Curse

Str0b0 · Jan 19, 2007, 06:36 AM // 06:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jegred2

what elite do you use on your dervish?

[skill]Ebon Dust Aura[/skill]

Perma blind FTW

Shuuda · Jan 19, 2007, 08:01 AM // 08:01

Don't forget about Zealous Vow, which I'm guessing would be awsome in PvE.

subjugatedcereal · Jan 19, 2007, 08:23 AM // 08:23

Melandru killer: Fragility + Incendiary Arrows at 0 WS.

jesh · Jan 19, 2007, 09:54 AM // 09:54

What a waste of an elite. Can you spell "downtime"?

Solus_the_Deadly · Jan 19, 2007, 10:23 AM // 10:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by subjugatedcereal

Melandru killer: Fragility + Incendiary Arrows at 0 WS.

No, 34 damage per condition is not a effective counter. It work take around 20 conditions to kill a dervish in Melandru Form (saying the dervish is averaging 650-700hp)

NinjaKai · Jan 19, 2007, 10:56 AM // 10:56

Truth is I like the elite forms. However, I think there are other elites at the Dervish disposal that can prove more effective. I mean with elite forms you aren't always using it, basically there always a gamble in PvE.

Sir Mad · Jan 19, 2007, 02:14 PM // 14:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jegred2

what elite do you use on your dervish?

In areas where the build works: [skill]Signet of Midnight[/skill]

And yeah concerning the avatars, Lyssa is my favourite in PvE as well - I'd rather spend some points in Earth Prayers if I want more defense than take Balthazar.

Saphatorael · Jan 19, 2007, 02:59 PM // 14:59

/sigh at the purpose of this thread.

Why do people see the Dervish as a profession that can change into an avatar and kick bum?

Stop making these kinds of threads that narrow an entire profession down to 'a character that change into a nasty mofo', please.

But to not make this appear as only a rant-post (yet I'm hoping to see a lock):

Imo, all avatars have a use, and it depends on how you play the game.
Lyssa has a huge damage capacity (it's fun to deal 120+ damage without even using an attack skill), and doesn't see enough play imo, mainly because that potential is quite conditional.

Grenth... is powerful. Too powerful? People say yes, and I expect Anet to slightly have it changed during the test weekend. Let's just see how it'll turn out, but for now, it's capable of debilitating anything that relies on enchantments, which is why it sees quite alot of love.

Balthazar: overrated, yet not crappy. Worst of the avatars imo, instead of having a semi-constant speed boost you might as well take a snare (Reap Impurities will even be 'stronger' then), the bonus AL is useful in PvE, but even without it you can survive through use of a few enchantments.
Least fav for me.

Melandru: Very strong, as shown in the current metagame. Will likely get toned down, but it's by far the most useful in both PvE and PvP.

Dwayna: So-so, doesn't see alot of play, and I just don't see myself using it either. better forms (mainly for damage output), yet it's healing capacity shouldn't be overlooked, It'll take away alot of pressure that the monks in the team could have.

But i'd just take Reaper's Sweep over any of these.

Str0b0 · Jan 19, 2007, 03:24 PM // 15:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saphatorael

/sigh at the purpose of this thread.

Why do people see the Dervish as a profession that can change into an avatar and kick bum?

Stop making these kinds of threads that narrow an entire profession down to 'a character that change into a nasty mofo', please.

QFT. There are so many more worthwhile elites to use on a dervish. The Avatar forms are a gimmick at best. Their long cool down makes them an unattractive choice for PvE play since you can't constantly use them.

Star Naiad · Jan 19, 2007, 04:01 PM // 16:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Str0b0

QFT. There are so many more worthwhile elites to use on a dervish. The Avatar forms are a gimmick at best. Their long cool down makes them an unattractive choice for PvE play since you can't constantly use them.

Why do you think they are called God forms and where is the fun if you can use it every 45secs?
Just have to activate the avatar the right time that’s when the fun begins!

I had so much fun with Melandru and that’s my Pick!

Str0b0 · Jan 19, 2007, 04:05 PM // 16:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Star Naiad

Why do you think they are called God forms and where is the fun if you can use it every 45secs?
Just have to activate the avatar the right time that’s when the fun begins!

I had so much fun with Melandru and that’s my Pick!

Avatars=gimmick skill. My EDA build > ANY AVATAR BUILD!

ensoriki · Jan 19, 2007, 10:01 PM // 22:01

Avatars arent exactly a gimmick
its more so of having a minute of Eliteness...hence Elite skills

but ya balthazar SUCks if the holy damage was actually armor ignoring.......BROOOOOKEN

Sir Mad · Jan 19, 2007, 10:53 PM // 22:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by ensoriki

Avatars arent exactly a gimmick
its more so of having a minute of Eliteness...hence Elite skills

but ya balthazar SUCks if the holy damage was actually armor ignoring.......BROOOOOKEN

It's not broken, it works as it's supposed to. Skills directly causing holy damage are armor ignoring, skills converting your damage to holy ain't (JI, Heart of the Holy Flame, etc), but provide extra damage vs some creatures (skellies, anything else?).

