Curse

JoeKnowMo · Feb 14, 2007, 10:23 PM // 22:23

Pet controls are coming. Good news

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10118574

However, that also means the return of pet DP in PvE. It was in pve for a short time before it got removed, but Gaile was pretty clear in stating that pet DP would likely be brought back along with the introduction of pet controls (would post link if search function on here was better).

If pets get DP in PvE, imo dire pets become less attractive than hearty pets.

DP'ed out pets in B/P groups don't look so hot either. Sure they weren't meant to stay up forever, but they provided atleast some tanking while keeping aggro off the backlines. Otyugh's cry now seems like a must have for B/P groups.

lennymon · Feb 14, 2007, 10:37 PM // 22:37

Assuming that you're WAG or wild a$zed guess about pet DP is correct, call of protection is still 200 times better than Otyugh's cry, and in fact OC is utter tripe. So the 'seems like a must for BP' since they are only there to DIE for minion fodder is kinda wrong (think kinda pregnant).

chichory · Feb 14, 2007, 11:07 PM // 23:07

Only one Otyugh's cry needs to be taken in one utillity slot as appose to everyone each taking their own copy of CoP.
And as i understand it (not a fan of B/P) not much extra slots are available as lots of utillity skills are needed. Also pets in B/P are there as a tempary wall, which gives abit more time before monsters break the lines (adding to minions of course)

I actually welcome pet DP as it will mean having to take that much extra care, my pet rarely dies anyway.

XvArchonvX · Feb 15, 2007, 01:42 AM // 01:42

bp groups will be easy to adapt by having one ranger bring CoP (I believe that one CoP affects all pets in the group if I'm not mistaken) and/or Otygh's Cry so that pets will be a bit more stout.

I do however worry about the average beastmaster since it's hard enough to fit a decent defense for your self and your pet in addition to enough attack skills to make the build effective. Adding dp to pets will make it harder for beastmasters to be able to squeeze in the additional needed defense needed to counter this. However, I guess time will tell whether this will be an issue or not, assuming of course that pet dp in PvE does even come into play.

Franco Power · Feb 15, 2007, 02:29 AM // 02:29

Well lets not forget one of the other important roles of the pet in a b/p group.

Minion food.

Amy Awien · Feb 15, 2007, 07:31 AM // 07:31

Corpses enough for minions and even without pet DP a pet death is annoying enough. Pet DP isn't the end, but I'd hope with DP pets will also gain the benefits from morale boosts and that their DP is reduced with experience as it is with players and heroes.

But, were in that thread did you see that DP thing Joe?

Quote:

Originally Posted by lennymon

... and in fact OC is utter tripe.

How is +20 AL utter tripe? With 20AL extra damage is reduced to 70%, it may not be the 20 DR from CoP, but it's still a fairly decent skill.

Cathode_Reborn · Feb 15, 2007, 07:48 AM // 07:48

I never saw the point in using skills to boost your pet's survivability when you can just res 'em a few seconds later. Adding in dp will mean you can't just recklessly toss your pet into a huge mob anymore. Those pet-protection skills will be more useful. A possible problem might be pulling a pet out of a mob when it's about to die, but that's probably where the new pet controls will come in.

Amy Awien · Feb 15, 2007, 07:59 AM // 07:59

Your efforts would be one of the reasons they'd even think about pet dp, a rez means a 240HP heal out of comfort animal. If that is indeed ANet purpose they'd do better changing comfort to require more energy if used on a dead pet.

Master Ketsu · Feb 15, 2007, 04:30 PM // 16:30

Quote:

I do however worry about the average beastmaster since it's hard enough to fit a decent defense for your self and your pet in addition to enough attack skills to make the build effective. Adding dp to pets will make it harder for beastmasters to be able to squeeze in the additional needed defense needed to counter this. However, I guess time will tell whether this will be an issue or not, assuming of course that pet dp in PvE does even come into play.

Only bring defense for yourself, and comfort animal.

Practice using comfort animal right before your pet dies. If you cast CA at the second before you see your pets name go from white to gray, Your pet will be instantly ressurected, and you wont have any downtime.

LoL glitch.

Amy Awien · Feb 15, 2007, 06:06 PM // 18:06

That wouldn't work to prevent the DP. About time you learned to take care of your pet. Bringeing pet defense is not so bad, CoP will take away a lot of the pain, save your healers a lot of energy and it can be one of the skills that drive

Quote:

Originally Posted by XvArchonvX

... (I believe that one CoP affects all pets in the group if I'm not mistaken) ...

