Curse

ColaManiac · May 15, 2006, 01:03 PM // 13:03

i decided to post my own lil build and i'm sorry for my bad english

Mainly for PvP

R/A

attribudes
beast mastery 9 (8+1)
expertise 13 (9+1+2)
dagger mastery 12

weapon:
zealous pvp daggers of (your choice)
dmg+15%
energy-5

armor: explorer's- (+30hp if remember right) or sentry's (AL +10 while in stance) armor with superior vigor

Skills
1.any lead attack (i use leaping mantis sting)
2.any off-hand attack (wild strice)
3.horns of the ox
4.falling spider
5.any strong dual attack (blades of steel)
6.moebius strice
7.tiger's fury or bestial fury
8.res

your job
so your job is to deal much damage in small time.
you kill warriors, rangers, monks, mesmers, eles, ritualists, assassins and necros.
Start by activating TF/BF and use skills 1,2,3,4 and. After using skills 1,2,3,4 and 5 your target should have hp below 50% so when you use moebius all your attack skills are recharged and you can use skills 1,2,3,4 and 5 again. So it's 11 hit combo. But you have to kill your foes 1 by 1 because otherwise horns of the ox wont do KD. there is 2 ways to kill your foe. a) start attacking with your normal attacks (dealing 3-17dmg) so your foe thinks that you are weak, but after while you release your combo and then it's too late for him/her to run away. b) if there is a monk in enemy team you have to get your team mates to distract the monk so you can kill the weakest link of enemy team

problems
energy is not a problem, for 1 x 11 hit combo you use only about 10 energy, so you will do fine with just 20 energy and 2 energy reg

your bigest problem is your self-healing... 'cause you don't have it! so you have to hope that you have monk or kill your foe, move back and regen...

also blind, empathy, SS, any block/evade stance, guardian or any similar skill/spell will shut you down, but if you see someone using stance just change your target.

i thank you for reading my build thread and i excuse my bad english

...
[EDIT] you only need major expertise rune

Jenosavel · May 16, 2006, 12:15 PM // 12:15

Is there a reason you didn't mention Twisting Fangs (this seems to be an assassin build trend that I just don't understand)? I can't think of a better way to deal fast-finisher damage than a Deep Wound.

Wolydarg · May 16, 2006, 12:50 PM // 12:50

By doing the horns of the ox/spider combo, it gives you another dual hit in, which might be stronger than 20% hp from deepwound.

Jenosavel · May 16, 2006, 01:05 PM // 13:05

So with two skills you can get a conditional 68 damage and poison*, or with one skill you can get 36 damage, deepwound (against a player with 500 max hp this would equal 100 damage), bleeding, and still throw in another attack to try getting a more even comparison with the first set.

Nope, I just don't understand it. Especially since if you're going up against a warrior with Balanced Stance or a team with a warder (new ward that prevents knockdown) your combo is crippled in the first situation, but not hindered at all in the second.

*I assumed stats of 16 dagger mastery and 12 critical strikes

SnipiousMax · May 16, 2006, 01:10 PM // 13:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jenosavel

*I assumed stats of 16 dagger mastery and 12 critical strikes

Deep wound would be that much more important for an R/A that is limited to 12 mastery and 0 critical strikes.

Fenix Swiftblade · May 16, 2006, 03:17 PM // 15:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by SnipiousMax

Deep wound would be that much more important for an R/A that is limited to 12 mastery and 0 critical strikes.

Twisting Fangs is linked to critical strikes. It would still cause deep wound (for only 5 seconds, but that's as long as it needs.) but it would have a damage bonus on each of +1, instead of ~+25. If the attack used is Blades of Steel, that's +12 for each recharging attack, and it's counted twice because it's a dual attack, for a total of 96 damage. Because the Deep Wound will only last for seconds, and if all goes well he'll hit the second Blades of Steel, that's a lot more damage than Twisting Fangs.

However, that brings me to the more important point. "If all goes well." This build requires you to hit a full series of 11 attacks without missing a single one. That's ludicrous. One of your attacks will be blocked, evaded, or missed, and at that point, you need to start over from the beginning. I would say you'll actually get to use Moebious Strike 10-20% of the time if you're lucky, or if you're in random arenas. Basically, any skill that causes you not to hit with a reasonable percentage will leave you with about as much damage as a warrior with no attack skills.

Reikai · May 16, 2006, 03:22 PM // 15:22

actually, with a R/A your attempting for a kill even more.

with 0 crit strikes deep wound from Twisting fangs lasts 5 seconds.
thats plenty of time. Infact, if you need anything more than 5 seconds to kill after you apply deep wound, I'm sorry, but your not gonna kill him. period.

