Curse

NinjaKai · Feb 28, 2006, 04:50 PM // 16:50

Now this isn't some silly rant or protest. Such would be a waste of time. I'm mere curious why are mesmers so undervalued as a profession. I mean on many occasions I have been substituted for an elementalist or necro or some other person.Finding a group to go into the FoW or UW with a mesmer is task all it's own these days. And I just keep wondering what is wrong with mesmers?

jciardha · Feb 28, 2006, 05:45 PM // 17:45

Simple: people don't want to take risks and "think outside the box."

Mesmers are "outside the box" incarnate. All the other classes fit a classic fantasy RPG stereotype, easily. Mesmers generally do not.

(Then again, it could have something to do with those froofy pink magic sparkles.

)

NinjaKai · Feb 28, 2006, 05:52 PM // 17:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by jciardha

Simple: people don't want to take risks and "think outside the box."

Mesmers are "outside the box" incarnate. All the other classes fit a classic fantasy RPG stereotype, easily. Mesmers generally do not.

(Then again, it could have something to do with those froofy pink magic sparkles.

)

It is rather annoying. I've taken down plenty of high level monsters by myself. Even those pain in the ass monk ones. But no people seem more interested in the other professions. I mean in a mission area or something your bound to find a varied range of monsters that are hard kills that mesmers can atleast make slightly easier.

(They can't stand that mesmer spells are more sparkly than them. XD)

Corinthian · Feb 28, 2006, 05:52 PM // 17:52

Mesmers do not do visible damage. A monk boss falling quickly cannot possibly be because of a mesmer, but an exceptionally talented warrior and his nuker friend.

Silvergun Superman · Feb 28, 2006, 05:59 PM // 17:59

There's nothing wrong with mesmers. Some people are just ignorant and undervalue the abilities and advantages that a mesmer can do for a group.

A Leprechaun · Feb 28, 2006, 06:05 PM // 18:05

does a nuker want to try disrupting in HoH i dont think so!?!

mesmers kick arse

NinjaKai · Feb 28, 2006, 06:10 PM // 18:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corinthian

Mesmers do not do visible damage. A monk boss falling quickly cannot possibly be because of a mesmer, but an exceptionally talented warrior and his nuker friend.

I said high level monsters. Bosses fall into a class of their own.

WoofWoof · Feb 28, 2006, 08:28 PM // 20:28

I think this is true mostly in PVE. Agree with Corinthian that this is mostly due to lack of visible damage. All the group sees is your Mes spinning around doing *something*... they are just not sure what that *something* may be and would rather stick to the warrior/nuker/monk trinity.

In PVP, I think the picture is very different. In RA, the Mesmer is going to be attacked first unless there's a Monk on your team. This tells me that the Mesmer is very valuable

. In TA, you should not have a big problem finding a team. I found that TA teams love to have an e-denial Mesmer. HA is a different story because unless you have high rank you will not fit with the IWAY FoTM and won't be able to find a PUG. As a player with very little Fame and no Rank, I've all but given up on doing HoH outside of Guild events.

Son of Urza · Feb 28, 2006, 08:48 PM // 20:48

I always go for mesmers or necros first in RA if there's no monk, not only because they are rather large threats, but my warrior build is simply better at killing casters than fighters.

It is true that they do not do visible damage, which is unfortunate. It would be nice if you could see you teammate's damage, with little parentheses to say who it was from. Of course, that would have to be enabled as an option, or some people would be annoyed. Options are good.

EDIT: Another reason is possibly that male mesmers look completely, horribly gay. It's not their fault, but they look horrible, and their dance is even worse. Riverdance . . . *shudders*. The females aren't too bad, if a bit hookerish, but they're not as bad as female eles.

NinjaKai · Feb 28, 2006, 09:20 PM // 21:20

In PvP it isn't hard to find a partner. But my point is directed mainly at PvE. I mean the best way to get experience and gold or whatever it weapon or item it is you are desiring are things like farming and missions. But when you can't find people to do it with it then becomes a huge annoyance. I mean once a group wanted me to join their group but I had to have a set list of skills they chose when I know for a fact that not one of them had ever been a mesmer. (Idiots i'm the mesmer what makes you think you know how to do it better when you haven't tried.)

