Curse

crosshatch123 · Feb 08, 2007, 06:59 PM // 18:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Griff Mon

Max out your death magic and get a Superior Death Magic Rune for your head piece. A level 26 Flesh Golem is something to be feared in any fight. BOTM is good and if you are running a monk secondary, I keep healing breeze up to compensate for the spamming of BOTM. For solo farming I bring along some good Death degen and attack like Rotting Flesh and Deathly Swarm. With your Death Magic maxed out they are very powerful. I usually do not bring Verata's as it is not as powerful as it used to be. If you have a lot of bodies you can exploit then use Heal Area -on the downside it increases the degen of your minions and heals enemies in the immediate area, and on the upside it heals you as well. Use it only in an emergency.

what u mean with that? So if u heal your minions. They have -1 degen?

Pick Me · Feb 08, 2007, 07:07 PM // 19:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by crosshatch123

what u mean with that? So if u heal your minions. They have -1 degen?

What he means is the longer a minion exists the more health degen it incurs. The magic that animates it starts to weaken, so the minion starts to lose health faster as time moves on.

Eventually it will reach -10 health degen even if you have healing breeze, mending, watchful spirit and recouperation. The longer the minion lasts, the more it will start to degenerate.

crosshatch123 · Feb 08, 2007, 07:40 PM // 19:40

O, ok. Thnx, Just wondered, Cause I was thinking of creating my own MM tomorrow (now stuck on my dads slow computer). Just recently started PvE , I'm playing 4 PvE Characters at the same time ^^

Pick Me · Feb 08, 2007, 08:03 PM // 20:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by crosshatch123

O, ok. Thnx, Just wondered, Cause I was thinking of creating my own MM tomorrow (now stuck on my dads slow computer). Just recently started PvE , I'm playing 4 PvE Characters at the same time ^^

Nice. Not to brag or anything, but I have 9 on the go. ><

Creating a Necromancer should not be for a MM. MMing should start around lvl 17 or higher. Not enough attribute points to make a good MM, and your skills are almost non-existant.

Test your necro with blood, then curses, then by 17th or so lvl, then try death magic.

Good luck and have fun.

jesh · Feb 09, 2007, 12:42 AM // 00:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Griff Mon

A level 26 Flesh Golem is something to be feared in any fight. BOTM is good and if you are running a monk secondary, I keep healing breeze up to compensate for the spamming of BOTM. For solo farming I bring along some good Death degen and attack like Rotting Flesh and Deathly Swarm. With your Death Magic maxed out they are very powerful. I usually do not bring Verata's as it is not as powerful as it used to be. If you have a lot of bodies you can exploit then use Heal Area -on the downside it increases the degen of your minions and heals enemies in the immediate area, and on the upside it heals you as well. Use it only in an emergency.

Flesh Golems are to be feared? They attack once every 3 seconds and lag 10 seconds behind your group. A bone fiend does more damage. They're worthless except as a reusable corpse.
Healing Breeze is a waste of a slot, and so is Heal Area. BoTM is all you need, and Taste of Pain/Signet of Lost souls is enough healing with Dark Bond on.

Heal Area is a good spell, but worthless on a MM who can't keep track of where monsters are located, and can't kite because they can't stop pressing that animate button.

Now. Order of Undeath is a very potent skill, and luckily since you have Nightfall, you're heading towards it. With the changes to Jagged Bones, I feel it's one of the only viable options for a minion master. Another option is Icy Veins.

Dutch Masterr · Feb 09, 2007, 05:15 PM // 17:15

i see the flesh golem hit for 120+ damage on low and high armor targets alike..

crosshatch123 · Feb 09, 2007, 08:36 PM // 20:36

I was wondering about the elite I should take too, if its true what Dutch master says (120 dmg), then a Fleshie ([skill]Animate Flesh Golem[/skill]) is a good elite right? and less Energy than a Bonefiend. But on the other hand, fiends can attack at range. So both are good to have in your build.
I dont think [skill]Order of Undeath[/skill] is a good choise, it costs 10 energy for 5 seconds, and its a 10% sac (and an additional 2% for each minion). While you allready have BotM as a sac in your build.

btw, I was allready thinking myself if I should take Healing circle. But that forces you to put points in heal. So is it better to make death 16 and soul reaping 12/13 and place signet of lost souls instead of healing circle?

Cross

Cathode_Reborn · Feb 10, 2007, 12:54 AM // 00:54

If you ask for advice on MM'ing, I guarantee you everyone will be tellin you pretty much the same thing. "Go N/Mo, use Flesh Golem and Heal Area."

Besides it's slow attack rate, it's a melee minion. Melee minions are pretty slow, and sometimes takes a short while to find a target and start attacking.

Heal Area can be good, but can be horrible too. Melee minions are obviously rarely gonna be in range to be healed with this. Newly raised minions will also usually be out of range. Another reason why I wouldn't use it is cause it's 10 energy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vandal2k6

I do spam BoTM all the time too, but it's a pain with the -HP hit. I've just been looking on GuildWiki for an alternative to keeping the minions alive. Is there one that doesn't have such a big side-effect as BoTM?

