Curse

Undead Preacher · Mar 08, 2006, 06:50 AM // 06:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banebow

Besides monks, not really (and even monks are debatable). It just takes less brain work for people to stick with the trinity, so they do.

Mm-hm, and this was mentioned before as well. Probably the biggest thing going against the mesmer currently is the fact that no fotm farming build involves one. (can't be a tanks order dog? Better not try and find a group

)

Actually, it is a PvP warrior. My attitude comes from the statement that mesmers are effectivly pointless in PvE and should stick to PvP. Shall we say that elementalists should stick to PvE because warriors can cause more damage in PvP?

Never seen an ele make much of a difference in pvp... maybe cuz the mesmers that own drain then.... so yea, lets say they should stick to pve

Arcanis the Omnipotent · Mar 08, 2006, 06:50 AM // 06:50

10 years old, yeah that's me. Geez, you really are acting like a noob throwing out insults like that. And yes, I do realize I just became a hypocrite there, dont care much.

16 curses huh? Ok, so if I do say 12 in Dom and 12 in Illusion, and fast cast say.... Conjure Phantasm, Phantom Pain, Energy Burn and Energy Surge, and Cry of Fustration, how many curses spells are you gonna have done by then? And, how quickly do you think you're going to out damage me, when Conjure is easily put on 3 people very quickly, thus by the time the other spells recharge, another man is dead almost instantly.

Speed is what a mesmer does best. The most things put on an enemy in the fastest ammount of time. Even if you do have 16 in curses, and there for have the highest damage potential, who would have more curses on someone faster? Not only that, Mesmers can recharge their own skills in half the time, meaning you could easily recast all those curses again, probably before the Necro got through them all once.

16 Curses speed killing, right...

Quote:

nah that was a joke, if u read all my post its not that mesmers arn't useful, they are... just not as needed or lets say this different.... they don't fit as well into the team builds that people are playing nowadays....

And there you go one more time, not getting it. The point is that a mesmer can fit into any team build, regardless. Not only fit in, improve it. If you tell a good PVE mesmer what the team is building for, he'll have something in 3 seconds that will interact with the entire team.

If anything, Mesmers are essential to PVE more than people know, and people should know it. Properly taken care of by the rest of the party, a mesmer can essentially shorten battle times by 50% or higher by doing what they do better than any other class. Screw every enemy type up. They arent better than every other class, and Necros have things going for them that Mesmers cant do. But a Necro is not as good at a Mesmer's job as he is, not even if the Necro is a Mesmer secondary.

That job is simple f*ck every enemy up as fast as possible, in as many unexpected ways as possible. When you see a Necro, you have an idea. MM, Battery or Hex. But when you see a Mesmer, you have no idea what to expect. And that's why we're underappreciated in PVE, because we do the job, get it done, and its not visible. Its not seen. Mesmers tend to make PVE teams function better and faster, and but because they are purely a support class, the main classes dont really see the results like they do with a monk.

Lady Callingwell · Mar 08, 2006, 08:25 AM // 08:25

The main issue with mesmer is just the lack of "uber-pve" skills, like goof AoE, stances (distortion pwns in PvP but isnt really worth it in PvE), and other "immortallity" skills. The sole reason that PvE enemies are stupid (e.g. no spikes, no kiting) and the lack of prolonged battles makes a mesmer running the domination line relatively less usefull, inspiration less necessary as energy can just be burned awayand regened before the next battle and the degen based illusion line doesnt stand a chance against all of the late game, insane health enemies.

Avarre · Mar 08, 2006, 09:38 AM // 09:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undead Preacher

k, if mesmers are so godly.... why is this thread here

this thread is... oh man... nobody likes me...

memsers are the kids left on the sideline, the ones picked last for dodgeball, lol.... they can be great... and the statements i made was in reference to them not being in demand... If i was making a team... then I would honestly have a mesmer in the mix.... I was simply saying thats not how many people look at it

To put it Rp-ingly... how did you ever swindle Grenth into giving you power?

