Curse

Minus Sign · Apr 20, 2006, 02:26 PM // 14:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

You need energy management on hex fire-support illu/dom builds? Explain!

Wastrol's spams are my guess. E.mangers are always nice, particularly in longer fights with boss mobs, but I wouldn't call it "scary" if a hex-spammer ran without it.

...I'd just be scared if a hex-spammer ran with Wastrol's in the first place...

]SK[ · Apr 20, 2006, 03:56 PM // 15:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

The skin ownz.

It does but it doesn't do the job that the cane and off-hand do.

Avarre · Apr 20, 2006, 04:03 PM // 16:03

Agree, I prefer these over Ilyana's staff or my rare staves:

Willcrusher looks nice but the mods are meh.

tuperwho · Apr 20, 2006, 04:15 PM // 16:15

This is the build I use for normal PvE, and sub in arcane echo for FoW

Domination 12+1+3
fast casting 8+1
inspiration 10+1

backfire
empathy
wastrel's worry
energy surge
energy burn
leech sig.
shatter hex
energy tap

I have also had some fun with illusion builds using clumsiness, ineptitude, conjure phantasm, phantom pain, etc.

And don't forget about IW. I was able to use this skill through THK and even part of the fire islands if you're careful about your aggro and play it smart.

Dave83 · Apr 21, 2006, 04:20 PM // 16:20

Mine vary depending where I am. I run domination the majority of places I go. Me/Mo

16 dom
9/11 fast cast
9/11 inspiration

or 10/10 fast/insp
remainder in protection

empathy
echo
shame/guilt
leech sig/diversion
shatter hex
inspired hex
ether feast
rebirth

I use these items mostly:

20/20 Dom staff +5 defence, +5 defence
20/20 Dom staff +5 energy, Dom +1 20% chance
Korvalds cane + 20/20 collectors dom chakram
Garboks cane + Garboks chalice

Armor is a mix of rogues and enchanters.

V flexible build imo ^^ I can echo empathy and spam it fast - which is sometimes better than ss if you consider foes arent always clumped; rangers, casters etc. sometimes I find myself doing major damage just spamming shatter hex. If im in trouble I can echo ether feast. I personally dont run inter much these days as most of my guildies have rangers doing that.

SziP · Apr 22, 2006, 02:47 AM // 02:47

I call this the Szip Build

Proffesion:
Mesmer/Monk

Attributes:
Domination-16
Fast Casting-11
Inspiration-9

Skillz:
Energy Surge(elite)
Energy Burn
Emphaty
Mind Wrack
Shatter Delusions
Drain Enchantment
Energy Tap
Rebirth

-Tips-
First off Mind Wrack+Shatter Delusions = constant dmg because they both recharge fast and u can spam them pretty nicely. I promise , you will rarely be waiting to deal dmg, you will constantly do. And energy management its pretty easy. Enjoy

SnipiousMax · Apr 22, 2006, 03:44 AM // 03:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaimirth Etaivella

Don't see any e.bonds guys. Starting to scare me with the lack of energy management.

Fortunately, playing a PvE mesmer, means using hexes, that last awhile. You don't really have to worry about Removal as much as you do in PvP, and its not nearly so fast and furious. I usually toss out a hex or two, or three, and then sit back, and wait on a chance to use a money skill while my group cleans up. Energy is never really a problem.

Raptox · Apr 24, 2006, 02:27 PM // 14:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minus Sign

Wastrol's spams are my guess. E.mangers are always nice, particularly in longer fights with boss mobs, but I wouldn't call it "scary" if a hex-spammer ran without it.

...I'd just be scared if a hex-spammer ran with Wastrol's in the first place...

I tried running Wastrel's in my flex slot a few nights ago and didn't like the results. Shatter Enchant seemed to be a better fit, especially I was dealing with Dolyak mobs and MoP. Ah well.

Energy isn't a huge worry if you've got a good group. The THK seige was, to quote the monk, more like a meat grider full of Mursaat tidbits. Fights didn't last long enough to deplete energy and the breaks in between were more than enough to recharge our best skills.