P.S. Urza I find nothing wrong with mesmer armor. It looks distinguished. But I agree the dance is odd. But the warrior one is just as bad. Unless you have some sort of validation for an 70s or 80s whatever it is pelvic thrust dance. Hmm.

WoofWoof · Feb 28, 2006, 10:24 PM // 22:24

Quote:

But when you can't find people to do it with it then becomes a huge annoyance

Henchies are a wonderful thing and work very well for many PVE missions, particularly in the early game where most players do not understand the value of Mesmers. For the later part of the game (Thunderhead Keep and beyond), you will find that more experienced players do understand and appreciate the contribution a good Mesmer can bring to the team. The Domination line seems to work particularly well: Empathy, Backfire, Diversion and some interrupts could be very effective in PVE. Wastrel's Worry is wonderful against bosses because of it's halved duration. Power Block can completely disable a boss for a very long time, etc.

NinjaKai · Mar 01, 2006, 12:10 AM // 00:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by WoofWoof

Henchies are a wonderful thing and work very well for many PVE missions, particularly in the early game where most players do not understand the value of Mesmers. For the later part of the game (Thunderhead Keep and beyond), you will find that more experienced players do understand and appreciate the contribution a good Mesmer can bring to the team. The Domination line seems to work particularly well: Empathy, Backfire, Diversion and some interrupts could be very effective in PVE. Wastrel's Worry is wonderful against bosses because of it's halved duration. Power Block can completely disable a boss for a very long time, etc.

Just for your info my mesmer is level 20. I really should find more friends on GW that I can forge a reliable farming group with.

SnipiousMax · Mar 01, 2006, 05:50 AM // 05:50

I think it all comes down to a post-passive-aggresion-displacement issue. Lets say a warrior decides he wants to have some fun playing around in RA, so said warrior equips his masterful build (mending included of course), enters the arena, and procceds to mock and taunt the other (obviously weaker) classes in the arena. Seconds later, after having mending shattered, and attacking through empathy while blinded, the said warrior starts yelling at his own monk, and of course the well prepared mesmer. Perhaps realizing that his efforts in PvP will never be appreciated like they are in PvE, he returns to where he is respected and feared. He begins to put together a masterful group to beat the next mission, calling of course for warriors! and monks, and maybe an ele (w/ firestorm). After screaming endlessly for hours looking for some plasable combination of the three, a mesmer speaks up, looking to join in the group. All of the pent of aggresion which was unable to be released in PvP (due to a stupid mesmer) bubbles back up into our warrior's psyche, and he maliciously calls for more eles, to show that stupid mesmer who's the king of PvE!

That and people are stupid.

Puppets · Mar 01, 2006, 06:44 AM // 06:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by SnipiousMax

I think it all comes down to a post-passive-aggresion-displacement issue. Lets say a warrior decides he wants to have some fun playing around in RA, so said warrior equips his masterful build (mending included of course), enters the arena, and procceds to mock and taunt the other (obviously weaker) classes in the arena. Seconds later, after having mending shattered, and attacking through empathy while blinded, the said warrior starts yelling at his own monk, and of course the well prepared mesmer. Perhaps realizing that his efforts in PvP will never be appreciated like they are in PvE, he returns to where he is respected and feared. He begins to put together a masterful group to beat the next mission, calling of course for warriors! and monks, and maybe an ele (w/ firestorm). After screaming endlessly for hours looking for some plasable combination of the three, a mesmer speaks up, looking to join in the group. All of the pent of aggresion which was unable to be released in PvP (due to a stupid mesmer) bubbles back up into our warrior's psyche, and he maliciously calls for more eles, to show that stupid mesmer who's the king of PvE!

That and people are stupid.

QFT

Quote:

Henchies are a wonderful thing and work very well for many PVE missions, particularly in the early game where most players do not understand the value of Mesmers. For the later part of the game (Thunderhead Keep and beyond), you will find that more experienced players do understand and appreciate the contribution a good Mesmer can bring to the team. The Domination line seems to work particularly well: Empathy, Backfire, Diversion and some interrupts could be very effective in PVE. Wastrel's Worry is wonderful against bosses because of it's halved duration. Power Block can completely disable a boss for a very long time, etc.

