriors aren't there to deal a fair amount of damage, they're there to deal the best raw damage in the game. Taking out a large part of your skillbar to doing something you don't need to do hurts your damage output; an IAS alone increases your damage output by 50%.

Self-survivability isn't that strong, especially when you as a warrior are not essential to survival. If you're the last one standing and everyone else is dead, you're not going to be standing much longer - or worse, you're going to try to set up a painfully long res chain. If you don't have defensive skills and you die, there's a problem with your team or your aggroing skills, not your build.

Also, +armor skills don't stack beyond +25 armor, so whatever you thought was happening with all those +armor skills wasn't happening at all.

blue.rellik · Mar 25, 2008, 05:24 AM // 05:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by rike1

I know everyone thinks the skills are shit, but with the gear I run, i take virtually no damage.

I will swap out ether feast for a better healing skill.

I will also swap out dolyak for something- maybe another attack spell or watch yourselves.

However, with defy pain and elemental resistance, plus 5 sentry signets and a 45/-2 shield, and a +5 armor pommel, I take virtually no damage, while having over 700 health.

And with switching some skills around, i can now deal out a fair amount of damage.

If you think you can deal a 'fair amount' of damage then I can deal godly amounts of damage that would shake the heavens compared to yours

masta_yoda · Mar 25, 2008, 06:21 AM // 06:21

u cant deal out fair amount of damage if ur a warrior with out deepwound except dslashing + conjures

Chthon · Mar 25, 2008, 05:15 PM // 17:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by rike1

But I just don't see it. I just really cannot see the benefit. I always find myself losing more health in a fray from attacks and regen than I EVER gain back from the life steal.

You're looking for the wrong benefit. Vampiric isn't meant for gaining you a lot of health; vampiric is meant for increasing your damage output. And it does. That 3 extra damage on every hit is better than any other prefix can do (except an elemental against a foe that's weak to that specific element).

Introverted Dimensions · Mar 25, 2008, 09:16 PM // 21:16

mind posting your build rike? im curious.