Curse

Francis Demeules · Mar 16, 2006, 08:01 PM // 20:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by LouAl

I think that is a cool idea (panic, not migraine

) and you could top it off, after a quick focus swap, with a parasitic bond, or mind wrack or something else...just to keep E lord on that much longer.

With an inspiration weapon set, this shouldnt be a problem. If I remember correctly, Ether lord does -4/+4 for 10-11seconds at lvl 16 inspiration, right?

LouAl · Mar 16, 2006, 08:24 PM // 20:24

Nah, I think it caps out at -3/+3 clear until you get to attb lvl 19 and then it hits -4/+4, but at 16 it would last 10 seconds so you'd be looking at a 10e gain/loss, providing it stays for its duration

Francis Demeules · Mar 16, 2006, 08:51 PM // 20:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by LouAl

Nah, I think it caps out at -3/+3 clear until you get to attb lvl 19 and then it hits -4/+4, but at 16 it would last 10 seconds so you'd be looking at a 10e gain, providing it stays for its duration

Ok, on what I think now is purely no hex remover or something we gain E regen. It just for Energy Degen only on what I will write.

if we say -3/+3 for 10 sec, then......

You receive a +3 E regen. (Total of +7)
The target suffer -3 (-1 warriors, 0 Rangers and +1 Casters)
We put Panic and Malaise with for a -4 E degen (-2 warriors, -1 Rangers and 0 Casters)
A Total of -7 E degen (-5 Warriors, -4 Rangers and -3 Casters)
Team with a necro with Wither, Total of -9 E Degen (-7 Warriors, -6 Rangers and -3 Casters)

-7 Energy degen alone and -9 Energy degen when teamed with a necro for 10 seconds who has Wither.

For 10 seconds

The Warriors will suffer a -7 E degen
The Rangers will suffer a -6 E degen
The Casters will suffer a -5 E degen

LouAl · Mar 16, 2006, 09:01 PM // 21:01

looks cool, remember tho that malaise and wither will end when their energy hits 0. Not that it will really matter because they will still have Panic on for a while

So, your casting order would be Panic, Malaise, Lord, *focus swap,* mind wrack
and your Necro team mate would get Wither on about the time as you get Panic on...

If you also fit shame and power leak in there it would be lots of fun

Francis Demeules · Mar 16, 2006, 09:11 PM // 21:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by LouAl

looks cool, remember tho that malaise and wither will end when their energy hits 0. Not that it will really matter because they will still have Panic on for a while

So, your casting order would be Panic, Malaise, Lord, *focus swap,* mind wrack
and your Necro team mate would get Wither on about the time as you get Panic on...

If you also fit shame and power leak in there it would be lots of fun

We'll see them when they got Mind Wrack. But we cant MW after because they will stay at 0. That my point from here, Wastrel Worries. They cant do anything except maybe signet every 20-30 seconds to remove it but that all.

LouAl · Mar 16, 2006, 10:58 PM // 22:58

That works, I was more thinking of MW as a cover for all those hexes...but the WW wound definately be better dmg once they are at 0 and staying there. But after Lord ends and you only have Panic running, MW becomes an option again.

Hmmm, I didn't realize that recharge on Malaise was so fast. You could keep that on as many people as you want (as long as you can afford the hlth degen)

Eaimirth Etaivella · Mar 17, 2006, 04:22 AM // 04:22

And we could do the same thing w/o ether lord...

Avarre · Mar 17, 2006, 09:55 AM // 09:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Francis Demeules

For 10 seconds

The Warriors will suffer a -7 E degen
The Rangers will suffer a -6 E degen
The Casters will suffer a -5 E degen

Meaning casters lose a total of 10 x (5x0.33) = 16.6 energy

Orrrr we could just use 2 dom spells and get a higher result in 2 seconds, with a stronger followup. Unless you intend to hit them with this when they're already low... which is useless, as it won't drain to negative values.

Francis Demeules · Mar 17, 2006, 01:14 PM // 13:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

Meaning casters lose a total of 10 x (5x0.33) = 16.6 energy

Orrrr we could just use 2 dom spells and get a higher result in 2 seconds, with a stronger followup. Unless you intend to hit them with this when they're already low... which is useless, as it won't drain to negative values.

By they will stay at 0 energy during a certain time.

I tested with 16 inspiration where the break point is

lvl 14 max I can say for 10 sec -3/+3

Avarre · Mar 17, 2006, 01:30 PM // 13:30

With energy burning build using mind wrack, they'll be kept near a 0 energy value and take significant damage, using only one character, whereas this setup requires two.

It works, but that doesn't say much. Panic is a good skill, but the main use is for the mass energy degen, complete devastation of noncaster classes, etc. Lord can't be applied to multiple targets... and as I've already mentioned, doesn't do wonders to your own energy if removed, especially if you're using Panic.

Also, it depends on your target... CoP will tear this asunder, with veil up its a quick 3 (4 if the monk uses guardian first) hexes removed -> all of the ones you applied

Francis Demeules · Mar 17, 2006, 03:26 PM // 15:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

Also, it depends on your target... CoP will tear this asunder, with veil up its a quick 3 (4 if the monk uses guardian first) hexes removed -> all of the ones you applied

Then you must trick the monks to put these skills.

