Curse

Undead Preacher · May 13, 2006, 10:26 PM // 22:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scourage of Death

Ty man...Only thing i change is the veratas(dont find it usefull anymore)...BTW where do you get the new bloodstained boots and is there a place to change your armor to factions yet(I wanna change my 15k rly bad lol)?

every armor crafter I have found offers Blood stained boots... in cantha that is...

Dark Tykane · May 14, 2006, 09:54 PM // 21:54

Today I found that going without fiends at all makes it easier to do with hench. With golem, vamps, and horrors I have a perfect wall of minions and I can sacrifice health as much as I want without going below 300 health. The vamps get all of your health back almost instantly depending on your vamp to horror ratio so you can keep a wall of minions much longer than if you do it with fiends because my fiends always block my golem and vamps

Undead Preacher · May 16, 2006, 05:39 AM // 05:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Tykane

Today I found that going without fiends at all makes it easier to do with hench. With golem, vamps, and horrors I have a perfect wall of minions and I can sacrifice health as much as I want without going below 300 health. The vamps get all of your health back almost instantly depending on your vamp to horror ratio so you can keep a wall of minions much longer than if you do it with fiends because my fiends always block my golem and vamps

Yea I believe after the Golem and Vamprics whether you use fiends or horrors is really the choice of the MM... I like to mix it up with a little ranged combat with the fiends but the 10 less energy for the horrors is a plus.. and definetly a nice meat shield...

Hemophiliac · May 17, 2006, 02:41 PM // 14:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undead Preacher

This is what I'm currently using from a weapons crafter in an explorable area... I would prefer 20-40% recharge but this works for now...

good build for henching it, I use almost the same one with my henchies. I drop VS and I bring one of the heal areas with BotM for henchie groups. But I use a different approach for PUG's as you already posted in.

I'd suggest dishing out for a bortaks bone cesta; [Death Magic +1 (20% chance while using skills) Halves casting time of Death Magic spells (Chance: 20%)] and the end game green wayward wand; [Halves skill recharge (Chance: 20%) and Energy +5 (while Health is above 50%)]. For a 20% recharge and 20% casting time, just wish that Bortaks was recharge instead of casting time, as two 20% recharge times would be better, the boots do enough for casting time typically.

Undead Preacher · May 17, 2006, 03:09 PM // 15:09

There is the following wands and offhands that work alrgiht besides bortaks!
BOLD = what I use now

Bone Spiral
Halves skill Recharge of death magic skills(chance 20%)
Energy +5(while health above 50%)

Bone Spiral
Halves Casting time of death magic skills(chance 20%)
Energy +5(while health above 50%)

Bone Spiral
Halves skill Recharge of death magic skills(chance 20%)
Halves Casting time of death magic skills(chance 20%)

Bleached Skull
Energy +12
Death magic +1(chance 20%)
Health +30

Bleached Skull
Energy +12
Halves Casting time of death magic skills(chance 20%)
Halves skill recharge of death magic skills(chance 20%)

Hemophiliac · May 17, 2006, 03:58 PM // 15:58

Care to share where are you finding the top 2 bone spirals at? I am finding them with +5 energy <50%..... at the Kurzik Saint Anjeka's Shrine. But have had no luck tracking any +5 > 50% ones. I thought that it was +5>50% there but maybe they changed it or it changes with which side controls the elite missions.......

Raziel665 · May 18, 2006, 06:52 AM // 06:52

There's a crafter outside of Kaineng City who has it, he's at some large square south east of the City, you won't encounter any enemies on the way there.

Hemophiliac · May 18, 2006, 01:35 PM // 13:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raziel665

There's a crafter outside of Kaineng City who has it, he's at some large square south east of the City, you won't encounter any enemies on the way there.

opps forgot to update my post, I found that one with the faster casting, but I am really looking for the faster skill recharge, which that crafter does not have.....

Manic Smile · May 18, 2006, 02:05 PM // 14:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carinae Dragonblood

The recycle time is too long, the energy cost is too high, the dps is too low, and the health comes to me not the minion.

VHorrors = not very good.

fully agreed, Vamp Minnion is more a gimmic then a useful tool

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carinae Dragonblood

I don't know how to break this to you, but pre-nerf MM's could indeed have 80 or more minions up at one moment. Corpses can be generated far more quickly in PvE than in PvP. Much much faster.

Pre-nerf, minions lived for 6 minutes without trying very hard. Assuming a constant supply of corpses and no energy issues then you can raise 120 horrors/fiends during that time and that's without Bloodstained Boots. With BSB, it's 160 during the same time period. (That's 320 Bone Minions!)

