Curse

Joshie0808 · Mar 27, 2008, 05:12 AM // 05:12

[skill]Holy Veil[/skill]

This skill pretty much appears on many PvP monk bars. What i would like to know is how good/experienced monks use this skill. My first impression of this skill was: "Wow, it only removes 1 hex on removal and it has an upkeep cost? This sucks. The only thing it has going for it is the 100% cast time increase on hostile hexes."

I guess what i want to know is how to use this skill properly/effectively and how it compares to other hex removals. Or, am I looking at this skill from the wrong angle and what is the 'optimal' purpose for this skill?

And yes, i know this is the PvE forum. ><

[skill]Reversal of Fortune[/skill]
And one more thing, the skill description is slightly ambiguous here.
Does that mean:

1) It negates x...y amount of dmg. And no more? So lets say your RoF is at 8 prot, you are healed for 50hp. If you take 100dmg, you take the 100dmg, are healed for 50, and so you have a net loss of 50hp.

OR

2) Or, it negates x..y amount of dmg, then, it heals x...y amount of health? Again at 8 prot, 50hp. If you take 100dmg, it first negates 50, then you take 50dmg, and it heals you 50hp, so you have a net loss/gain of 0 hp?

or something else?

knives · Mar 27, 2008, 05:15 AM // 05:15

Quote:

Notes

* The text of the spell is unclear about whether the healing replaces all damage or just the amount of damage converted to healing. The spell converts the first 15...67 damage from the next damage source into healing, with no effect on further damage. For example, if a monk with 16 ranks of Protection Prayers casts Reversal of Fortune on himself and a foe with 16 ranks of Fire Magic Fireball on him, he will be healed for 84 health and take 35 damage, resulting in a net gain of 49 health, while an attack with over 168 damage such as Dark Chain Lightning would result in a net loss of health.
* If damage is dealt in separate packets, such as from Deathly Chill, Reversal of Fortune will only negate damage from the first packet.
* If multiple sources of damage are dealt instantaneously, Reversal of Fortune appears to act upon the largest source of damage. This can be observed when a player with the enchantments Retribution and Shield of Judgement is attacked by an enemy enchanted by Reversal of Fortune; regardless of the order in which Retribution and Shield of Judgment are cast, Reversal of Fortune will always act upon Shield of Judgement.
* This spell is better used as a healing skill with the ability to negate damage than as a spell used to protect someone at full health. It is far more effective used on someone who has already lost health.

Pre-veil = protection from potential hexes that could be really bad (ex. migraine)

yum · Mar 27, 2008, 05:19 AM // 05:19

1) The 100% cast time is significant since it greatly increase the disruption ability of your team. For example, vs necro, preveil your warrior and ranger so that it's easier to interupt the hexes. Vs domi mes, it helps against stuff like : Migrain, Diversion, Shame... If any of those sticks, you won't be able to remove it by yourself w/o suffering great consequences.

2) Even if you take 234235t4654 damage while under RoF at 8 prot, you are heal for 50 hp instead, which means you heal yourself for 50 hp. That is one of the best skill in game if used correctly. (I may be wrong, since I play it mostly in TA

)

Snow Bunny · Mar 27, 2008, 05:22 AM // 05:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by yum

1
2) Even if you take 234235t4654 damage while under RoF at 8 prot, you are heal for 50 hp instead, which means you heal yourself for 50 hp. That is one of the best skill in game if used correctly. (I may be wrong, since I play it mostly in TA

)

I may be wrong here, but I used to believe that.

I think it's actually that @ 8 prot, it'll negate 50 of the next damage, so a 250 attack will deal 200, then heal for 50, so essentially, it's a 100 point heal.

Da Mad M00 · Mar 27, 2008, 05:23 AM // 05:23

The good thing about holy veil is that you can remove the hex whenever you need it. Most other hex removals have a 1second casttime. Say you get Migraine cast on you and you want to remove it and start casting your other hex removal then there is a huge chance that you either get interrupted cause of the double cast time. Or that the enemy will finish casting another hex on you before your hex removal is done casting with as a result that migraine is staying on you.

For not too good monks, and people with a low reaction time, it doesn't matter too much which hex removal you bring. Tho the real good monks can use Holy Veil in a way that it is a whole lot better then all the other hex removals around.

Age · Mar 27, 2008, 06:20 AM // 06:20

I was going to say migraine well diversion as well and like the others said.

xDusT II · Mar 27, 2008, 07:17 AM // 07:17

The hexes that you actually want to remove will generally be the ones that stop or punish you for removing them. Holy Veil allows you to make the cast before a particularly nasty hex lands, and then remove it safely.

Pyro maniac · Mar 27, 2008, 08:39 AM // 08:39

Veil)
It's recharge is low and on par with cure hex. It can be used prematuraly by maintaining it and drop it whenever your first (threatening) hex lands. With this your veil has already recharged and you don't need to cast a hex removal afterwards.