I'm tempted to throw Arcane Echo in my build somewhere and mass spam Ineptitude but I'm not sure if that'd work well. Might be too energy intensive.

azuresun · Apr 24, 2006, 06:57 PM // 18:57

My all purpose PVE build:

Me/Mo

Dom 15 (sup rune + hat)
Insp 11 (minor rune)
FC 11 (minor rune)

1. Empathy
2. Cry of Frustration
3. Power Spike
4. Power Drain (energy management)
5. Inspired Hex or Backfire
6. Shatter Hex
7. Ether Feast or a Mantra
8. Resurrect

I dont understand why ppl aren't including Power Drain for energy management on their Dom Mesmers. Works like a charm.

Minus Sign · Apr 24, 2006, 09:12 PM // 21:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raptox

I tried running Wastrel's in my flex slot a few nights ago and didn't like the results. Shatter Enchant seemed to be a better fit, especially I was dealing with Dolyak mobs and MoP. Ah well.

Energy isn't a huge worry if you've got a good group. The THK seige was, to quote the monk, more like a meat grider full of Mursaat tidbits. Fights didn't last long enough to deplete energy and the breaks in between were more than enough to recharge our best skills.

I'm tempted to throw Arcane Echo in my build somewhere and mass spam Ineptitude but I'm not sure if that'd work well. Might be too energy intensive.

I may be a little hard on Wastrol's users sometimes; color me abashed. It's a good skill that does what you want it to. Only problem with that is how mesmers have so many great skills that do more than we could hope if the situation is right. I like to say I'm not one to bash a build or a skill most times; I just think there are better things out there for Mesmers to do than DD. It's sorta like asking your monk to go smite. They can, but its not really their job.

Your AEcho comment is what I really wanted to reply to. Yes; you are going to see some serious energy issues if you don't bring Emanagers. But, again, the nice thing about most of our energy managers is that Emanagment is a by-porduct of thier effect. Interupt and gain a chunk of energy. Steal energy and gain some back at the same time. Even if you're using it against an ele the dual effects of these skills are nice enough to see play.

GL with it; the echo skills are pure sweetness imho; giving you the option to spam whatever skill you feel the need to use, as you see that need arise in combat.

EDIT: One thing I hate to admit: I rarely bring enchant strips in PvE. I have nothing against them; Shatter E is a great skill. It just doesn't suit my play style most of the time. I don't know why but its never fit right in any pure mesmer build I've used. If the enchantments effect is bad enough that I need to get rid of it, I can usually interupt it (due to a minor Migraine addiction on my part).

Question: do you ever go Me/N? I feel they have better enchant strips than we do, but thats my PvP side talking.

Raptox · Apr 25, 2006, 02:06 PM // 14:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minus Sign

Your AEcho comment is what I really wanted to reply to. Yes; you are going to see some serious energy issues if you don't bring Emanagers. But, again, the nice thing about most of our energy managers is that Emanagment is a by-porduct of thier effect. Interupt and gain a chunk of energy. Steal energy and gain some back at the same time. Even if you're using it against an ele the dual effects of these skills are nice enough to see play.

GL with it; the echo skills are pure sweetness imho; giving you the option to spam whatever skill you feel the need to use, as you see that need arise in combat.

EDIT: One thing I hate to admit: I rarely bring enchant strips in PvE. I have nothing against them; Shatter E is a great skill. It just doesn't suit my play style most of the time. I don't know why but its never fit right in any pure mesmer build I've used. If the enchantments effect is bad enough that I need to get rid of it, I can usually interupt it (due to a minor Migraine addiction on my part).

Question: do you ever go Me/N? I feel they have better enchant strips than we do, but thats my PvP side talking.

I'm an E/Me, so I wouldn't be able to go Me/N. Sometimes (infrequently) I run Air and I farm with Earth, but my preference is full Dom/Ill. I don't get rune bonuses but I try to balance it out by longer sustained casting via EStorage.

I haven't had the chance to try Arcane Echo + Ineptitude yet, but I recall trying Arcane Echo + Arcane Conundrum back in Thirsty River. It wasn't a total disaster but I was pretty much sucked dry of energy when I tried to use the combo. Yes, even with the extra energy from EStorage. Trying to shut down both monks at the same time was the problem.