[skill]Aura of the Lich[/skill]

Possibly one of the least used yet best MM elite. Besides being used on Dark Aura necros (a build completely unrelated to MM'ing), it can be used on an MM with great results. It's common for people to wear multiple superior runes to lower your health and sac less from BotM. This elite does that for you, and also makes you take half damage. More importantly, this halves the cost of sacrifices.....

...My nec has 441hp...1 sup + major. He sacs about 120hp using BotM with 10 minions. With AotL active, I sac a mere 30hp. Heal Area becomes useless when using this elite, because you barely sac any hp at all, meaning you can rely on cheaper sources of healing. Blood Renewal is common with this elite, cause the sacrifice from it is also reduced by AotL.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutch Masterr

i see the flesh golem hit for 120+ damage on low and high armor targets alike..

Obviously it's not a low-armor target if it's hitting for 120+

Quote:

Originally Posted by crosshatch123

I dont think [skill]Order of Undeath[/skill] is a good choise, it costs 10 energy for 5 seconds, and its a 10% sac (and an additional 2% for each minion). While you allready have BotM as a sac in your build.

I think this is the only MM elite that requires abit of thinking, timing, and practice. In the hands of a master, this just might be the best MM elite out there. It's extremely damaging, and can mow down any mob very fast. It isn't bad choice just cause it makes you sac alot. Using this elite means you can't lazily spam and hit your Animate + BotM keys.

BladeDVD · Feb 10, 2007, 02:19 AM // 02:19

When I used to use Heal Area (or Karei's Healing Circle) as a MM, it was just to help keep the minions alive between fights, and as a self heal in a pinch.

It can be fun to put virulence and epidemic on a MM build. Regardless, you should try to fit one damage spell in there so you have something to do until someone dies, or if you lose all your minions for some reason (zoning, attacking corpse light groups, searing flames or invoke lightning eles).

I only run bone fiends and shambling horrors now when I MM. Faster damage w/the BF and 2 minions with the shambling horrors.

I also go 16 Death and 10 Soul Reaping which leaves me with enough points to get another attribute to 9 if I remember correctly.

Animate Flesh Golem is fun, but it does seem kind of limited. High damage, but slow attacks, pathing problems. And then if you're constantly spamming new minions you'll replace him in short order and have to recast him. Virulence does decent degen and coupled with epidemic and a mob is pretty nasty. Icy Veins is nice area effect damage on lower level monsters. Reapers Mark does -4 degen at 10SR and gives you back energy.

Point is you can do more than just minions when MMing. Mix it up a bit and have some fun.

Cathode_Reborn · Feb 10, 2007, 04:17 AM // 04:17

The new insane damage on Discord could be somethin to mess around with.

Ensign · Feb 10, 2007, 09:47 AM // 09:47

The most important skill on your bar is Animate Bone Fiend. The next most important skill on your bar is Blood of the Master. After that...nothing is very important. The only other spell that's worth casting over those two is Order of Pain. Otherwise you're taking spells to compliment those two.

I am not a big fan of Signet of Lost Souls - I spend all of my time casting, and enemies melt so quickly under Order of Pain + Animate Bone Fiend that it is much more difficult than it should be to land a Signet. Lower powered, more conservative, higher downtime Minion Masters might find it more useful than I did.

I'm a fan of Dark Bond at the moment, the fact that you rarely have to spend any meaningful time casting it mid-battle is a huge perk.

Peace,
-CxE

crosshatch123 · Feb 10, 2007, 10:40 AM // 10:40

If you take AotL, do u still take a taste of death?

And could this build work?

13 soulreaping
16 death
rest in blood

[skill]Reaper's Mark[/skill](for degen when there no corpses) [skill]Animate Bone Fiend[/skill] [skill]Animate Shambling Horror[/skill] [skill]Blood of the Master[/skill] [skill]Taste of Death[/skill] [skill]Dark Bond[/skill] [skill]Infuse Condition[/skill] or [skill]Animate Bone Minions[/skill] ReZ

I wonder if reapers mark is a usable skill, and if I should put Bone minions in

Narayanese · Feb 10, 2007, 02:21 PM // 14:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cathode_Reborn

The new insane damage on Discord could be somethin to mess around with.

I've been using it after the buff, and it is indeed a very good elite on a MM. Good for generating corpses when you have no minions, and a nice extra damage when you have 10 minions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vandal2k6

So what I want to know is, as an MM should I just spam minions or try to keep an eye on the current health of my flock? This is easier said than done in the heat of battle, which is why I've not been doing so atm. Am I doing OK the way I am (I can keep 8 up 95% of the time atm) or should I manage it a bit more.

8 minions, sounds like you are doing just fine. You never know when you might run out of corpses, so try keeping an eye on minion health and spam BoTM if they aren't near max health.

crosshatch123 · Feb 10, 2007, 03:02 PM // 15:02

I was thinking of discord aswell, but your foe has to have a condition AND a hex or enchantment. [skill]Discord[/skill]
Then ull have to have rotting flesh (or somthing like that) and a hex spell? on a MM build

Correct me if im wrong xD

jesh · Feb 10, 2007, 09:18 PM // 21:18

Discord is pretty conditional, but you do have a lot of room on a MM bar. It's just a question of how well you are at pulling 2 builds off at the same time.