Banebow · Mar 17, 2006, 03:45 PM // 15:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

Meaning casters lose a total of 10 x (5x0.33) = 16.6 energy

They will lose 10 * (9 * 0.33) = 29.7 energy, not 16.6. Don't forget to include energy that is not gained from natural regen. They will not physicaly be at, say, 10 energy if they had a 40 max, but they will have lost 16.6 and not gained back another 13.1.

I prefer the current e-denial of surge, burn, and SoW myself, and I think it is more effective than this. But mass lower regen could be a possible thing to consider.

Francis Demeules · Mar 17, 2006, 04:31 PM // 16:31

I prefer to be original than follow the same routine or popular builds like this old E-Denial. I try to make these skills who players think "useless" to " something useful". One of my goal, which its difficult for many reasons, make Keystone Signet useful with a build that could work at least. But its a bit off topic.

Build teamed with a necro (not tested so I dont know if it works well or not but its just a guest)

Mesmer

Rez signet
Diversion
Panic (E)
Ether lord
SoW
E Burn
Mind Wrack
(Support skill/Energy management because I dont considerate E Lord as an E M)

Necro

Wither (E)
Malaise
Rez sig
(Others for support)

Th reason why I put Diversion..... Disable monks skills when you try to put these hexes on targets. These Hexes can work like WW, react the target and use a skill in his/her face then re-use these skills again after they're recharged.

Yukito Kunisaki · Mar 17, 2006, 06:46 PM // 18:46

The idea I like, but sadly, most 'pro' players still scoff at the idea of Wither and Malaise due to their unethical [lol] approach with @ 0 e. it ends... [gah]

I can imagine how devastating they'd be with good curses levels. If Focus Swapping wasn't an issue [and forcing them to do it throughout the game actually hampered them] then i'd consider it but as of yet, the anti-energy curses skills are usually laughed at...

Peewee · Mar 17, 2006, 06:56 PM // 18:56

good for e denial, cos it may stop a monk from casting for that extra 9 seconds. Dont tell me that is useless. its only 5nrg, so i would cast it when i have no little nrg left, to make the sacrifice small as possible. like many skills, those that think it has no use proberly dont use it effectively in the first place. Agrueing that you lose your entire nrg reserve is really besides the point, as if you use it correctly it can pick you up from near to no energy, and drain the enemy as well. If for some bizarre reason your questioning its merits as a skill you use as a base for a build, then yes, its crap, in the same way that using a practised stance with a trapper is crap....

Francis Demeules · Mar 17, 2006, 07:01 PM // 19:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peewee

good for e denial, cos it may stop a monk from casting for that extra 9 seconds. Dont tell me that is useless. its only 5nrg, so i would cast it when i have no little nrg left, to make the sacrifice small as possible. like many skills, those that think it has no use proberly dont use it effectively in the first place. Agrueing that you lose your entire nrg reserve is really besides the point, as if you use it correctly it can pick you up from near to no energy, and drain the enemy as well. If for some bizarre reason your questioning its merits as a skill you use as a base for a build, then yes, its crap, in the same way that using a practised stance with a trapper is crap....

The Builds I gave earlier was not to make E lord the main spell but a way to show its effectivness in a E Degen build

Dragannia · Mar 18, 2006, 02:58 AM // 02:58

Monks are at near zero energy all the time anyway, and a good monk has Divine Boon. Hit Ether Lord when they're below five energy, and presto! Zero energy regen.

LightningHell · Mar 18, 2006, 04:11 AM // 04:11

I'm leaving this topic. Officially.

Avarre · Mar 18, 2006, 09:47 AM // 09:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banebow

They will lose 10 * (9 * 0.33) = 29.7 energy, not 16.6. Don't forget to include energy that is not gained from natural regen. They will not physicaly be at, say, 10 energy if they had a 40 max, but they will have lost 16.6 and not gained back another 13.1.

I'm counting direct loss of energy from the amount the target has when hexes were applied... 16.6 is correct.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragannia

Monks are at near zero energy all the time anyway, and a good monk has Divine Boon. Hit Ether Lord when they're below five energy, and presto! Zero energy regen

Have you ever played against or as a boon monk? Presto, focus swap, contemplation of purity

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peewee

as if you use it correctly it can pick you up from near to no energy, and drain the enemy as well.

It gives you an additional 1 energy per second. You lose 5 + 2 (regenned during casting approximately) + whatever above 5 you had, to regain 10 energy (not counting the natural +4) at 16 inspiration. The net gain is practically nil. The only possible use is to try to keep a target at low energy, however hex removal isn't hard to come by (as mentioned above) unless you cover the hex. Which is hard when you've removed all your energy.

Banebow · Mar 18, 2006, 04:11 PM // 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

I'm counting direct loss of energy from the amount the target has when hexes were applied... 16.6 is correct.

Which is what I said in my post. But if you want the full amount of energy denied, than 29.7 is the correct number.