The only good thing I have ever seen from a necro in PvE is Spiteful spirit. And every necro runs it, and the vast majority completely suck at it. Got news for ya necro, Spiteful is actually a mesmer domination elite, put under curses. Its the elite empathy.

The only fully-natural build necros have that I appreciate is MM, the traditional style necro that is actually cool.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arcanis the Omnipotent

If anything, Mesmers are essential to PVE more than people know, and people should know it. Properly taken care of by the rest of the party, a mesmer can essentially shorten battle times by 50% or higher by doing what they do better than any other class. Screw every enemy type up. They arent better than every other class, and Necros have things going for them that Mesmers cant do. But a Necro is not as good at a Mesmer's job as he is, not even if the Necro is a Mesmer secondary.

What the man said.

Mesmer shutdown also lends to the fact they are nigh-invincible in PvE. With empathy and distortion alone you can do quite alot, even if your party is dying. With SV, you aren't at risk from warrior spike damage. Distort makes you immune to rangers, Hex removal from necros (which incidentally, are the mob-class least feared in all of FoW), interrupt on eles... get the picture? Necros have degenerated into a pseudo-ele damage class, mesmers are not just blind offence.

NinjaKai · Mar 08, 2006, 09:44 AM // 09:44

Holy Hera have mercy. More than 80 posts in this thread. O_O I never expected it to last this long.

LightningHell · Mar 09, 2006, 02:50 PM // 14:50

I completely agree to anything Avarre says and Arcanis.

Both play Magic: the Gathering too, as a bonus.

That was random...

Firstly, why is Preacher in the Mesmer subforums anyways?

Secondly, why does Preacher say "teh N3rc0 0wnz j00 m4zm4r 1n pve"? Has he even played the Mesmer class before?

The necromancer canNOT and will never be able to replace the Mesmer class. Vice versa. And for all classes.

Oraculum · Mar 09, 2006, 04:57 PM // 16:57

I've got a Me/N and N/Me. Both are equally good, and combined, both are equally superb for their given tasks.

Personally, the necro I use for MM, coz I find it fun. The mesmer I use coz I find the whole mesmer skill-set fun and love (learning to) interrupt and cause lots of damage. So much so that I may well use a spare slot from Factions to make another Mesmer primary.

NinjaKai · Mar 09, 2006, 05:16 PM // 17:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oraculum

I've got a Me/N and N/Me. Both are equally good, and combined, both are equally superb for their given tasks.

Personally, the necro I use for MM, coz I find it fun. The mesmer I use coz I find the whole mesmer skill-set fun and love (learning to) interrupt and cause lots of damage. So much so that I may well use a spare slot from Factions to make another Mesmer primary.

A key tip to interrupting. Timing is essential.

Lady Callingwell · Mar 09, 2006, 07:52 PM // 19:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by NinjaKai

A key tip to interrupting. Timing is essential.

Timing (I assume you mean reaction speed) is just one part of it. A ranger can dumbly spam his interupts. As a interupting mesmer there is one thing more important, knowing nearly any skill in the game and the capabillity of linking their combo to other skills used around the field. This holds mainly for PvP and a lot less for PvE but even in PvE it's good to realize how differnet targets contribute to a groups damage/healing output and how this can be dropped significantly.

Mesti Arcanus · Mar 09, 2006, 09:54 PM // 21:54

Yeah, knowing WHAT to interrupt is possibly the most important part of interrupting as a Mesmer. Even if you babysit a target (like, say, the enemy monk), you can't just madly try to interrupt every spell it casts. If you do, you're bound to miss some, and then you've wasted that interrupt until it recharges. Once you get better at it, you might be able to hit all but the fastest spells, but until then I'd suggest focusing on figuring out what takes long enough for you to hit. I know there's still days that I miss Orison because my reaction time wasn't good enough.

