Curse

Program Ftw · Apr 08, 2007, 06:28 PM // 18:28

Hey, I've spent the last few odd days trying to think of a Beast Master Build, that was actualy somewhat decent in PvP, I've seen some builds, but I doubt they would belong any where ouside RA. I also feel this build may not be up to par, but I felt like giving it a shot.

My mine problem, which i realised with the Beast Master line, was the attack skills are very conditional, and coupled with the pets slow attack speed, it wasn't exactly usable. The elite options for the Beast Mastery line are also pretty shabby, theres Enraging Lunge, but it requires your whole bar for it to work, but is shut down by the most common of Monk spells, Protective Spirit, and the build also suffers from energy problems.

However, Ferocious Strike, provides enough energy regeneration to allow you to *almost* avoid putting anything in Expertise, now hang on a second!

A attack skill giving +Damage and +Energy! Yeah! More like it. Since Beast Mastery alone is pretty poor, the ability for this elite skill to let you drop a whole attribute line, is very powerful. I have been working on a Marks/Beast build but it is not ready at the moment.

However, I saw that Brutal Weapon got a unneeded buff, So I decided to experiment with it.

12+1+1 Beast
12 Communing
3 Expertise

Ferocious Srike
Optional Attack skill (Disrupting Lunge?)
Brutal Weapon
Call of Haste
Otyugh's Cry
Comfort Animal
Charm Animal
Resurrection Signet

This allows your pet to keep a nice damage out put, with no energy problems, even when maintaining two copies of brutal weapon. You can keep brutal up on your pet and a warrior, for example. This would be a major increase damage for both you and an allie.

If you have any thoughts/ideas, feel free to share them. I hopes to be posting a Beast/Marks build soon..

Thanks,
Pr0gram~

Bloodied Blade · Apr 08, 2007, 06:40 PM // 18:40

I personally perfer to run 9 expertise & Heal As One (I have a build for RA right now where it's a complete nightmare to kill me & my pet does respectable dps).

I do like brutal weapon in beast builds, with it on 2 targets you can focus-fire and do an absolutely scary amount of damage (pet hits upwards of 60-80 very often and it's hard for them to get away). I think you could benefit from some form of self heal (or a blocking skill) since investing everything into BM without having a fallback is rather risky.

Program Ftw · Apr 08, 2007, 06:49 PM // 18:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bloodied Blade

I personally perfer to run 9 expertise & Heal As One (I have a build for RA right now where it's a complete nightmare to kill me & my pet does respectable dps).

I do like brutal weapon in beast builds, with it on 2 targets you can focus-fire and do an absolutely scary amount of damage (pet hits upwards of 60-80 very often and it's hard for them to get away). I think you could benefit from some form of self heal (or a blocking skill) since investing everything into BM without having a fallback is rather risky.

RA yeah, I was aiming for something a bit higher than that -__-

Thanks,
Pr0gram~

XvArchonvX · Apr 08, 2007, 08:38 PM // 20:38

Sounds a bit like Racthoh's build, but with Ferocious Strike instead of Enraged and another attack skill instead of CoP.....

Program Ftw · Apr 08, 2007, 11:33 PM // 23:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by XvArchonvX

Sounds a bit like Racthoh's build, but with Ferocious Strike instead of Enraged and another attack skill instead of CoP.....

I checked "Racthoh's build" and yes, they do have striking similaritys, but in the OP I did explain that *after* the *unneeded* buff to brutal weapon, it would be stupid to not experiment with it.

However, Racthoh's build seems incredibly unstable, anywhere outside Random Arenas. Whereas I am trying to create a build that would be useful in organised play.

Thanks,
Pr0gram~

placebo overdose · Apr 08, 2007, 11:38 PM // 23:38

umm i dont think there is much room for BM's in gvg/HA but good luck imo pets are to spontaneous still

TheOneMephisto · Apr 08, 2007, 11:40 PM // 23:40

A ranger build without dshot?

Proggy... you make me sad... :'(

Bloodied Blade · Apr 09, 2007, 01:00 AM // 01:00

Wow...just realized how weird the first post came off. I'd meant the RA reference to say that I'd been testing out some of the skills. If you didn't dismiss what I said after that, the point is still valid. Most teams are smart enough to (if we're not talking about RA) kill the ranger, and pay less attention to the pet. You're going to wand at least *some* form of evade/troll or really anything to boost your survival.