I frequently bring Shatter Enchant for two reasons. First, I normally play with one or two humans (MM and Ele, mostly) and the rest hench. Thus, I am the only one who's going to be able to shatter at all. Second, while I've become reasonably adept at managing the idiot brigade, getting them to stop attacking a MoP'd target is like trying to get a fat kid to stop eating cake*. It's faster to just shatter the MoP and continue the beating rather than sit there while Alesia/Mhenlo, Claude, and Dunham die trying to tank an invincible target. After all, it all comes down to knowing the mentalities of your group.

*Sincerest apologies to all the weight-challenged and cake lovers in the audience.

Minus Sign · Apr 25, 2006, 08:08 PM // 20:08

Yeah, you mentioned earlier that you're a E/Me. I even commented on that...beat me with a stinky fish.

Just to make sure we both beat this into the ground: Enchant Strips are GOOD!

Especially in your case I'm sure. there are more and mroe E/Mes out there now, without the fast casting assist their interupts. I don't know how much that helps or hurts, but for me FC +10 is a must. Its just that good, imho.

PS: the Thirsty solution: AConnundrium the boss, and throw backfire on the Priest (with Shame if you care to bring that skill too). As long as your team is targeting the priest, any heals from the Boss will be easily interupted by you in the 10+ seconds both healers are alive (self heals for the TR priests are a joke; its WoH you have to be wary of. If your team can't kill the priest while you've locked down its ability to self heal with Backfire and you have the Boss in a neat little bundle of interupted fury, there is another problem...possibly the MM.). Try that some time if a guildie asks you to help him through again. If I were Echoing a skill against monk teams, it would prolly be Backfire 1st in PvE 3 times in 4 and Shame or Diversion next.

Think of backfire against self-heals as a 10 second shut down. Nothing they cast on themselves will do more heal than backfire's damage will, and anything they cast on another target takes a huge chunk out of their squishy HP.

Last (but not least for the E/Mes and Me/Es amoung us) is that you needn't worry as much about AEcho in the first place. You already have a nice Elite for the combos I spoke of: Glyph of Renewal. In many ways and with certain skills, its actualy better than Echo as an Elite. Having that and AEcho on your bar is semi-redundant to me; most times I only need to be able to cast 1 skill with regularity per mob group.

Glyph of Renewal+ Ineptitude won't work obviously, but most times you can find a skill that does the thing you need it to and not take your Elite slot. Thats why I like Echo spams: if their effect is what I need, I may be tempted to overlook skills that are more effective in how they do it.

Food for thought.

Raptox · Apr 26, 2006, 02:44 AM // 02:44

You know, I tried running a full-time interrupter in PvE and pretty much just stood around not doing much of anything. Each individual monster in a mob seems to not exist for long enough to make interrupting all that effective. This is, of course, in direct contrast to PvP. Thus, I usually bring along only Cry of Frustration and Guilt. As you said before, Interrupting + Energy Gain = yum. I guess maybe you can consider Diversion as an after-the-fact interrupt in that it cancels every other "intended" Orison of Healing, for example.

I think that last paragraph was supposed to seque into something about Fast Cast but I can't remember how that was supposed to happen. -_-

I helped guildies through Thirsty last week and it was a complete joke. I had better skills this time around, of course, but still. If people follow directions, it's easy. When your hench get bodyblocked by Josso instead of attacking the priest, well...

I can see Backfire working in that situation, yes. Against monks, it's great. Just watch how fast Alesia kills herself when it's applied to her. However, I was under the impression that overall in PvE it wasn't as useful as in PvP. There was something about the monsters not casting fast enough to make it effective...the argument escapes me now, but definitely I see that counterexample as worthwhile. I bet it was "enemy elementalists" and not "enemy monks" that they were talking about.

I've seen the math concerning GoR and I understand it. Not that it's hard to understand, it's just not obvious at first. I'll look at my skill list and see if there's an effective combo there.

I'm tempted to just stick with the Clumsiness + Ineptitude combo, though. You get an interrupted attack, damage, blindness, and more damage. Trying to echo it in some way just seems greedy.