Curse

Mega Storm · Apr 13, 2006, 03:03 AM // 03:03

This all started while in search of the perfect axes...which I do often as a collector of fine axes. I came across an axe i'de never heard of before as far as the mod. Now I have created a build for it and i'm trying to get the word out on how well it works compared to the run of the mill builds that make people shy away from "wammos"

Zealous Chaos Axe of Fortitude
6-28 req.9
15 always
"-1 HP regeneration" <--that's the one, also could use a -5 energy version or enchanted version as well for same results.

I use an eternal shield for this build to help out
Eternal Shield
max gold req.10
Received -2 in stance
Received -2 enchanted<---another key must

Now to fully unleash that axe of yours: The skills you need
Live Vicariously, Mending, Endure Pain, Defy Pain, Berserker Stance, Penetrating Blow, Disrupting Chop, and either a res or purge conditions if you're farming. You can swap out skills if you have a preference other than mine, but Live Vicariously, and Mending are a must, even taking out Berserker Stance is not that wise IMHO but i'm not perfect

do what ya do

Have a spare axe for 2nd weapon set: I use Victos for now but am in the market for a chaos -5 energy 15 always to replace it later on. Keep your spare axe equiped until you attack, then switch to your zealous one, to preserve energy/HP.

Armor: Droks--Full Gladiator besides the Knights helm (for strength) and knights boots (for less damage)

Runes: Superior Absorption, Superior Vigor, Major axe-(save some HP), Superior Strength I threw on a spare minor absorption on the other armor piece..not needed.

Attribute Points:6, 0, 2, 16, 13, 0, 0, 0, I suppose you could use sword.. but they suck IMHO. crappy damage from my experience

HP total: 435 Energy total: 26

The reason why I posted this:...

It freakin works like a charm! I stay alive so well I can farm things I never even got close to with other builds. I hold out longer than anyone i've ever seen in GVG even while they gang up on me.

The steady HP/Energy gain while in combat is simply amazing! I don't even need to use hp gain skills now but you can if you like. Defy/Endure Pains keep me rockin. The Berserker stance keeps me on the steady uphill climb during the most grueling situations.

* I can take constructive critacism * But don't come off all elitist on me and say that this build doesn't work or it sucks because I know better, and it's better than coppying someone elses "iway" build or whatever just because everyone and they're brother says it's good.

All I say is this:...Here is what I figured out for a SOLID build for W/Mo, and I want to share it because it's a breath of fresh air and very origonal.

If you know someone else that built this, by all means call me a hack, but I promise you this took a while to come up with on my own.

At least try the axe and mending with live vicariously..you'll be happy.

Murder In China · Apr 13, 2006, 03:04 AM // 03:04

Mending in GvG? You're crazy! Crazy I tell you!

How do Swords suck?

mint · Apr 13, 2006, 03:24 AM // 03:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mega Storm

"-1 HP regeneration" <--that's the one, also could use a -5 energy version or enchanted version as well for same results.

How is that preferred over a while enchanted axe?

There is a large part of me deep down wishing that this post is a joke

Mega Storm · Apr 13, 2006, 03:43 AM // 03:43

*sigh* always at least one. You answered your own question by quoting me. It's what i'm using (and found that started the whole idea). Look at what you quoted me on.. the other choices of axes that are good for the build too.

This thread is not a joke.

What if the enchantmenst fail? what if you use a -5 energy and you needed 1 energy to live or die? That's why I like that axe mod. i gain HP while fighting so it's no biggie for the -1 regen

chrislee149 · Apr 13, 2006, 03:59 AM // 03:59

...Seems like a vampiric mod would do the same thing, just better. And even then, I don't really like the sound of it.

cryoes · Apr 13, 2006, 04:08 AM // 04:08

Sword warrior with riposte / glads or elemental resistance would rape this build for both PvE and PvP. Your build isn't really original im sure lots of people use live vicariously all you did was put on a zealous axe. If you want to improve on this build ditch endure pain.. its useless as the health leaves when skill wears off. Replace it with watch yourself or dolyak signet if farming. I don't know why your looking for a 15 always when you are always enchanted, just get a 15 (enchanted) mod and save your energy. If your enchantments fail.. your dead thats what happens if they fail which will happen alot in GvG.