Personally I'm running Reaper's Mark with Mark of Pain atm, because I haven't capped Order of Undeath yet.
I had forgotten about Aura of the Lich, it is pretty hot. It's a pretty late game cap though.

Cathode_Reborn · Feb 10, 2007, 09:53 PM // 21:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by crosshatch123

If you take AotL, do u still take a taste of death?

And could this build work?

13 soulreaping
16 death
rest in blood

[skill]Reaper's Mark[/skill](for degen when there no corpses) [skill]Animate Bone Fiend[/skill] [skill]Animate Shambling Horror[/skill] [skill]Blood of the Master[/skill] [skill]Taste of Death[/skill] [skill]Dark Bond[/skill] [skill]Infuse Condition[/skill] or [skill]Animate Bone Minions[/skill] ReZ

I wonder if reapers mark is a usable skill, and if I should put Bone minions in

Reaper's Mark is usually always used for damage, rather than energy gain. An MM doesn't always have tons of energy like many claim they do, so RM could help with that, only if you need the energy. For killing, it doesn't do well in pve. The strength of it's degen is that it lasts a very long time. It's better in pvp since enemies in pve usually won't even live throughout the entire duration.

Bone Minions should only be used for minion bombing. They do give back lots of energy though since you create 2 of em. If you want energy gain though, Sig of Lost Souls might be better since bone minions take up 2 spaces in your limited army.

Dark Bond has really never seemed necessary in pve. If I come under attack, I just need to move back a little, and the enemy will find another target. When MM'ing in pvp areas like Alliances Battles or Fort Aspenwood, Dark Bond is a must.

When using AotL, it's always good to have Infuse Condition. You might even wanna try out Mending Touch instead, if you're not using your 2ndary class. Since it isn't an enchantment, it could be more reliable than Infuse.

Emik · Feb 10, 2007, 09:56 PM // 21:56

I've been running this lately...

[skill]Animate Bone Fiend[/skill][skill]Animate Bone Horror[/skill][skill]Blood of the Master[/skill][skill]Aura of the Lich[/skill][skill]Dark Bond[/skill][skill]Infuse Condition[/skill][skill]Mystic Regeneration[/skill][skill]Resurrection Signet[/skill]

Started out with this first,

[skill]Animate Flesh Golem[/skill][skill]Animate Bone Fiend[/skill][skill]Animate Bone Horror[/skill][skill]Blood of the Master[/skill][skill]Dark Bond[/skill][skill]Infuse Condition[/skill][skill]Mystic Regeneration[/skill][skill]Resurrection Signet[/skill]

but then saw the first version on Wiki and tried it.
Must say it's a blast.
Low damage and the damage you still receive gets redirected for 75%
No conditions and a constant +10 health regen.
It's massive

As for attributes:
Death Magic: 12+3+1
Soul Reaping: 9+1
Blood Magic: 5+1
Earth Prayers: 8

jesh · Feb 10, 2007, 10:46 PM // 22:46

That looks like a pretty awesome build, Emik. I would change out Horrors for Shambling, though. And use a Sunspear Signet.

crosshatch123 · Feb 10, 2007, 11:52 PM // 23:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by jesh

That looks like a pretty awesome build, Emik. I would change out Horrors for Shambling, though. And use a Sunspear Signet.

About shambling, is it such an good minion? I'm using it for a while now, and I think it acts like a fleshie, it doesnt attack opponents fast, and when an opponent is killed, its also takes some time to attack the next, bone fiend are much better in that way

EDIT: @ Emik, I've been trying your build asweel now (with Mystic Regen) and I must say its great ! =D. But u dont have any dmg to get corpses, So your build relies on ally's right? (I mean, no farming?)

Narayanese · Feb 11, 2007, 09:39 PM // 21:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by crosshatch123

I was thinking of discord aswell, but your foe has to have a condition AND a hex or enchantment. [skill]Discord[/skill]
Then ull have to have rotting flesh (or somthing like that) and a hex spell? on a MM build

Correct me if im wrong xD

Yup, rising bile or parasitic bond as hex, and rotting flesh or enfeeble as condition. Rotting Flesh only works in some areas, in other they are immune to disease, or human. Quite often you can use a hex and condition someone else in your party put there, but it is best to bring them yourself, and there is room on an MM bar.
You are doing two things at the same time, but at least it is IMO easier than minion bombing (death nova has a long casting time, and targeting minions is tricky).

My current skillbar:
[skill]Discord[/skill][skill]Enfeeble[/skill][skill]Parasitic Bond[/skill][skill]Animate Shambling Horror[/skill][skill]Animate Bone Fiend[/skill][skill]Taste of Death[/skill][skill]Blood of the Master[/skill][skill]Resurrection Chant[/skill]

Shambling Horrors are nice for the low energy cost, and as a reserve skill to be able to animate two minions after each other, which is handy when starting your army.