I found some information on the GWiki discussion page for CoP:
"A Paragon/Ranger accompanied by other beastmasters with pets will only gain 1 energy when using this shout. This suggests that only one pet (yours) is affected, unless the energy return mechanism on Leadership is bugged in the case of pet shouts." (from Semantic)

SnipiousMax · Feb 15, 2007, 07:12 PM // 19:12

^ Yea I think there was an update/fix/etc where they changed the fact that CoP affected all the pets in the group.

JoeKnowMo · Feb 15, 2007, 09:32 PM // 21:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amy Awien

But, were in that thread did you see that DP thing Joe?

Actually, DP for pets isn't mentioned in the recent update. However, Gaile has said in the past that pet controls and pet DP would likely implemented together.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

However, the bottom line is that pet controls are coming, and everyone here believes that DP in PvE should not be rolled out until the controls are in place.

http://guildwars.incgamers.com/forum...&postcount=470

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

Since you know that pet controls are on the agenda, and that DP will be based on the inclusion of same, you should feel free to make suggestions about the controls.

http://guildwars.incgamers.com/forum...&postcount=487

@Archonv: Call of Protection does not affect all pets, despite the skill description suggesting it does. I'm pretty sure it's mentioned in the pet guide by Jenosavel and Epinephrine.

You can also try taking a paragon (with atleast 8 leadership) in a team with multiple pets and using Otyugh's Cry and CoP. The former returns more energy than the latter (based on the # of pets in the group).

@lennymon: Otyugh's Cry is somewhat needed to keep pets alive since SYG! and WY! don't affect them now.

Evilsod · Feb 15, 2007, 10:23 PM // 22:23

I've never had a problem keeping my pet alive without Otyughs Cry... Only time i've ever bothered to bring it was during a 3x Enraged BM trip with my heros.

I tested it out with Call of Haste too, watching an allied pets attack speed, then again after CoH, it remained the same. I just assumed CoP was the same.

And yeah... B/P pets are there to die, nobody gives a damn about there survival.

Sophitia Leafblade · Feb 16, 2007, 01:39 PM // 13:39

Hey! Pets are for life not just for B/Ping!

My pet out performs most wammos ive seen

i take him almost everywhere with me and should he ever get into trouble i make sure he stays alive.

Ive founds Pets are very usful when you use them correctly even if you dont use them in a high stat beast mastery Build.

XvArchonvX · Feb 16, 2007, 03:56 PM // 15:56

When they implement pet control, I'm just curious as to how many solo BM builds there will be when a player will be able to life bond + CoP + Otygh's + Symbiotic Bond their pet into being uber invincipets. That is, unless they nerf any of these skills of course. This is basically what I did when I evolved my hyena dire, except I also did a lot of running and hiding and running and hiding in some areas since it's really tricky to get your pet to continue to attack a target when you are out of aggro range and not drawing aggro to yourself, especially since enemies generally turn to the person with less health (which was usually me since I made sure my pet took no damage).

Amy Awien · Feb 16, 2007, 11:33 PM // 23:33

These builds, or similar ones, exist already. I've used Symbiotic and CoP together, and I think something using those is already presented on the Wiki. Adding Life Bond is, though possible, not neccesary, even dangerous since the pet-oriented healing is generally better then the ranger's selfheal you'd risk dying before your pet. Might look funny though, you standing in the backline, loosing health and dying without being attacked ....
I do wonder if Symbiotic and Life bonds stack for use with - I think it is - Essence Bond ...

Evilsod · Feb 17, 2007, 01:55 AM // 01:55

This is why we were given Heal as One... I'm sure any such BM builds won't be restricted to Enraged Lunge as the elite.

Symbiotic is dangerous anyway... its like a Life Bond except you get no damage reduction at your end. That bugged frigging skill almost got me killed when it attacked 4 Abyssal alone...

lennymon · Feb 17, 2007, 02:19 AM // 02:19

The reason I say OC isn't worth a slot is because there will always be a more usefull skill to put there. Be that a spirit or throw dirt or what have you, there are just too many utulities which can be pulled from the deep ranger bag of tricks. Even on the off chance that you are running 6 beast masters (and NO I don't include b/p in that category) there are just too many better things that can be brought. If pets start having serious dp issues when its finally implemented I'll try it, once, but I really doubt +20 armor would actually help more than something else. Learning how to control the pet takes time and learning how not to get your pet killed is the same.

XvArchonvX · Feb 17, 2007, 03:29 AM // 03:29

Hmm...I'm wondering if we'll ever see a 55 ranger with a Symbiotic + Life Bond + Balth Spirit type UW tank build, lol.