SnipiousMax · May 16, 2006, 04:35 PM // 16:35

Deep wound is a great finisher if you can read the 'sweet spot'. It requires a little guess work and estimation, but once you get someone to within 20% of max health, you can easily finish them with deepwound. I've been playing around with repeating strike, and that would work wonders to get them to within the last 1/5 of their health.

Also....Any reason you call it the glass cannon?

ColaManiac · May 16, 2006, 04:53 PM // 16:53

if 1 of your attacks is being blocked, evaded or missed you can still make small combos, like these

1) lead, off-hand, horns of the ox, moebius, blades of steel, (and if moebius striced a foe with under 50% of his/her health) lead, off-hand, horns of the ox and falling spider

2)lead, off-hand, blades of steel, moebius, (and if moebius striced a foe with under 50% of his/her health) lead, off-hand, horns of the ox, falling spider and blades of steel

so you can still do some minor damage with your skills even if 1 of them gets blocked, evaded or misses (unless the Evd, Blckd, msed skill is lead or off-hand, but dosn't every assassin have same problem?).

why i didn't take twisting fangs?
because it's not worth it. It gives you +10 dmg to your duall attack hits (20) and adds deep wound and bleeding for 5 secs, but when you do it second time it only adds +10 dmg to your hits (20) and renews DW and bleeding.
so you will deal +40 dmg and give DW and bleeding for 10 secs.

So why i took blades of steel?
4 rechargin attacks = 4 x 12 = 48, and because it's dual it will hit for +96 dmg
and it will do the same thing when you use it 2nd time, so it's +192 dmg.
unless you need something what recharges faster than blades of steel or your enemy has 800hp, then twisting fangs is beter than blades of steel.

EDIT: reason why i call it glass cannon is that you can deal lots of damage but you die easily...

EDIT2: you can always change res sig for twisting fang and use it after moebius... but i think it's not smart move...

Amorphous · May 16, 2006, 08:40 PM // 20:40

Heh, I've never rezed anyone in PvP before. That's why I leave the rezzing to the monks.

Iskrah · May 16, 2006, 09:01 PM // 21:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amorphous

Heh, I've never rezed anyone in PvP before. That's why I leave the rezzing to the monks.

That's why you've never won either.

Or you meant PvE.

Fenix Swiftblade · May 17, 2006, 12:25 AM // 00:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by ColaManiac

if 1 of your attacks is being blocked, evaded or missed you can still make small combos, like these

1) lead, off-hand, horns of the ox, moebius, blades of steel, (and if moebius striced a foe with under 50% of his/her health) lead, off-hand, horns of the ox and falling spider

2)lead, off-hand, blades of steel, moebius, (and if moebius striced a foe with under 50% of his/her health) lead, off-hand, horns of the ox, falling spider and blades of steel

so you can still do some minor damage with your skills even if 1 of them gets blocked, evaded or misses (unless the Evd, Blckd, msed skill is lead or off-hand, but dosn't every assassin have same problem?).

But you have so many attack skills that if any of the early ones get blocked, you're wasting 2-3 skills slots, including your elite. I don't think you'd ever get to use Moebious Strike in a fight where the opponet was good enough for it to actually matter.

I'm not saying if one of your attacks is blocked you'll have a few skills you can't use for a while, I'm saying that with so many attacks, one of them WILL be blocked, and your last few attacks will be wasted skill slots. You're better off just bringing one of those combos you said you could use. Maybe take out the Horns/Spider combo for some support skills, or take out Moebious and go with an off hand you can lead with, Horns/Spider and then a powerful dual attack to finish it off with.

Lourens · May 18, 2006, 04:42 PM // 16:42

I WANT TO SAY: Blades of steel +..dmg (max50)
OMFG....

Francis Demeules · May 18, 2006, 07:26 PM // 19:26

The template Fangs of Melandru use Twisting Fangs at the end and you can finish any one with this combo very fast. You tried a big combo and I see a problems in your bar skills (no more support). FoM use Bleeding+Poison for degen support and finish with Deep wound and remove 1/5 of HP for 5 sec + the dmg you did (+30 to +40) in this dual attack. Blade of Steel, in other way, do over 100 dmg (max +50 each attack) but its reduced by the armor, not the deep wound because its a condition.

(This is an exemple)
You can have a Lead, offhand and Repeating Strike for an infinite combo until you lost all your energy and use only 3 skills for attacks and do average mediums dmg and finish with Deep Wound for a 4th attacks skills. Used the half of your bar for attacks and the other half for support and use an elite.

Generally, I use max 5 attacks, 2 for supports and 1 for rez sig or 4 attacks, 3 supports and 1 rez. The speed is a secondary choice for me. I better using some "defense against melee char and ranger" with stances and/or Throw Dirt than "kill them faster than I can".

If you have problems to defend yourself against others, I said your answer. You have a lack of defense line skills.

