Curse

dgb · Mar 16, 2006, 04:12 AM // 04:12

Sorry - the shatter will bounce off a RoF? Where exactly will your RoF come from to cover your IW?

Assuming it wont be interupted. Guardian doesn't get interupted a hell of a lot in randoms, which is the only viable place to use a IW mesmer.

A monk and a mesmer? Drain enchant/inspired enchant are standards on my monk these days. I don't need a mesmer helping me.

Feel free to keep to the idea that you have a good build as you pwn stance whammos in RA. You'll just lose to any reasonable monk, necro or mesmer.

Eaimirth Etaivella · Mar 17, 2006, 05:07 AM // 05:07

Lets see, my pet interrupts your guardian.
My monk covers my IW, as you said monks are common.

LightningHell · Mar 17, 2006, 05:10 AM // 05:10

I still say the title of the thread is an oxymoron.

Eaimirth Etaivella · Mar 17, 2006, 06:55 AM // 06:55

Agreement there

Avarre · Mar 17, 2006, 09:58 AM // 09:58

I don't see why the major argument is focusing around how IW mesmers have their enchant removed. Yes that is relevant, but its the secondary issue that overshadows the major concern.

Have we forgotten that meleeing things with 60AL isn't exactly cool? IW's damage isn't very high anyways, without enchant removal you could simply kill the mesmer post haste.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

I still say the title of the thread is an oxymoron.

Damage/Energy wise, IW is one of the most efficient skills in the game

LightningHell · Mar 17, 2006, 10:10 AM // 10:10

I would kill a Mez straight away if she was going melee. It's such an obvious skill. Which is why it's not really efficient.

In the roleplaying world of which I am imprisoned in, yes it is a good skill. A damn good one.

glountz · Mar 17, 2006, 10:28 AM // 10:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by tigernz

The build I typically run with if I feel like playing IW looks something like:
Illusion: 16
Tactics: 12
FastCast: the rest

IW{E}
Flurry
Sympathetic Visage
Deadly Riposte (very nice with the boost it got)
Phantasm / Clumsiness
Distortion
Heal Sig
Res

On Flurry: real energy sink. You have no E-management to support it.
Riposte: Too conditionnal. Face non-warrior heavy team (Ranger/Caster) or have opposite warriors don't attack you because of distortion and you have a dead skill.
SV: not so good cover enchant (30 sec recharge). Especially if you fight multiple enchant shattering. However it's better than nothing. IoH is better if you can deal with Cripple. (Me/M or Me/N).
You have nothing either to slow down targets or to run faster than your opponents. Kiting will own you.

To the OP: replace Plague touch by Plague sending. Seriously.

Avarre · Mar 17, 2006, 11:27 AM // 11:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by glountz

On Flurry: real energy sink. You have no E-management to support it.
Riposte: Too conditionnal. Face non-warrior heavy team (Ranger/Caster) or have opposite warriors don't attack you because of distortion and you have a dead skill.

Unlike the usually preached distortion, which is so uberawesome, only working against warriors and some rangers

I'd say take DRiposte over distortion. Bring flurry as your stance, you WANT warriors to hit you because with DR and clumsiness you completely devastate them.

Eaimirth Etaivella · Mar 18, 2006, 12:53 AM // 00:53

I think distortion is practically needed, I mean mesmers have 60al and are a high priority target as is...
Distortion also blocks a high # of interrupts, and more importantly pin down-not that interrupts are really important as well.

d3kst3r · Mar 18, 2006, 01:11 AM // 01:11

Distortion and Flurry in the end don't stack. Choose Flurry for offense, or Distortion for defense. In this build I've chosen Distortion. And blackout got nerfed since I posted this build therefore making the build as a whole less efficient.

LightningHell · Mar 18, 2006, 04:15 AM // 04:15

Use Flurry + Distortion. Switch when needed. At least that's what I think. Heehee.

That's a lot of energy down the drain, though.

p3falien · Mar 19, 2006, 12:40 PM // 12:40

Having played my IWmesmer (ME/W) build for a long time now i can add this to this thread:

the skills you should always have in combination with IW are:
flurry since there is no dmg reducing applied to IW hits.
Ilussion of Weakness since a Mesmer is not as tough as a Warrior and therefore you can "add" a health buffer.
SV this seems useless but it's a MUST HAVE when enchantment removal comes into play, in PvE you can either wait till the strip/rend/shatter/remove has occured or you can rush in with SV as cover.... waiting is the thing i never wanna do since this build is made with the intention to wipe out casters ASAP.

Other very helpfull skills are clumbsiness and a good tactics stance that applies to the situation ( like BS when knockdowners are around and Deadly riposte when you are target of a Warrior class monster)
both these skills have a tendancy to spike dmg your target quite quickly.

