Curse

reboot · Mar 04, 2006, 10:55 PM // 22:55

Te started running EnS pressure build near the end of last season, and PrP used EP build to beat them...

stop whining

Yanman.be · Mar 04, 2006, 11:02 PM // 23:02

let me give an original build EaSy once used:

a warrior, 6 necro's with max soul reaping, a spirit spammer

the spammer spams spirits, they die, necro's get soul reaping energy, spam all the fancy spells they can, heal and ele etc., and they just "outlive" their opponent...

i think they stopped using it after observer mode got out...they don't want many people to know it

also easy once used an invinci monk...ladder was frozen back then though ;o

Linkusmax · Mar 08, 2006, 04:21 PM // 16:21

God what a silly statement, the use of others ideas is not a bad thing, mindlessly copying builds yes. Watching a build and determining how it works is a good thing.

Personally I have taken Rifts Pet preassure build, improved and fiddled with it but used the general concept to produce my own version and ran it effectively in a 500 rank guild. In fact I messed with it more and created a tombs version which has a few totally new style chars as far as I am aware. Is what I am doing wrong? I don't think so but from you apparently think yes it is.

Bleidd · Mar 09, 2006, 12:09 AM // 00:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dahl

I just want to point out.. people have to stop worrying so much about finding a godly build or anything of the sort.

Finding a great build on google will not win you GvGs, and will not let you hold hoh for long, if at all.

People go on observer, and watch top guilds and hoh holders, and try to mimick their builds.

If they have held hoh for a long time, or if they are one of the top guilds, they did not get that far by using other peoples builds. They made their own, and practiced. People think "hey, if they're rank --, maybe I can get there too if I use their build" No, it does not work that way.

Any guild that is worth.. well, anything, came up with their OWN builds and strategies and spent countless hours practicing it.

Gale warriors are the most common of these copycat players, along with boon-prot, energy denial mesmers, and blinding flash eles are on the rise ever since the top guilds began using it.

I come up with all kinds of builds, i brainstorm and look for things that people do not use. It's amazing how many great skill combos that are unused and are unexpected. I can't tell you how many times I've caught an enemy team off guard with my own build, and they had no idea how to counter it.

Stay fresh people, use your own brain.

I'd also like to point out that any fame/rank that any IWAY team (besides the pioneers of the build which date back to the spring and summer of 2005) received in hoh is completely false and was gained with no skill, only an overpowered build.

What are you going to do when IWAY gets... "changed"? You're gonna be sitting there with your thumb up your ass wondering what to do since the only build you can play has been taken away from you.

Stand on your own two feet people. The secret to this game is to be unique and different.

It can be argued in GvG it has more to do with the team build than the individual build. Otherwise I agree with you.

tymeless · Mar 09, 2006, 12:33 AM // 00:33

Observer mode is there to take it, learn it, improve it/counter it and run it better than the original team.

This in turn makes PvP a much more challenging place and improves game lifespan and enjoyment.
If somone can run ur own build better than u, then they deserve to win.

If people didnt copy things then there would be no chance to improve things beyond the creator's knowledge and the world as we kno it would still be stuck making fire with flint and killing animals with stones. And i sure dont want guild wars to be stuck in a primitive state of PvP.

The secret to PvP is to kno ur enemy, steal his tatics, make them better, and use it against him.

yesitsrob · Mar 09, 2006, 08:24 AM // 08:24

For new guilds learning to pvp - I think they should be looking to learn by playing what is already proven - coming up with an effective build is not easy, you need the experience to know what's going to be good and what isn't.

I sure as hell didn't make boon protting up but I still use it, and the whole boon protting thing is where my PVP really started... and now I'm at a level with it where I can tweak the build and try things out... but I needed to start with what was there originally.. and I think everyone should who wants to learn

Hell Marauder · Mar 13, 2006, 07:59 PM // 19:59

Why do we even go to schools? To learn what other people have created or discovered, of course. Human civilization is built on copying each other's inventions, good or bad. So there's nothing wrong copying others' builds, because it's what we humans do best.

LightningHell · Mar 16, 2006, 09:16 AM // 09:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hell Marauder

Why do we even go to schools? To learn what other people have created or discovered, of course. Human civilization is built on copying each other's inventions, good or bad. So there's nothing wrong copying others' builds, because it's what we humans do best.

Adding a bit. We copy other people's stuff, then think about it and refine it and improve it. That's what humans do best.

holden · Mar 16, 2006, 05:30 PM // 17:30

i steal all you guys' builds. if they're good

Hormus · Mar 17, 2006, 06:16 PM // 18:16

My statement is that knowledge must be shared

I gain more by someone tellin me thank u , rather tellin me how and wow

LightningHell · Mar 18, 2006, 03:28 AM // 03:28

I didn't really get the last post. Can you elaborate?

Minus Sign · Mar 19, 2006, 12:34 PM // 12:34

I have to both agree and disagree with the OP. While creativity is important, nothing can exist in a vacuum. It’s never a good thing to just grab a build cookie-cuter style and try to emulate what you saw someone else do.

You’ll never be as good as they are; only a copy.

But the best sports teams/coaches/competitive anything spend hours each week watching the competition, learning their moves, trying them themselves. If something works, it’s not uncommon for teams, pro and armature, to use the same plays. Wouldn’t it follow for Guilds to use strategies that are proven effective in certain/most situations?