You might even want to use distracting shot somewhere and a bow on swap...the pet interrupt is utter crap (don't aim it at anything you intend to interrupt...spam it and hope you hit anything 1s cast or less).

Program Ftw · Apr 09, 2007, 01:07 AM // 01:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheOneMephisto

A ranger build without dshot?

Proggy... you make me sad... :'(

Ahw pandas, don't be sad!

Program Ftw · Apr 09, 2007, 01:14 AM // 01:14

OK, I've made a rework:

Ferocious Strike
Distracting Shot
Brutal Strike/Maiming Strike
Brutal Weapon
Otyugh's Cry
Comfort Animal
Charm Animal
Resurrection Signet

10+1+1 Beast Mastery
7+1 Expertise
9+1 Marks
10 Communing

Comments?

Thanks,
Pr0gram

TheOneMephisto · Apr 09, 2007, 08:51 PM // 20:51

Taking Otyugh's over call of haste? I'd say that if you have a reliable way to deal with Aegis (dshot, mirror), then call of haste would be much better. Also depends on how fast pets can switch targets with the new controls (haven't tried).

Program Ftw · Apr 09, 2007, 09:32 PM // 21:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheOneMephisto

Taking Otyugh's over call of haste? I'd say that if you have a reliable way to deal with Aegis (dshot, mirror), then call of haste would be much better. Also depends on how fast pets can switch targets with the new controls (haven't tried).

Panda! : D

Pets switch on demand.

The thought going through my mind at the time is, this build *needs* Ferocious Strike to keep going, if I had to choose between the skills, I would personally value the build being kept stable over a slightly higher DPS.

Thanks,
Pr0gram~

Amy Awien · Apr 10, 2007, 10:16 AM // 10:16

Perhaps focus less on Brutal Strike for damage dealing. Whenever I see people mentioning energy problems in a Beast Master, they invariably run Brutal Strike.

In general, pet skills are all 5E and at 13 expertise cost 2. Pet attacks come every two seconds and you regen 2 energy every two seconds. Roughly, IAS increases attack frequency and energy usage, while target switching (foes die frequently

) replenishes energy.

One thing you can kick is Brutal Strike. Sure, when the target is below 50% is does twice the damage compared to something like Predators Pounce. But it's also twice as expensive.

So, I'd kick brutal Strike for Predators (or another 5E utility, like Poisonous Bite), then kick Ferocious in favor of Enraged.

Edit: NvM the note on rez, I see it's for PvP. I'd still take a look at swapping brutal strike.

Epinephrine · Apr 10, 2007, 01:46 PM // 13:46

As a pet user, I'll agree with the above. Brutal Strike is overpriced really, predator's Pounce gives good returns for the investment with a sizable damage bonus and some pet healing at half the cost.

I want to find a decent running setup with a pet, but it's a challenge. Heal as One got an ok buff, but using your elite slot for a self heal really hurts, and it still isn't that good, Run as One has a ridiculously low duration and offers nothing else as a benefit and Using Rampage as One to run seems like overkill, though it could make you an offensive threat.

If you have any ideas I'm interested

TwinRaven · Apr 13, 2007, 05:36 PM // 17:36

IMHO you are killing your energy management by dedicating so much to communing for one skill. Sure, you get the energy pop from Ferocious Strike, but the damage you lose by not using Enraged Lunge but instead using Brutal Weapon is pretty steep. Think of it this way: you get an extra 13 damage per hit with Brutal Weapon...so that's about 40 extra damage every 3 attacks (5-6 seconds). Now , I can't remember pet attack rates (and don't feel like looking it up atm) but With the increased attack speed of Call of Haste Using Enraged Lunge you up that to a tasty 80-115 damage every 5 seconds if you have several skills recharging. AND if you put a buch of those points from commining into expertise, your energy problems are significantly reduced.