Now, realistically, losses from degen and combat plus energy issues on the MM prevented one from hitting the ceiling. But 80-100 horrors/fiends was definately attainable.

EDIT: I forgot to include the aftercast delay. So, here's the corrected numbers:

Without BSB: 96 fiends/horrors
With BSB: 120 fiends/horrors

Just want to add one more thing...fast casting sometimes insta casts with a 20 fastcast death 10 fastcast all combo (don't know about having 20 and 20 death fastcast) I'd insta cast 1 in 10 times maybe...don't know if that would effect the amount at all

To the disbelievers I used to play around in the Isle of the Nameless...80 was not a problem at all. In jungle missions as well 80 was quite easy or even Surrow's Furnace down where the temple meets the jungle. To be honest I probably floated around 40 minnions more often but that's just because 40 might as well be 80 for all the difference there is at that point...and 40 is so much less effort.

Manic Smile · May 18, 2006, 02:08 PM // 14:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hemophiliac

Care to share where are you finding the top 2 bone spirals at? I am finding them with +5 energy <50%..... at the Kurzik Saint Anjeka's Shrine. But have had no luck tracking any +5 > 50% ones. I thought that it was +5>50% there but maybe they changed it or it changes with which side controls the elite missions.......

Do the togo mission that you first get as a forign character...the weapon crafter is over there on the opposite side of togo.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rion

Frankly people are weak of mind and cringe at the mere thought of change. A lot of people have run with an old reliable build for MM for a long time and to change that is inconcievable.

As KCP said, let them hate. They're wasting their breath.

All the more corpses for me.

no...there is change...and then there is what A.net did to VS...

VS is UTTERLY BROKEN, who would use it now?

Quote:

Originally Posted by MelechRic

EDIT: Forgot that there's a level 28 Elementalist boss in Jade sea... that guy will rock your MM, but I think he could rock most things besides an interrupt ranger.

spam BotM -> BotM -> HA -> BotM...

It'll keep you army alive long enough to kill it...assuming you have 9 fiends and a golem.

blood raven · May 18, 2006, 02:14 PM // 14:14

can you say exactly where that is?
i don't really remmember where togo was standing when my char first came to kaineng ^^

Manic Smile · May 18, 2006, 02:21 PM // 14:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by blood raven

can you say exactly where that is?
i don't really remmember where togo was standing when my char first came to kaineng ^^

Go out of the first town...not the Market place the place that has the palace. Walk up and kinda to the left...there is a pathway lined with guards and no monsters. You will come to a borken bridge...walk around it to the right then take a left to cross over to where the bridge would have taken you. To the right, just after crossing is where Togo was standing...look to the left of there for a [Weapons] NPC.

Hemophiliac · May 18, 2006, 04:39 PM // 16:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manic Smile

Do the togo mission that you first get as a forign character...the weapon crafter is over there on the opposite side of togo.

That is the one I have been stating has the casting time wand, I just checked again with a new character even.
The only weapon crafter there is Sheco and they craft
Bone Spiral
Halves Casting time of death magic skills(chance 20%)
Energy +5(while health above 50%)

Still looking for where this one is found
Bone Spiral
Halves skill Recharge of death magic skills(chance 20%)
Energy +5(while health above 50%)
that Undead stated you could find, as I would rather have this than use an amulet of the mists on the wayward wand which is the same thing.

Manic Smile · May 18, 2006, 09:59 PM // 21:59

I think the wayward is fast cast as well but I can't remember...sorry never noticed a 20% recharge

blood raven · May 19, 2006, 11:12 AM // 11:12

wayward is recharge...
looking for this one too:
Bone Spiral
Halves skill Recharge of death magic skills(chance 20%)
Energy +5(while health above 50%)

Hemophiliac · May 19, 2006, 02:16 PM // 14:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by blood raven

wayward is recharge...
looking for this one too:
Bone Spiral
Halves skill Recharge of death magic skills(chance 20%)
Energy +5(while health above 50%)

Havn't found one in searching most of Cantha (don't have parts of the Jade Sea yet as I am not Luxon), pretty sure will have to go with a wayward wand as nothing I can find proves a bone spiral like that exists. Guildwiki dosn't even have that anywhere and they are dead on, on what I have found. Giving up the search for it and will just get a wayward wand.

Eragon Dragonslayer · May 22, 2006, 06:08 AM // 06:08

Undead and KCP...i just gotta say u guys make and explain the best necro builds possible u rock dudes! thanx for making me love the necro again =D

buffazzazn · May 24, 2006, 05:45 PM // 17:45

Hey do u guys know if heal area would increase minion health degen?

xenoranger · May 24, 2006, 06:28 PM // 18:28

Responding to the original post....