Ofcourse many ppl will say that IWmesmer is not a very tough build but that is not the point of it all... i'dd like to see this build as the ultimate Warrior backup. When a Warrior is "dmg-dealing disabled" his role is merely tanking. despite ANY dmg reducting-condition ( weakness, blinding ) an IWmesmer can still take out anyone is short time.

one other major advantage of this build is that any -when enchanted attrib will work always since either IW or IoW is up all the time. this build shines with a enchantment+% weapon and Malinons shield.

for the non believers i wanna add this: my IWmesmer has survived many FoW runs, and not because i'm a chicken running from everything. remember that a foe chasing you does absolutely nothing to endanger your team and therefore my guildmates call me a "flee tank" and are quite happy to see me support our regular stancer in hard areas like FoW.

D Fault · Mar 19, 2006, 01:06 PM // 13:06

If you want to cover IW use at least a 7 insp channelling and/or vigorous spirit. They'll both last at least as long as IW will and will help with energy should u cast any other spells, and help with healing.

mariano · Mar 19, 2006, 04:08 PM // 16:08

I have just tested Illusionary Weaponry to see how it works and I feel clumsy. Think I have not tested it with those warrior's skills... , the problem is having to run to foes, they may simply run away, and not unoften they are stronger than the mesmer in melee.

I am thinking that some of the Faction's assasin skills to teleport may add a point to the IW build, mainly by being able to make surprise attacks, as well as being able to scape avoiding body blocking and faster than running.

Well, this may be the future...

Eaimirth Etaivella · Mar 20, 2006, 06:34 AM // 06:34

I think it would be interesting to see a casting mesmer that acted like a "normal" mesmer in every way...who just happened to bring IW+distortion to kill warriors that got close to her.

Banebow · Mar 20, 2006, 04:08 PM // 16:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaimirth Etaivella

I think it would be interesting to see a casting mesmer that acted like a "normal" mesmer in every way...who just happened to bring IW+distortion to kill warriors that got close to her.

I tried that once, but you don't have an elite available unless the warrior charges you. It was more effective for me to cast my spells and then rush in with IW than it was to cast my spells and wait.

JR · Mar 20, 2006, 05:39 PM // 17:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

Damage/Energy wise, IW is one of the most efficient skills in the game

Actually, warrior adrenaline attacks are. They do more damage, and cost no energy at all. On top of that you get the bonus of better amor.

If you want a melee character, use a warrior. IW is trash in anything but Random Arena.

Minus Sign · Mar 22, 2006, 12:28 PM // 12:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

I don't see why the major argument is focusing around how IW mesmers have their enchant removed. Yes that is relevant, but its the secondary issue that overshadows the major concern.

Have we forgotten that meleeing things with 60AL isn't exactly cool? IW's damage isn't very high anyways, without enchant removal you could simply kill the mesmer post haste.

Damage/Energy wise, IW is one of the most efficient skills in the game

Agreed, and counterable. Mesmers have 2 of the best damge reduction stances in the game, Ele resist for Castors and Distortion for Melee. Swap depending on the damage being inflicted.

Something everyone needs to remember is that any attack can be countered, any enchantment stripped, and any heal negated/interupted. Is it worth it to focus your skillslot on one skill at the cost of others, or would such become a question in futility when that skill does not appear on the other side of the fence?

Regardless, this is a good skill. This is a neat build. d3kst3r: props.

EDIT: deja vu...haven't I said that before?

Avarre · Mar 22, 2006, 01:01 PM // 13:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

Actually, warrior adrenaline attacks are. They do more damage, and cost no energy at all. On top of that you get the bonus of better amor.

If you want a melee character, use a warrior. IW is trash in anything but Random Arena.

Hey genius, that would make eviscerate +42/0. A number divided by 0 is 'undefinable' and thus is impossble to compute. The only definable number would have a positive energy cost, hence not be a signet or adrenal. Isn't math great?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minus Sign

Agreed, and counterable. Mesmers have 2 of the best damge reduction stances in the game, Ele resist for Castors and Distortion for Melee. Swap depending on the damage being inflicted.

Well sure, as if energy isn't already a horrendous problem on most IW builds, and there's always wild blow. Regardless of distortion... ending up tanking much of the enemy team hurts. Sure, you'll last awhile with self heals... but then you're not hitting!

LightningHell · Mar 22, 2006, 01:20 PM // 13:20

We have two different threads here, one for PvP which argues IW is bullcrap, and PvE of which IW is great.

For the PvPers, I would look at Avarre's UW Solo thread.

For Avarre, I'd say, you're on a totally different context than JR.