Mega Storm · Apr 13, 2006, 04:13 AM // 04:13

Vamp would work great too. I love that mod, but you wouldn't get the energy regain from zealous which keeps you clickin away on your much needed skills during battles.

Sword warriors are a dime a dozen...like most builds. No offense to you but I dislike swords. Overrated imo.

cryoes · Apr 13, 2006, 04:16 AM // 04:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mega Storm

Vamp would work great too. I love that mod, but you wouldn't get the energy regain from zealous which keeps you clickin away on your much needed skills during battles.

Sword warriors are a dime a dozen...like most builds. No offense to you but I dislike swords. Overrated imo.

Swords do more dmg .. its a simple fact. Riposte > Axe

glove1038 · Apr 13, 2006, 04:19 AM // 04:19

final thrust owns any axe attack

Tweecers · Apr 13, 2006, 04:21 AM // 04:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by cryoes

Swords do more dmg .. its a simple fact. Riposte > Axe

that is such a newb statement to not be backed up by anything.

axes have more max damage then swords... meaning higher crits then swords.. hmm?

correct me if im wrong, but riposte only blocks physical attacks am I right?

how does that dwarf the axe user class?

so your saying a single skill is better then an entire weapon class?

Univerisally buddy, axes are better for pve/farming.

Pvp i dont know , because I dont pvp, but please I hate posts like that.

kosh · Apr 13, 2006, 05:11 AM // 05:11

wiki state of mind on the subject:

"On average, the highest level axe will do 12.8 damage per second (17 damage per hit), while its sword counterpart would do 13.9 dps (18.5 dph) and the hammer would do 16.3dps (27dph). It is therefore best to invest heavily in Axe Mastery to increase the likelihood of a critical hit and make use of the axe's high end damage. Based on the critical hit research, a max damage axe will produce more average damage per hit than a max damage sword at weapon mastery 11 or higher"

Katari · Apr 13, 2006, 05:21 AM // 05:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mega Storm

This all started while in search of the perfect axes...which I do often as a collector of fine axes. I came across an axe i'de never heard of before as far as the mod. Now I have created a build for it and i'm trying to get the word out on how well it works compared to the run of the mill builds that make people shy away from "wammos"

I think you are confused. That IS the build that people shy away from. It's like a paladin, yet more usless. No IAS, no speed boost, no Evicerate, no deep wound, a defensive elite, and claims to be for PvP. A Paladin premade with 16 sword mastery, saddly, will out-preform your build.

Quote:

Originally Posted by glove1038

final thrust owns any axe attack

Except Evicerate.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cryoes

Swords do more dmg .. its a simple fact. Riposte > Axe

So then Riposte > Sword > Hammer? No, I don't think so, not in PvP at least. Edit: Just noticed the title.... GvG/PvE!? eeeeeeeh...

Mega Storm · Apr 13, 2006, 05:22 AM // 05:22

I tried out full setups on axe and sword to see for myself long ago. Axe won by a landslide, therefore I like axes more. "To each his own"...my axe mastery is at 16. what you got on your sword?

Mega Storm · Apr 13, 2006, 05:37 AM // 05:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by boxcarracers052

This build makes me laugh. Mending in PvP FTW!!

? I'de like to know what's laughable about a working build. Critique yes, straight up dis...pfft.

mighty xxl · Apr 13, 2006, 08:27 AM // 08:27

OK, u want criticism... i will criticise

For PvE this build might work - no comment here

For PvP:
- little output dmg - u have only 2 attack skills: penetrating blow and disrupting chop
- with mending and Live Vic on u + zealous chaos axe u will have problems with energy. That is because ur targets will be casters who will run away from u (kiting). If u attack Warriors - u will only tickle them (hi hi)

- enchants WILL be removed. In PvP Drain Enchantment is higly used for energy management. Since u will be close to casters u will be targeted for removal.
- u have no speed boost. if i am a monk i will be on constant run and a simple reversal will keep me alive from u.
- in PvP the role of Warriors is to do dmg, not to tank. In PvP usually Warriors are last targeted so if u are alone with no backup monk u are dead in the water anyway with an entire team pounding u.
- again about energy - energy denial is highly used in PvP - an energy surge and u will have no energy left. Also cause u will have negative energy regeneration (live vic, mending and zealous) u will surely lose enchantments

And finally, if this build was any good don't u think that by now, in all those months that ppl play PvP (or years), they didn't consider ur ideea? They have and they threw it away. Reasons? look up^^

Bottom line: Little output damage, energy problems, not one skill that will help ur team (shields up, watch urself) - for PvP this build is equal to 0.