The thing is most people are too stupid to notice that the mesmer has completey shut-down willa the unpleasant/insert annoying monk boss. And when they do kill the monk boss, it's usually "GOOD NUKING ELE!! NICE MENDING AND FIERY DRAGON SWORD WARRIOR."

lyroth.grimstone · Mar 01, 2006, 02:58 PM // 14:58

I really love playing mesmer - for me its one of the best characters in the game. While in PVP i really shine its true that in PVE i have trouble to get a team to go do anything - and i mean anything. I finished the game 5x already with different characters so i remembered the creatures and prepared accordingly to be as effective as possible.

For farming they "need" all classes exept mesmer also i had much problem with missions sometimes. I was like LFG for hours, tried to invite myself to groups searching for players with the nice reject click from the leader, so i really had no choice but to take henchies and do it on my own.

I really wish arena would do mesmers a valuable team member somehow, not like now when we have to have luck to get a team.

Yesterday i changed my secondary again to ranger and i wished to have a UW pet spider like on other chars. I went to ToA and spammed 2!! hours with no success. Then finaly a nice "piiing" sound and i was like...wow finaly... And then i read... for 30k you can join our group and we will help you!! FFS i have to pay 30k for ppl to have mercy on me and take me into a group!

Like i said..hope you come up with an idea how to slightly fix the situation.

Mesti Arcanus · Mar 01, 2006, 03:26 PM // 15:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyroth.grimstone

Yesterday i changed my secondary again to ranger and i wished to have a UW pet spider like on other chars. I went to ToA and spammed 2!! hours with no success. Then finaly a nice "piiing" sound and i was like...wow finaly... And then i read... for 30k you can join our group and we will help you!! FFS i have to pay 30k for ppl to have mercy on me and take me into a group!

Like i said..hope you come up with an idea how to slightly fix the situation.

Guilds. More specifically, make sure you're in an active guild that focuses on the same things you want to focus on. But then, you probably already know this one.

NinjaKai · Mar 01, 2006, 03:27 PM // 15:27

SnipiousMax: I'm still trying to make sense of your post.

lyroth.grimstone: 30k for someone to take pity on you. I'd tell them to shove their [Insert discusting derogatory statement here].

Oraculum · Mar 01, 2006, 04:32 PM // 16:32

Absolutely agree that they're undervalued. I suspect it's primarily because it takes a bit more intellect to run one effectively, and a lot of people like to 'see' the direct damage they're causing. The mes is possibly my favourite class. I have a Me/N, Mo/Me, R/Me, E/Me, and N/Me.. notice the pattern? lol. It is without a doubt the best 2ndary for my personal play style. I'm just glad I'm ina decent guild with people who are happy to team up with me for quests with my primary mes, since without them, I would be a bit stuffed. Consequently, it's nice to be playing one of the 'rare' professions, instead of being another W/Mo clone

I totally appreciate how hard it is to get into groups though

You could try changing districts... you're bound to come accross a more in-the-know group at some stage.

romeo_longsword · Mar 01, 2006, 06:02 PM // 18:02

To the OT, tell me about it, I love the Me.

I have recently started a Me (one week ago) and I am extreamly impressed.

I first noticed them during my early PvP games, and I find their influence in a game is massive.

I am married to the Ranger class (due to that I have always been playing a Ranger in DnD and other RPGs, deep history), but if I have to say which is a more powerful class, I would say the Me.

I am sure the above statment could draw some interests in debate, but from my point of view, I never find "balance" between the classes. Quite clear each classes are strong in certain places within the design of the game, and the ranger is only strong with support from others.

On the other hand, so far from my expereince, the Me can tank and solo many PvE missions and combat situations which my ranger and warrior could not. I can degen and set up spells where the target would hurt themsevels, through walls, aviod incomming attack. So to me, the combat power of Me is certainly very "raw", very powerful.

Also, I dont think the Me calss is "out of the box" and that different, as I feel the Me is like the Bard in DnD, which is one of the more traditional classes.

Go Me.

NinjaKai · Mar 01, 2006, 10:36 PM // 22:36

Oraculum: It is rather annoying how people don't understand how hard it is. I mean we don't just attack one enemy. A well seasoned mesmer moniters other enemies shutting them down so the rest of the party can focus on killing one enemy at a time. And yes the pattern is obvious. (I plan to make my mesmers secondary a ritualist when available.)

romeo_longsword: Balance is always down to a matter of opinion. As far as a balance i'm finding one that works for my personal style of combat.