Maria The Princess · May 19, 2006, 03:39 AM // 03:39

yeah just wait to get blinded... and get killed.

as i understand you are using ranger primary for expertise.

if you want to do the BIG damage u better of goin assassin primary, you will do more damage with critical strikes. or why dont you use the same build on a warior primary? you will last longuer. and where exactly do you feet shadow step? if you are playing a "melee squishie" its a must. if no, do same with a warrior.

except "frenzy" what other speeding stance we got there?

SnipiousMax · May 19, 2006, 05:42 AM // 05:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maria The Princess

<Snip>

The point of a R/A is that you'll be able to chain longer combos, and do those combos more often than an Assassin Primary. You sacrifice burst damage for more sustained damage. A W/A using dagger skills is not the way to go either. First of all, I'm not sure a warrior even has enough energy to complete this combo once, and Second, a warrior will deal more damage using his more conventional weaponry.

Maria The Princess · May 19, 2006, 06:10 AM // 06:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by SnipiousMax

The point of a R/A is that you'll be able to chain longer combos, and do those combos more often than an Assassin Primary. You sacrifice burst damage for more sustained damage. A W/A using dagger skills is not the way to go either. First of all, I'm not sure a warrior even has enough energy to complete this combo once, and Second, a warrior will deal more damage using his more conventional weaponry.

i said i understand how u use ranger for energy. but for this kind of deal then a R/N touch build is better cuz its armor ignoring

now about substained damage... i didnt see any stances and self defence there.... how exactly u planning to stand around the target and deal constant BIG damage without getting spiked by opposite team? and why burst damge is better then substained? gives less time to the monk to react and throw a boom heal+bond on target

a warior has 20e....+2 regen. maby with assassin zealots daggers? when i was trying out assassin i noticed zealots mode on daggers give about 2-3 e per hit, and not 1 like most zealots weapond per single attak(assassin hits with bothhands at once very fast, so 1 hit=1 e, but it throws 2-3 hits at once).

why im not a big fan of long assassin combos? good mesmers who know who to interrupt first. if your lead is interrupted or you are blacked out, all you can do is run away and wait till its recharged. now we all know that in TA you cant realy run around for long time... its just a waist.

-off topic, i kinda like the idea of me/A, shadows teping, blackout, teleport back to safety

Francis Demeules · May 19, 2006, 12:42 PM // 12:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maria The Princess

a warior has 20e....+2 regen. maby with assassin zealots daggers? when i was trying out assassin i noticed zealots mode on daggers give about 2-3 e per hit, and not 1 like most zealots weapond per single attak(assassin hits with bothhands at once very fast, so 1 hit=1 e, but it throws 2-3 hits at once)

Flourish and Bonetti Defense, enought said.

SnipiousMax · May 19, 2006, 01:43 PM // 13:43

^^ Ranger Touch will never deal enough damage to be considered a serious threat despite ignoring armor, where as an Assassin combo cannot be ignored.

As for sustained damage...

Because Ranger's have the ability to make the most of their energy they can use longer combos more often. Which means the monk is having to spend more energy to keep up with me. The more damage I deal over time, the harder the strain on the monks energy bar. Spikes are what kill people...but a good infuser can make up for a spike. R/W's generally are used to pressure rather than spike... Now that said, a R/A does not lose the ability to spike, which makes it a very versitle character.

I'm not defending the OP build's lack of stances/support/etc, but a R/A is a very viable character, and works really well.

^^ Another thing. A good mesmer know's how to interrupt the lead attack, but then a good player knows how to get by when your lead attack is interrupted. There are many skills that cannot be blocked or evaded, and skills that let you run an entire combo without getting interrupted. So it's not hard to pull off a combo. Yea there are counters. There are counters to casting spells, but people still do that.

I'm just saying, you shouldn't discount his use of a R/A... Just his skill choice.

ColaManiac · May 19, 2006, 02:16 PM // 14:16

i know that i don't have any self healing, def stances and i will be in great danger if someone is able to block my first lead or offhand attack...

i use this mostly at random arenas where people usualy target casters first or don't have so many defencive stances ect., so that gives me advance not be killed first (often). i usualy stay near ally caster if opposing team has assassin or warrior and when they come i can almost always kill them. if there isn't, i usualy let others go first so they will be targeted and i go after 3-10 secs and choose the weakest or most dangerous foe. boon prots go down almost as easily as everyone else, exept you just have to time horns of the ox righ so you can interrupt his/her guardian. And because wild strice is same as wild blow (remove stance and recharge only4) i get sometimes lucky and i'm able to remove def stance from foe.

i have not tried team arenas but team like this might work
1 Glass cannon
2 Monks
1 N/Me or Me/N with rigor mortis (rigor mortis: for 18 second your target cannot block or evade attacks)

But has anyone used my build yet?