Curse

Marverick · Apr 22, 2007, 08:32 PM // 20:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by SnipiousMax

^ Not when an auto-attacking warrior with no skills/IAS/Buffs/or mods can pump out over 30 dps.

...lol? An axe does what.. 5-20 damage against end-game Torment mobs with their insane armor? That every 1.33 seconds is nowhere near 30 DPS.. unless you managed to Arcane Mimicry that insane +50% attack speed hard mode mobs have.

The problem with Burning Arrow is how much energy it and Apply Poison consumes. You won't have the energy to use any other bow skills.

XvArchonvX · Apr 22, 2007, 08:52 PM // 20:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marverick

The problem with Burning Arrow is how much energy it and Apply Poison consumes. You won't have the energy to use any other bow skills.

Put 14 in expertise and you should be fine. The build I run in most cases is:
[skill]Savage Shot[/skill] (or [skill]Crossfire[/skill]) [skill]Distracting Shot[/skill][skill]Apply Poison[/skill][skill]Burning Arrow[/skill][skill]Natural Stride[/skill] (Optional slot, usually Mending Touch or Smite Hex) [skill]Troll Unguent[/skill][skill]Rebirth[/skill] or [skill]Resurrection Chant[/skill]

14 expertise (major rune)
9 Wilderness (minor rune)
14 Marks (sup rune + mask)

In high level PvE areas, base damage attacks of any class are relatively low, but warrior attack skills can still pump out strong dps. Degen in these areas can be strong to use since it is not armor dependent, but other classes can still be stronger damage dealers in these cases. The ranger's strength still relies on it's ability to give utility along with it's damage rather than it's pure dps imo.

BohemianKeith · Apr 23, 2007, 01:10 AM // 01:10

The beauty of the ranger is not in its dps ,its in its ability to inflict a mix of conditions and damage and stop you from removing them via interruptions or counter them via crippling or blind. The ranger is the most versatile class in the game as far as i'm considered. So my friend stop hunting for the ultimate dps and begin looking for the most effective ranger you can make, dmg is nice but your enemy not being able to follow you or hit you is even better, especially when they are bleeding/poisoned/burning to death as you kite away. That was the hardest lesson i learned in GW , in pve i always looked for dmg but i learned over time survival and long term damage is king. one less attack skill and one more defense skill can make a big difference.Sorry i got off topic i just cant post without helping a fellow ranger out.

Age · Apr 23, 2007, 01:18 AM // 01:18

Pindown+Cripshot+Apply Poison there you go a good way to make someones day.This is if this wasn't already said never read the whole thread.

Skyy High · Apr 26, 2007, 04:13 AM // 04:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marverick

...lol? An axe does what.. 5-20 damage against end-game Torment mobs with their insane armor? That every 1.33 seconds is nowhere near 30 DPS.. unless you managed to Arcane Mimicry that insane +50% attack speed hard mode mobs have.

He's referring to base damage vs a level 20 opponent, read: a human player. Which is why bow attack rangers are generally not used as straight DPS in PvP.

Personally, I'm a fan of rangers, especially in the high end areas like you mention. They can do a lot of degen, and quite a few of their skills do good +damage, which happens to be armor ignoring. I tend to run Marauder's and either Burning or Prepared; if I run Prepared I have pretty much as much energy as I want for other things.

Master Ketsu · Apr 26, 2007, 06:30 AM // 06:30

For future referance, guild wars is not about DPS like WOW is. The sooner you get out of that mindset the less of a tard you will be when you get to PVP.

deadmonkey4u · Apr 26, 2007, 06:42 AM // 06:42

Indeed, GW is less DPS focused then WoW. Rangers can do fair damage but aern't anywhere near the greatest DPS'ers in PvE. Iv never complained about ranger damage in PvE.

Since you state your PvP oriented, Ranger's can play vital rolls in interrupting and adding a bit of pressure.

Xiaxhou of Trinity · Apr 26, 2007, 06:44 AM // 06:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by BohemianKeith

The beauty of the ranger is not in its dps ,its in its ability to inflict a mix of conditions and damage and stop you from removing them via interruptions or counter them via crippling or blind. The ranger is the most versatile class in the game as far as i'm considered. So my friend stop hunting for the ultimate dps and begin looking for the most effective ranger you can make, dmg is nice but your enemy not being able to follow you or hit you is even better, especially when they are bleeding/poisoned/burning to death as you kite away. That was the hardest lesson i learned in GW , in pve i always looked for dmg but i learned over time survival and long term damage is king. one less attack skill and one more defense skill can make a big difference.Sorry i got off topic i just cant post without helping a fellow ranger out.

maybe before factions i can agree with you and see how great a ranger is but......an assassin throws conditions damage and should be able to shut down the target, in terms "assassinating" them. I believe the ranger's greatest assets in present GW are expertise (can run spirits, spam more attacks, etc) and its ability of interrupting opponents. No one else can interrupt like a ranger (mesmers are limited to interrupting primarily spells, though Dwarven Battle Stance with Distracting Blow is a nice Hammer shut down build =]). Running a Beast Master is fun, though I have to say that it bores me (I think different animals should become more unique, faster attack speed this animal, more dmg from that pet, etc)

When it comes down to it, I play ranger because of the bow's property of the longest range weapon, interrupts, and DPS spike (not the best but then again what class can ever outdamage the assassin or ele? warrior is up there too =])

XvArchonvX · Apr 26, 2007, 02:52 PM // 14:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaxhou of Trinity

maybe before factions i can agree with you and see how great a ranger is but......an assassin throws conditions damage and should be able to shut down the target, in terms "assassinating" them.