And if your damage was armor ignoring with Avatar of Balth, that would be THE skill to nerf (you'd multiply your damage by almost 4 vs a ranger for example - a bit too much isn't it?).

Shuuda · Jan 19, 2007, 11:36 PM // 23:36

Lyssa now gets +20 energy, that gets 2 thumbs up from me, and dwayna does more healing and only costs 5e, much better now.

Str0b0 · Jan 20, 2007, 05:42 PM // 17:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by ensoriki

Avatars arent exactly a gimmick
its more so of having a minute of Eliteness...hence Elite skills

but ya balthazar SUCks if the holy damage was actually armor ignoring.......BROOOOOKEN

Avatar skills are a gimmick, don't get me wrong they are a cool gimmick but a gimmick none the less. I can constantly use EDA, another elite skill, and because of the blind, experience nigh invulnerability versus melee and with reap impurities and mystic regen I can heal faster than any caster can damage me so long as I've got melee mobs around me. That's more than a minute of eliteness. The reason the avatars exist is to keep the dervish from being, as I saw one person in game put it " another wammo in a dress". they just aren't that useful in PvE. They have slightly more utility in PvP where you won't typically be engaging in extended battles or encountering a mob every thirty to forty five seconds. I was messing around in a 1v1 with a buddy of mine and Dwayna is nice versus mesmers and hex heavy builds. Melandru owned his ele with all it's burning. Honestly though since I capped EDA, yes I have ALL the avatar forms, I have yet to really find a use for the avatars in PvE aside from gimmick builds and the odd farmer here and there. I'm not saying the avatar forms suck, though some of them do, I'm just saying they have very limited utility versus the other elite skills in the Dervish arsenal.

jeoliver · Jan 20, 2007, 10:08 PM // 22:08

I am always using Lyssa and sometimes Dwayna. The most useless for me is Grenth, as I don't play pvp and I rarely find a good use for it in pve. I haven't really fooled around with Melandru much, the extra health and condition immunity is nice and all, but the energy cost isn't. I used Balth when I first got it, but dropped it soon after.

Mr_Cynical · Jan 24, 2007, 06:58 PM // 18:58

Best: For PvP, definitely Grenth. FINALLY Anet come up with a decent counter for the uber-overused Bonder monks.

For PvE, I prefer Melandru, since it makes Chilling Victory etc. easier to trigger and conditions are very, very common in PvE.

Worst: They're all pretty good, but if I actually HAD to pick one I'd say Lyssa, just because its increased damage bonus triggers least often.

Effigy · Jan 24, 2007, 10:05 PM // 22:05

Uber-overused bonder monks? lol?

Avatars are certainly not a gimmick, and I don't know where anyone would get that idea. They have a long cooldown, but they also have a long duration. And they can't be removed. And they completely destroy people. "Gimmick" implies that they have a narrow scope, which is most definitely not the case. Avatar dervishes are more flexible than most classes and can still function perfectly well out of their forms.

As to which forms are the best, it really depends on the context as others have pointed out. For PvP, observer mode will incontrovertibly show you that Melandru and Grenth are the best. PvE is a bit of a toss-up, but my money's on Lyssa or Balthazar.

Nimble Night · Jan 24, 2007, 10:47 PM // 22:47

commenting only on pvp melandru and grenth are by far the most overpowered.
you have one player that cannot be spiked and canot suffer conditions so your blindbot goes down the drain, and another that rapes your preprotting, normally takking harriers grasp or crippling sweep so disabling your kiting and spamming wild blow to cancel your stances and monks simply cant keep up with the pressure. you need someone spamming draw all the time to allow your team mates to get away safley.

dwayna, balthazar and lyssa all tie and being poo

do you need to constantly remove hexes and give yourself tiny heals, not really you have monks with holy veil or divert?
you have other cheaper skills for speed boosts and do you really need +40 armour? no, unless u intend to tank the oposing team oO.
and lyssa you have just got to hope you face a team entirly comprised of casters? do you really need +10 energy?

CagedinSanity · Jan 24, 2007, 11:16 PM // 23:16

Whoo, found a use for Dwayna;
It's decent in Ab but I suggest Melan/lyssa in AB's.

but while I was treasure hunting in the noob islands, even those level 12-15's were crippling the bajesus out of me with hexes, so dwayna is awesome to use in those areas that are skale-heavy. (Good to use if you're helping out a friend or guildie in those parts.) Then again, Melandru is better because that disease is murder.