LouAl · Mar 09, 2006, 10:56 PM // 22:56

ahhh, no more undead preacher to get into flame wars with

NinjaKai · Mar 10, 2006, 02:04 PM // 14:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mesti Arcanus

Yeah, knowing WHAT to interrupt is possibly the most important part of interrupting as a Mesmer. Even if you babysit a target (like, say, the enemy monk), you can't just madly try to interrupt every spell it casts. If you do, you're bound to miss some, and then you've wasted that interrupt until it recharges. Once you get better at it, you might be able to hit all but the fastest spells, but until then I'd suggest focusing on figuring out what takes long enough for you to hit. I know there's still days that I miss Orison because my reaction time wasn't good enough.

Knowing what to interrupt is very important. Shame no ones written a complete guide to mesmers. As for interrupting builds, etc. I would always take Avarre and Arcanis advice. They definitely know what they are doing.

LightningHell · Mar 10, 2006, 02:47 PM // 14:47

Most Blue players know what they're doing.

As someone said, a Mesmer needs to know what the opponent is doing, possibly better than the target himself. And he needs to know how the target contributes to the opposing party. I'll have to add more...later.

DieInBasra · Mar 10, 2006, 04:23 PM // 16:23

Quote:

The only good thing I have ever seen from a necro in PvE is Spiteful spirit. And every necro runs it, and the vast majority completely suck at it. Got news for ya necro, Spiteful is actually a mesmer domination elite, put under curses. Its the elite empathy.

Yeah, because MM's suck, as do batterys. The reason Mesmer aren't that usefull in PvE is because they excel at taking down/shutting down single targets or messing with more then one.
In PvE you almost need 1-2 tanks and healers, which leaves you with 4 characters. You want those characters to do as much damage as possible. SS necros do AoE damage, and mobs are almost always in larges groups. This is the same with Fire eles, and to a lesser extent water and earth eles. Rangers bring other things to the table, like traps(more AoE vs melee) and barrage, interupts, as well as some utility spirits.
Mesmers can take a target down a single target. Woohoo. Almost all of the time you're going to be running into big mobs, where taking them down one at a time just isn't as effective as dealing damage to all of them at once. The times where you do run into a monk boss, sticking rend on the necro and some interupts on the ranger, maybe the tanks as well, can shut them down just as well as a mesmer with backfire.

Quote:

Mesmers are essential to PVE more than people know, and people should know it.

I think that in the 4-5 months that people have been playing this game, if mesmer were "essential" then they would have found out already.

SnipiousMax · Mar 10, 2006, 05:22 PM // 17:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

Most Blue players know what they're doing.

As someone said, a Mesmer needs to know what the opponent is doing, possibly better than the target himself. And he needs to know how the target contributes to the opposing party. I'll have to add more...later.

Dang I always played green....

Mesmer's depened on foresight more than any other class. You could say that a mesmer knows how to play every class, just from knowing how to screw up everyclass. All I know about necro's I learned from playing a mesmer!

NinjaKai · Mar 10, 2006, 05:29 PM // 17:29

Speaking of interrupts. Mesmer are the only profession with the most skills that can interrupt almost any skill.

SnipiousMax · Mar 10, 2006, 05:33 PM // 17:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by NinjaKai

Speaking of interrupts. Mesmer are the only profession with the most skills that can interrupt almost any skill.

Bow interrupts interrupt everything.

DieInBasra · Mar 10, 2006, 05:36 PM // 17:36

Mesmer are horrible interrupters, if that's what you're looking for. An interupt on a mesmer isn't a bad idea, but a mesmer interupter is outclasses by a ranger interrupter by a mile.

romeo_longsword · Mar 10, 2006, 05:37 PM // 17:37

On a lighter note, my new Me was doing the Thirsty River mission, where the priest would heal and rez all his friends every 2 mins.

My baby Me killed all the priests by himself (most damage and supression was applied by him), but with the aid of my team holding the other mods, with one exception that at the end, one of the bosses was a monk, which I had to supress his healing boss while all other was killing the priest.

I am quite proud of the Me class.

/bow

NinjaKai · Mar 10, 2006, 05:40 PM // 17:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by SnipiousMax

Bow interrupts interrupt everything.

What about signets?