U wanted criticism - u got it.
If u want to defend ur build - pls do so. Comment on what i didn't like on ur build and tell me ur version....
Best regards,
Steve

Racthoh · Apr 13, 2006, 08:32 AM // 08:32

16 strength in GvG? Please provide some insight as to why you would be tanking in GvG as opposed to a 16 axe.

Savio · Apr 13, 2006, 08:40 AM // 08:40

GvG and PvE are not even remotely similar, so building for both is laughable.

First off, the items should not matter in a PvP build. If you're making this for PvP it's expected that what you have is max, which generally is widely available. Nobody cares that you have a Chaos Axe or Eternal Shield.

As for the actual build itself: The only reason you're doing damage is because Warriors are already capable of putting out a lot of damage without skills. With only one +damage skill you're doing next to nothing if you have a target.

You last a long time because you aren't the main target as a Warrior. Most competent teams will be going after everyone but you first. If they do target you, you'll just have enchantments removed and be whittled down shortly. The main point of your build is tanking, which is absolutely worthless for PvP. Build your Warrior for damage and then we'll talk.

Undead Preacher · Apr 13, 2006, 08:43 AM // 08:43

PVP= 1 BIG Problem!

your stating that you rely on your axe melee for energy and health gain... with the zealous mod and LV... this is your problem... in PVP alot of the time you will get nailed with some sort of hex where you have to stop attacking...SS, Empathy, Spirit Shackles.... the LIST GOES on...

IF your hexed or blind and can't hit in melee..... your well, doomed

and where may I ask is your dmg output...

If I was fighting you 1 on 1 with warriors...oh man, nvm, no comment... I VOTE for a 1 on 1 ARENA for factions..

anyway.... Its a nice thought... just not a very nice build

Oh and as far as mending...
Enchantment in pvp = removal = wasted slot!

This might be a nice AXE for pve...but I wouldn't want to bring a -1 health regen axe into a pvp battle... especially since your relying on Mending and LV which will get removed by any good team

wheel · Apr 13, 2006, 09:34 AM // 09:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mega Storm

This all started while in search of the perfect axes...which I do often as a collector of fine axes. I came across an axe i'de never heard of before as far as the mod. Now I have created a build for it and i'm trying to get the word out on how well it works compared to the run of the mill builds that make people shy away from "wammos"

Zealous Chaos Axe of Fortitude
6-28 req.9
15 always
"-1 HP regeneration" <--that's the one, also could use a -5 energy version or enchanted version as well for same results.

First of all, no one cares if you have a Chaos Axe or a simple PvP Axe, so omit that entirely if you hope to hold up any premise of this being a PvP build. Second, -1 HP regeneration is probably the worst of the inherent damage boost drawbacks, second to -10 armor while attacking. There's no reason that you should not be running 15^50, 15 while in stance, 15 -5e. 15^50 is popular for a reason; it's good. Your build is based upon having plenty of self healing, meaning that you're going to be over 50% health most of the time anyway, so your choice of -1 health regen is idiotic because 15^50 is going to be triggering most of the time anyway, without giving yourself 2 dps forever while using this axe.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mega Storm

I use an eternal shield for this build to help out
Eternal Shield
max gold req.10
Received -2 in stance
Received -2 enchanted<---another key must

Again, no one cares that you farm enough to afford an Etneral Shield. It works just as well as a round shield with the exact same stats. It's a subtle embodiment of a superiority complex that isn't needed in an intelligent discussion. At any rate, the shield is fine for the effect you're trying to accomplish in the build, mitigating damage. The fact that the build's purpose is entirely useless in a competitive PvP environment is another issue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mega Storm