Think American Football. Who hasn’t heard of a blitz? It’s an offensive attack by the defense on the quarterback on the other team.

Just because the one team used a blitz when they were on the defense side, does it then become “uncreative” of the opposition to use the same play when they are on D?

But those teams also practice for hours each day, plan and strategize their own plays. So too must GW players branch out…once they’ve learned the fundamentals. Think of Googled builds as training; you’re learning how to play in a different form, using skills that you might not choose yourself. Then, once you start to grasp the subtleties of how PvP works, leave the nest. Try variations of other skills; hit RA with the dumbest combos you can think of. Get messy; make mistakes.

But never ignore the opposition. “Know your enemy” is the first rule of combat, just...not the only one.

scamPOR · Mar 29, 2006, 04:54 AM // 04:54

It's silly to say anyone is really copying almost any build at all. More importantly who cares. It's a competative game, if you can run build x better then the person/guild that made it too bad >.<

VGJustice · Mar 29, 2006, 10:23 AM // 10:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hormus

My statement is that knowledge must be shared

I gain more by someone tellin me thank u , rather tellin me how and wow

My, but isn't this a cryptic post? But, I *think* I know what you're talking about, and if I'm right, we hold the same ideal. Allow me to elaborate.

Let's take two players that have just started the game together. Both are of the same class, but with different secondaries. As they play through the game, they learn to use different skills and maybe even the same skills in different ways. After they've learned a bit on their own, they come together and compare notes. Both learn new ways to use what they already know, or learn about things that they didn't think about. They go off again to try new things based on what they learned from the other guy.

Yeah, it's a bit sappy and idealistic, and probably a bit far fetched and unrealistic. I like the idea of it, though, and I think that it does happen on a certain level. Like, Necromancers addapting the 55 Monk build, for instance.

Chaubii · May 05, 2006, 04:31 AM // 04:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dahl

I just want to point out.. people have to stop worrying so much about finding a godly build or anything of the sort.

Finding a great build on google will not win you GvGs, and will not let you hold hoh for long, if at all.

People go on observer, and watch top guilds and hoh holders, and try to mimick their builds.

If they have held hoh for a long time, or if they are one of the top guilds, they did not get that far by using other peoples builds. They made their own, and practiced. People think "hey, if they're rank --, maybe I can get there too if I use their build" No, it does not work that way.

Any guild that is worth.. well, anything, came up with their OWN builds and strategies and spent countless hours practicing it.

Gale warriors are the most common of these copycat players, along with boon-prot, energy denial mesmers, and blinding flash eles are on the rise ever since the top guilds began using it.

I come up with all kinds of builds, i brainstorm and look for things that people do not use. It's amazing how many great skill combos that are unused and are unexpected. I can't tell you how many times I've caught an enemy team off guard with my own build, and they had no idea how to counter it.

Stay fresh people, use your own brain.

I'd also like to point out that any fame/rank that any IWAY team (besides the pioneers of the build which date back to the spring and summer of 2005) received in hoh is completely false and was gained with no skill, only an overpowered build.

What are you going to do when IWAY gets... "changed"? You're gonna be sitting there with your thumb up your ass wondering what to do since the only build you can play has been taken away from you.

Stand on your own two feet people. The secret to this game is to be unique and different.

1. It shouldn't matter if people 'steal' builds or not, in the end expereince will determine who wins.

2. Not everyone has time to spend countless hours brainstorming and perfecting their unique build. There's a thing called Life and most people do have one.

3. Even if people 'steal' builds from high ranking guilds, those guilds will in turn make a build to counter the one that was 'stolen'.

4. It's a game most people aren't trying to become the worlds best guildwars player, they're just playing for fun. I think you're a little uptight about it. It's a bit sad when people take the game too seriously.

With that IWAY comment, most other builds won't accept people who aren't like R3++ or higher. Unless you HoH with your guild. And the only way to gain rank/fame is to play HoH. In some cases people are forced to play IWAY cause no other groups will accept them since they're not 'good' enough cause they don't have the proper rank.

Arknow · May 07, 2006, 07:24 AM // 07:24

Quote:

It's a bit sad when people take the game too seriously

QFT

sorry 100% of online gamers can't sit in mom's basement with time to spare twinking builds

Corinthian · May 07, 2006, 07:34 AM // 07:34

Why waste countless hours honing sub-par tactics? How do you know you can't play a build effectively, or it just does not work at all?

Inspirational Muse · May 07, 2006, 04:35 PM // 16:35

I have to agree with the original point this post makes.

I value originality above all else. I constantly try to develope new an interesting builds that work for me. I can't live with myself knowing that I went onto a website to get a build, or observed a battle to do the same. I am aware that there are builds out there that I'm sure are just like mine, but at least I discovered them on my own.

Ares982 · May 07, 2006, 07:36 PM // 19:36

It would be nice to be original, but the problem is that noone wants you if you are original. I play Ele in PvP; I tried many times new builds and new combos, but in order to join any group you have to be Warder or Obsidian Flame spiker, stop. Noone wants an "original" or experimental character in his group, since everyone thinks that most used builds are the best ones.

defrule · May 08, 2006, 12:23 AM // 00:23

It's really something that cannot be avoided. People play to win in this game so going for builds that are successful is only natural. There really are some skills I wouldn't dream of using.