Here's another thread on the subject: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10139021

Here's something I posted on another forum some time ago. With the update in Otyugh's Cry, some revisions are in order...situationally speaking, these are the core of how I've run Beastmaster for near a year now...Pure Beastmaster seems to require a bit more finese and really should be equipped with Troll Ungent as the Wiki build suggests if you have no healer. Some of the info is from other builds/wiki and forums...not claiming and originality or creation here...I can tell you from experience...these are the best I've played.

A good pet build can work well in PvP and PvE. I typically prefer PvE, but run the same build(s) in places like Fort Aspenwood. I use variations of builds built aroun Enraged Lunge with my pet depending on my mood and will mix them up as the situation dictates. For instance: when in an area where fleshless creatures dwell, refrain from reliance on conditions.

All my pet builds use druids armor for the energy bonus (beast master's insignias are a viable option) a Superior Rune of Beast Mastery in the mask and Sup Vig if you can afford it.

I carry a staff (such as trapper's staff given in Fires in the East quest out of Ascalon) for extra energy reserves and often a longbow with +5 energy for long range targetting.

A "pure" beast master build:

Attributes:

Beast Mastery 12+3+1=16
Expertise 12+1=13

There's no real need for leftovers, but marksmanship may make you feel better...though your bow is only there to determine what target your pet is to attack.

Skills:
Charm Animal, Comfort Animal, Res Sig...self explanatory

Call of Protection...for 120 seconds your pet has a 21 base damage reduction.
(*cost 5 (net 2), recharge time 90 secs)
Symbiotic Bond...for 312 secs your pet gains +3 health regen & 1/2 damage dealt to your pet is redirected to you,
(*cost 10 (net 5), recharge 55 secs)
Predatory Bond...for 21 seconds attacks by your pet heal you for 33 points.
(*cost 10 (net 5)recharge 30...note 9 seconds of non-healing time)
Call of Haste...for 30 seconds your animal moves and attacks 25% faster.
(*cost 10 (net 5), recharge 25 seconds)
Enraged Lunge...[ELETE] Your animal attempts an attack that deals +24 damage (max 80) for each recharging Beast Mastery skill. (note: includes itself as recharging skill....so 3 others plus elite will deal max damage)
(*cost 5 (net 2), recharge 5 secs...note the long recharge times on previous skills)

*cost of skills is before Expertise reduction...52% cuts cost in half-ish (guildwiki has a chart explaining it in detail)...a major rune that brings expertise up to 14 only saves one point of energy on cost 10 skills (brings them to 4)...IMHO not worth the loss of health to save 3-4 energy every minute)

Basically the strategy is to keep all buff skills recharging (even if their effects outlast their recharge times) and spam Enraged Lunge every 5 seconds for a monster hit of 17-41 base damade +80 bonus for a whopping 97-121 damage every 5 seconds plus the hit of 17-41 damage while the skill is recharging...124-162 damage in 5 seconds!! and every 5 seconds as long as your energy lasts...with a high expertise and a pool of 38 energy (druids plus +5 energy longbow) you can deal 496-648 potential damage in 20 seconds while being healed for 264-330 (depending on wether or not call of haste is speeding up pet attacks while using predatory bond).

Your bow is useless for other than calling targets for your pet, so feel free to switch to a staff if your evergy gets low...stay away from melee and make use of map features that obstruct you from other rangers.

This build works well if you can get used to no self healing and the 9 second gap in predatory bond...

A gateway method for getting into this build is to switch to the attributes:

Beast Mastery: 11+2+1
Expertise:9+1
Wilderness Survival: 9+1
Marksmanship:8+1

With the attributes set this way, drop Predatory Bond and use Troll Ungent as a self heal that is less dependant upon your pet making a hit (which can be a pain if a caster kites your pet while another player is hitting you)...and can be used whenever you need it....even if your pet is dead. Also, with a low req bow, you will make up for the damage your pet does not make while hitting between Enraged Lunge strikes...You may feel more confident having a little damage capability, though slight. A less than "pure" Beast build, but has essentially the same damage output. The +8 regen from the Troll Ungent is not as much healing as Predatory Bond, but frankly, I find it more dependable.

Variation:

Using either of the attribute set-ups (depending on your comfort level), trade out the pet buffs for Poisonous Bite, Feral Lunge, Toxicity (spirit) for some tasty degen with the same damage bonus from Enraged Lunge (just watch the evergy as the recharge times are shorter....and watch your pet's health for lack of buffs).