RoF) Negates and heals up to X amount. A 200 damage spell with a 80 RoF:
It negates 80 damage and then heals for 80 damage, resulting in a net damage of 40.

X Ice Man X · Mar 27, 2008, 10:20 AM // 10:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

I think it's actually that @ 8 prot, it'll negate 50 of the next damage, so a 250 attack will deal 200, then heal for 50, so essentially, it's a 100 point heal.

Thats true, its amazing the amount of people who don't realize how good RoF actually is.

Veil is used to 2 reasons.

1) It is a really cheap, hex removal spell that can be cast and removed instantly (thus removing the upkeep cost) to remove a hex. It one of the lowest hex removal spells energy wise and one of fastest recharging.

2) In PvP covering Hexes are used. They are placed over the more important and damaging hexes so that when the monk tries to remove the hex he ends up removing the near harmless hex that was put on that for exact reason.

Veil slows down the casting of the Covering hex and once its already on somebody it is an instant hex removal as you just double click to end, and its gone. No casting time. So its used to remove important hexes not just the covering hex.

XDeadboltX · Mar 27, 2008, 05:16 PM // 17:16

Is there any way to end veil other than double clicking the maintained enchantment. Is it possible to bind a key to do this?

Turbobusa · Mar 27, 2008, 05:48 PM // 17:48

Consider RoF as a heal for twice the amount stated.
Anyone knows if you are healed first then take damage, or the opposite?

Pyro maniac · Mar 27, 2008, 06:18 PM // 18:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbobusa

Consider RoF as a heal for twice the amount stated.
Anyone knows if you are healed first thn take damage, or the contrary?

you get healed first

RoF's healing power isn't that great. Compare Word of Healing to RoF

(yes I know WoH is an elite, however you'll be most likely running a 14 spec WoH and a 11 spec RoF)

Word of Healing heals for more, it's heal is unconditional (20 dmg on a RoF will just heal for 40) and doesn't need damage to trigger (watching someone die with 8 degen and RoF on him is frustrating).
The only plus of RoF is his 1/4 sec cast: That will save lives. Putting a RoF on someone who is about to die, just to buy that extra second to cast WoH is just great. Also it will save you when you're getting pound while begin constantly knocked down or dazed. 3/4 cast will be more likely to fail then a 1/4 sec cast.

Tyla · Mar 27, 2008, 06:22 PM // 18:22

Holy Veil is mainly used on PvP Monk bars because you can use Pre-Veiling, which means you maintain it until a scary hex pops up (Diversion, Migraine).

RoF negates (at 8 Prot) 100 damage in total. If the damage is 50, it will heal for 50.

ender6 · Mar 27, 2008, 08:58 PM // 20:58

just a matter of curiosity:

If you are at 25 health and get hit with 76 dmg, and you have a lvl 8 RoF on you, I would imagine you still die--26 dmg gets through before the 50 heal kicks in? Or does the heal hit home first? Just one of those little things I have never paid attention to when using RoF.

miskav · Mar 27, 2008, 09:39 PM // 21:39

The prot comes first, then the heal of the prot (Already negating 50, then healing for 50 (Because the damage was a package of 50+))

Thus you should stay alive.

Joshie0808 · Mar 28, 2008, 01:08 AM // 01:08

Thank you for all the quick and informative replies guys. I never thought of that:

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Ice Man X

2) In PvP covering Hexes are used. They are placed over the more important and damaging hexes so that when the monk tries to remove the hex he ends up removing the near harmless hex that was put on that for exact reason.

Veil slows down the casting of the Covering hex and once its already on somebody it is an instant hex removal as you just double click to end, and its gone. No casting time. So its used to remove important hexes not just the covering hex.

Fleeting · Mar 29, 2008, 05:23 PM // 17:23

Pre-casting holy veil allows you to quickly remove a hex and slows the casting of said hex (i.e. if someone is using backfire on you, it would get 2x cast time and you could instantly remove it). The upkeep doesn't matter since you'll be removing it instantly if you need to get rid of a hex.

As for RoF- if RoF will "heal for 50 damage instead", then a 100 dmg attack will deal 50 dmg, and then you will be healed for 50, incurring a net loss of 0 health.

Dr Dimento · Mar 29, 2008, 07:19 PM // 19:19

Quote:

Pre-veil = protection from potential hexes that could be really bad (ex. migraine)

Yea, it's almost as good as [skill]Hex Breaker[/skill]

Marverick · Mar 29, 2008, 10:50 PM // 22:50

But with hex breaker, the other guy can just use a harmless hex on you to get rid of it.

Although with Veil it can be shattered.

Still, Veil works on allies.

Sword · Mar 29, 2008, 10:55 PM // 22:55

preveiling means u have 2 hex removals when u engage (best on melee on ur team)
and all the "scary hexs" (aka elites or whatever) are often covered by another hex ie parasitc or conjure , if u remove a previled target in the time frame where the inital hex is applied and before the the cover hex is added then ur golden.