Now to fully unleash that axe of yours: The skills you need
Live Vicariously, Mending, Endure Pain, Defy Pain, Berserker Stance, Penetrating Blow, Disrupting Chop, and either a res or purge conditions if you're farming. You can swap out skills if you have a preference other than mine, but Live Vicariously, and Mending are a must, even taking out Berserker Stance is not that wise IMHO but i'm not perfect

do what ya do

Ah, the actual build, where the magic happens. There's so many conceptual issues with the build that it's hard to begin to discuss what's wrong with it. Let's start first with a theoretical standpoint. When you design a build, you have a goal. The goal is to maximize utility in your team so that you're getting the absolute most out of your 200 attributes and 8 skills. That said, the purpose of this build accomplishes two things, it is self-defensive and self-preservative, and it does mediocre damage as well as it has one interrupt. Now, as to the goal of your overall build, there is no reason for it to be self-defensive and preservative to the degree in which you place it. It isn't performing a crucial role in the team, and it is limited in its ability to survive. While I'm sure that it survives versus intermittent damage indefinitely, it's ultimately accomplishing nothing. Spikes will kill it relatively easy. The only reason that you should be running such a defensive build is if it accomplishes something important elsewhere in the build. Nothing in this build justifies having so much defense. You do such little damage that the team will NOT care what you do at ALL. They'll be LOVING you for bringing such a defensive build because you're sacrificing all of your damage in doing so. It's a wasted slot, and they'll effectively be facing 7 players. All else equal, they will win by default.

What I'm getting at is that being a tank in PvP is all good and all in some situations (which are extremely few and far between), but you had better have a VERY good reason to justify its use. Nothing in this build or in virtually any team build can justify the inclusion of so many defensive skills. You may say "It saves the healer from having to heal me," but this is a fundamentally wrong argument. You won't be saving the healer any time or energy because no one but NPCs are going to be attacking you in GvG because there's no reason for them to do so. You don't affect their goal of winning one iota.

There's no reason to address the individual skills and alternative choices because there is nothing positive about this build in a PvP environment. The only salvageable skills are Endure Pain, Ressurection Signet, Penetrating Blow, and Disrupting Chop, and the method in which they're used in this build are completely detrimental towards your goal of being effective.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mega Storm

Have a spare axe for 2nd weapon set: I use Victos for now but am in the market for a chaos -5 energy 15 always to replace it later on. Keep your spare axe equiped until you attack, then switch to your zealous one, to preserve energy/HP.

Armor: Droks--Full Gladiator besides the Knights helm (for strength) and knights boots (for less damage)

Runes: Superior Absorption, Superior Vigor, Major axe-(save some HP), Superior Strength I threw on a spare minor absorption on the other armor piece..not needed.

Attribute Points:6, 0, 2, 16, 13, 0, 0, 0, I suppose you could use sword.. but they suck IMHO. crappy damage from my experience

HP total: 435 Energy total: 26

Victo's Axe is bad because Vampiric is unconditionally better damage than Victo's Axe's sundering. Also, did I mention that we don't care if you intend to get a Chaos Axe? At any rate, you don't spike with Zealous, because on a spike, your goal is to do the most damage in the shortest time possible, not to gain energy when you're attacking during the spike. You spike with Vampiric.

Swords do very good damage. A sword warrior with Sever/Gash alone will outdamage your warrior wholescale.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mega Storm

The reason why I posted this:...

It freakin works like a charm! I stay alive so well I can farm things I never even got close to with other builds. I hold out longer than anyone i've ever seen in GVG even while they gang up on me.

The steady HP/Energy gain while in combat is simply amazing! I don't even need to use hp gain skills now but you can if you like. Defy/Endure Pains keep me rockin. The Berserker stance keeps me on the steady uphill climb during the most grueling situations.

If it works like a charm, why don't you see ANY top guilds running anything close to this build? That's a rhetorical question, but the answer needs to be expressed in words. Top guilds don't run this build because it accomplishes NOTHING in a competitive PvP environment, because it neither damages effectively or contributes to the team by giving healing or damage mitigation of the offense.

Airey · Apr 13, 2006, 09:41 AM // 09:41

Quote:

Again, no one cares that you farm enough to afford an Etneral Shield

I care

Well... no, not really