MM was and wasn't nerfed. After playing for a while, I call it an "adjustment".

MINION NUMBER ADJUSTMENT

Now.. a single MM could easily have 63 minions (usage of horrors and fiends) pre-adjustement. They could also be maintained for quite a while. (some say 6 min, I had them running a bit longer in some cases) Cutting the number of minions you can manage at once was a nerf. Otherwise you could use the Offering of Blood + Vampiric horrors + verata's sacrifice to be an invinci-necro. Just think about an alliance battle. You have an MM killing and making new minions with every kill.All you need is arcane echo, and you can make new VHorrors pretty quick. Plus, keeping them alive woudln't have been too hard. So, a warrior attacks you and does 28 damage (I think that's max). You have 2 Vhorrors doing 18 damage. That's 36 energy regained. The warrior would have to seriously be using skills and degen to keep you down b/c the average MM (pre adjustment) would carry 16+ minions. If you casted mainly VHorrors, you'd own without ever going down. Just, Offering of Blood, and you get teh boost to recast.

Limiting to 10 minions means that your VHorrors can take a max of 180 HP every 2-3 seconds (I forget what their attack frequency is offhand). You're harder to kill, but the minions aren't a zerg, so you can be killed.
BLOOD OF THE MASTER

This adjustment has a wee bit of controversy in my book. It does 2 things. First, it's nice because you can heal all minions that are friendly. Great work because you just need 1 necro healing for multiple MM's in the party. The downside here is that you have a flucuating sacfrice (5% base + 2% per minion). This means that more minions equates to a higher sacirfice required. At base, you get a 7% sacrifice (assuming 1 minion). if you have 4 necromancers in the party, you're sacrificing 85% of your life. Add a 5th, and you die. Aura of Lich may help on the sacrifice, but you're still doing quite a bit of sacrificing. The upside is that Blood of hte Master has a radar range for healing and it heals for 122 hp (death 16). It used to be an "in the area" spell like heal area. The adjustment is an adjustment.
VERATA'S SACRIFICE

NERF! Nuff said here.

This skill used to allow MM's to have all minions
on a regen of +10 for 20 seconds. It's been reduced to 10 seconds (max time) and has a recharge of 60 seconds. The only way to effectively use Verata's Sacrifice is to keep 3 or fewer minions under your control. Then it recharges instantly. Now, the only benefit to VSac is the ability to pull conditions from your minions.

BTW: ANet did screw with the history of verata by nerfing this skill. It's funny because this nerf is like saying verata was a wannabe when there's a quest that claims that he can keep minions alive for far greater periods of time than ordinary necros. Someone else pointed that out on another thread, so I can't take credit for that observation.
ANIMATE BONE MINIONS

Buff... seriously

2 minions at ½ the level of a horror for the same price isn't shabby. Sure, you have a max you can command, but this makes playing bomberman/girl much more energy effective.
ANIMATE FLESH GOLEM

Honestly, this is neither a nerf nor a buff to MMing. The golems are great tanks, but because you can only have 1, it's not spammable like other minions. In addition to this, you can use golems like a pet. Just summon 1 golem, and you essentially have an extra (lvl 26) party member. The resusable corspe can even be used in conjunction with well of suffering to make your golem a portable tank/corpse for later exploitation. Remember, minion masters aren' the only use for minion skills.
ANIMATE VAMPIRIC HORRORS

Buff

Definitely nice to have Vampiric Horrors (Vhorrors) as an option. The life stealing works well for HP management, since you have to sacrifice to keep minions alive. Very few builds actually just use Vhorrors as life regen, but I've come up with a couple that have you casting 1-2 Vhorrors just as an extra damage dealer.
CORPSE AVAILABILITY

BUFF... Majorly

In Tyria, I found corpses were quite scarce in a lot of areas. Cantha is chalked full of corpses to exploit. As such, Factions offers a very strong case for taking an MM in your party. There are very few locations I wouldn't take an MM in cantha.

Other...?

I'm sure there are other arguements regarding the MM builds. Truth is that minions have been ADJUSTED. People need to stop saying [i]nerf[/b] (or buff to a lesser extent) and start calling it what it really is. I was pissed at first, but now that I've learned more about what ANet has done, I understand the new MM Builds and can say that it's more fun now than before. Although competitions for most minions is gone, playing MM requires more skill and people need to keep their wits about them if they're going to play MM.

ANet basically wielded out teh wannabes and left room for the students of verata.

Raziel665 · May 24, 2006, 07:30 PM // 19:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by buffazzazn

Hey do u guys know if heal area would increase minion health degen?

Healing them wont make them die faster.