My Usual Build:

I personally like these attributes:

Beast Mastery: 11+2+1
Expertise:9+1
Wilderness Survival: 9+1
Marksmanship:8+1

And these SKills:

Troll Ungent
Call of Protection
Call of Haste
Poisonous Bite
Predator's Pounce
Enraged Lunge [E]
Comfort Animal
Charm Animal

Yes....no res sig included...usual, as I run with heroes and henchies...Take out Poisonous Bite if you need res left in for live group as Predator's Pounce does an adequate damage bonus (+33) while healing your pet (+47)...when spammed with Enraged Lunge (5 seconds alternating each) you put out quite the hurtin' while making up slighly for the lack of additional pet buffs by giving your pet a bit of a "self-heal". Sometimes I throw is Disruptive Lunge to interrupt folks when they try to heal...timing for this skill is tough, but worth it when it hits...it disables skills for 20 seconds after it interrupts...bummer for someone trying to heal...and has on several occasions been the quick end of the ever-cocky Touch Ranger.

For those who say pet builds suck or don't do any damage...I tend to disagree. If played well...a good pet build can issue sizable damage and provide a player with the ability to heal and attack simultaneously, cause conditions and damage to one player while kiting another. It is a versitile build that can be adapted to fit many situations...And trust me...NOTHING satisfies like dominating a player who is just too full of themselves and being able to say, "Wow, you were just owned by my pet!"

See this link for a comprehensive pet guide: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=89491

Good Hunting!

Ankkasika · Apr 15, 2007, 09:35 AM // 09:35

I recently started using brutal weapon beastmasters and petsmiters again, and I can't understand why you're putting points in marksmanship when you have no prep, no IAS and no attack skills...

A wand at 9 casting attribute gives you a bit better damage than a bow at 9 marksmanship AND the ability to use a focus, so naturally any brutal weapon beastmaster should do like OP does and get high commu+BM, maintain brutal weapon on both of you and maximize your DPS that way.

So my point is that you don't put so many attributes in communing just to get brutal weapon, but also it's wand and focus. I prefer 10 commu, 8+1 exp and 12+1+(1-3) BM for maximized damage even when a couple ferociouses miss. (10 commu vs 12 commu the only difference is 1 point more damage from brutal weapon)

But i also find that a pure beastmaster can never be as powerful as a beastmaster that also does damage himself or buffs the pet (brutal weapon, smiting, thumping, whatever you want to take), because you are effectively wasting attributes and the damage you would get from a wand or a bow (certainly higher than you get from 2 more points in beastmastery).

XvArchonvX · Apr 15, 2007, 07:16 PM // 19:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwinRaven

I carry a staff (such as trapper's staff given in Fires in the East quest out of Ascalon) for extra energy reserves and often a longbow with +5 energy for long range targetting.

...

There's no real need for leftovers, but marksmanship may make you feel better...though your bow is only there to determine what target your pet is to attack.

...

Your bow is useless for other than calling targets for your pet, so feel free to switch to a staff if your evergy gets low...stay away from melee and make use of map features that obstruct you from other rangers.

Personally, I think the best equipment for a beastmaster is a +5 spear of fortitude (make it zealous if you want to use it for energy management) and a -5% +30 shield. This gives both extra energy storage, extra energy regeneration if desired (which is better than extra energy storage when it can be sustained). Having extra armor and +60 health is also very helpful for a beastmaster who generally has little self protection. I can see the use of Communing weapons when using Brutal Weapon as being ok, but it still wouldn't be my first choice.

Epinephrine · Apr 16, 2007, 08:13 PM // 20:13

I'd have to agree that you really want a weapon to be an effective BM. Free wand/bow or whatever hits add up, and the attribute can also add to damage. Running Communing for Brutal Weapon is a fine example, with 9 communing Brutal Weapon on self and pet and a wand you are adding 11 per hit from each of you, that's 11 or so DPS from the Brutal Weapon and the 9 or so DPS from wanding - 20 DPS just like that? Plus the damage your pet puts out, adds up pretty fast.