Assassins generally spike with conditions while rangers spread them.

Also, just to share a tip for anyone working their way through Hard Mode in Prophecies. If you go through quests like Gates of Kryta that have lots of undead and you want to be a damage dealer, put Judges Insight on your bar with either Barrage or some other damage dealing elite. While Heart of Holy Flame on a dervish secondary can work also, the 20% AP from Judge's gives a noticeable kick. I used this build and was doing up to 200 damage per arrow on targets like skeleton sorcerers and at least 90 damage per arrow to hard targets like warrior undead.

moko · Apr 26, 2007, 05:25 PM // 17:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

Pindown+Cripshot+Apply Poison there you go a good way to make someones day.This is if this wasn't already said never read the whole thread.

please stop playing ranger if you are using cripshot and pindown.

Quote:

Assassins generally spike with conditions

no..assassins do not spike with conditions. they spike with..dagger damage. the fact that assassins can dish out a deepwound in their chain doesn't mean they spike with the condition -- it just helps killing. >->

Fallen Nephilim · Apr 26, 2007, 06:03 PM // 18:03

rangers dont have massive DPS unless they're going for a pure-pressure build, but what the do have is the best spiking ability in the game (imho)

Sophitia Leafblade · Apr 27, 2007, 01:52 PM // 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mokone

no..assassins do not spike with conditions. they spike with..dagger damage. the fact that assassins can dish out a deepwound in their chain doesn't mean they spike with the condition -- it just helps killing. >->

ok slightly off topis but If Eviserate can be considered a spike skill so can Twisting fangs which spikes with conditions also.

Ranger are Great all rounders they can do most things (aside from healing team members very effectively) this includes high dps builds. But u have to have the right build to do it.

XvArchonvX · Apr 27, 2007, 02:24 PM // 14:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mokone

no..assassins do not spike with conditions. they spike with..dagger damage. the fact that assassins can dish out a deepwound in their chain doesn't mean they spike with the condition -- it just helps killing. >->

Ok, maybe the implications of my statement were not clear enough for you. Assassins spike with THE HELP OF conditions. Putting poison and deep wound on a target clearly won't spike them. Using it in the middle of a spike will make the spike go faster. Deep wound = less health = faster death. Dazed = no stopping the spike = faster death. Poison doesn't do much in a spike, but it still helps.

The point here was that Assassins use their condition application in a spike whereas rangers use it in pressure.

moko · Apr 27, 2007, 04:43 PM // 16:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by XvArchonvX

Ok, maybe the implications of my statement were not clear enough for you. Assassins spike with THE HELP OF conditions. Putting poison and deep wound on a target clearly won't spike them. Using it in the middle of a spike will make the spike go faster. Deep wound = less health = faster death. Dazed = no stopping the spike = faster death. Poison doesn't do much in a spike, but it still helps.

The point here was that Assassins use their condition application in a spike whereas rangers use it in pressure.

ah right, that makes more sense.

my apologize.

XvArchonvX · Apr 27, 2007, 05:49 PM // 17:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mokone

ah right, that makes more sense.

my apologize.

S'ok, it's amazing sometimes how often so many people argue or debate with others only to realize that they actually agree on the same thing, lol.

clawofcrimson · Apr 27, 2007, 06:37 PM // 18:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by BohemianKeith

The beauty of the ranger is not in its dps ,its in its ability to inflict a mix of conditions and damage and stop you from removing them via interruptions or counter them via crippling or blind.

I agree. Barring skills the ranger has very poor dps... in fact if you want dps without skills go paragon. They have higher DPS than axes swords and bows...

The true shining factor about the ranger is the skills used to inflict conditions, interupts and other utility support.

zling · Apr 27, 2007, 06:38 PM // 18:38

Trappers can dish out a hefty load of damage, and if you're too worried about interruption use /Mes with Mantra of Resolve, add Energyzing Winds+high Expertise and you wont have energy problems. also cast time can be reduced with [skill]Trapper's Speed[/skill]

Age · Apr 30, 2007, 09:46 PM // 21:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mokone

please stop playing ranger if you are using cripshot and pindown.

no..assassins do not spike with conditions. they spike with..dagger damage. the fact that assassins can dish out a deepwound in their chain doesn't mean they spike with the condition -- it just helps killing. >->

What is wrong with Crip Shot and Pin Down they are two great skills?I won't stop playing Ranger as I base some of my builds off of PvP.

XvArchonvX · Apr 30, 2007, 10:21 PM // 22:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

What is wrong with Crip Shot and Pin Down they are two great skills?I won't stop playing Ranger as I base some of my builds off of PvP.

True those are good skills (even though it may be argued that Crip Shot is outdated by newer skills like Harrier's Grasp), but I believe Mokone said this because Crip Shot and Pindown were in the same skill bar even though Crip Shot has a 1 second recharge.

Nkah Sennyt · Apr 30, 2007, 10:21 PM // 22:21

I think he meant Cripshot and Pin Down together - redundancy.