Curse

BeefEater4:20 · Mar 12, 2007, 08:15 PM // 20:15

Hi All,

I've been playing GW for almost a year and have developed, what I feel, is an effective MM build that I haven't seen posted before and thought I'd put it up here to get everyone's feedback and and possibly make some improvements. I know it's likely someone else has posted this exact build already or something similar, but I developed this on my own without finding it the forums, so please don't flame me saying so and so has posted this and i'm trying to steal his credit, cause i'm not. This build is what I use for my necro when I MM, or I use it for my Necro Hero and run a curse build. Either way, I find it very effective for me.

Death Magic = 15 (12+2+1)
Soul Reaping = 10+2
Healing = 8 (i think, at work and can't check)

Skills
animate bone fiend
animate shambling horror
animate flesh golem (E)
blood of the master
deathly swarm
bitter chill
healing breeze
ressurect

Usage:

Generally I'll raise my golem first and alternate between fiends and shambling horrors (bone fiends recharges faster) until I reach my max minion count. I use healing breeze to have a nice hp regen while I spam BOTM on my minions to keep em alive. I only use deathly swarm and bitter chill when i don't have any minions or manage to spare a few seconds between raising corpses to throw some extra damage in. As for resurrect, I like that I can bring someone back to life without losing all my energy.

I play entirely in pve and don't pvp, but I find that unless there are absolutely no corpses around, this build is very good at adding numbers to the party side. I find that using a mix of melee and ranged minions helps spread the damage to the party around and can provide some excellent secondary damage to the party's primary damage dealers. Throw in a curse necro with barbs and suddenly minions can become very deadly to the cursed target.

Also, I have found that if I give this build to a necro hero, they can run it so well that he almost indefinately controls his maximum amount of minions. I have decided that since he can run it so well, I'll bring my necro hero as MM and run my Curse build on my necro. This works very good for me, as I enjoy cursing the enemy over trying to manage and maintain a small army.

Thanks for taking the time to read this post and please post any constructive comments regarding the build.

Thanks,

BeefEater

pnumm · Mar 12, 2007, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Fairly interesting. I use nearly the same build, but I use bone horror instead of shambling horror, and Karei's Healing Circle instead of Bitter Chill. The reasons: Bone Horror beceause of the recharge, although I like the jagged horrors, and Karei's healing Circle beceause you can use it with BotM, first to use BotM and then circle. Double heal and you just restored your own sac.

Stormlord Alex · Mar 12, 2007, 09:16 PM // 21:16

Nothing new, standard scrub N/Mo MM, with a sub-par res, non-max Death Magic, and it's missing a vital skill, namely Dark Bond. Most minion masters who use Healing Prayers also take Heal Area, it's not particularly great on heroes, but much better than HB at healing health sacs.

Cathode_Reborn · Mar 12, 2007, 09:37 PM // 21:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by pnumm

Fairly interesting. I use nearly the same build....

Everyone uses a build like this. The N/Mo Golem MM has got so popular that people think it's the only MM build there is. On rare occasions, pve groups won't take you as an MM if you're not N/Mo.

Take out Bitter Chill, it sucks. I never bring any direct damage spells on my MM. If you ae gonna use one, Deathly Swarm or Deathly Chill are the only ones worth bringing. I simply don't bring any cause I'm always either using an animate spell or spamming BotM.

Stormlord Alex · Mar 12, 2007, 10:13 PM // 22:13

The more I play, the more I seem to be drawn towards Deathly Chill... It lacks the AoE of Swarm, but it's quite an effective damage spell at the beginning of battle, a 106 strike on such a low cast/recharge is a pretty sweet deal. Not needed at all in PvE, where most of your resources/time should be spent maintaining an army, but definately a spell to bring to AB. I guess any other Death Magic based necro could use it too...

Damn, i'm starting to like Chill quite a lot... I want my necro back

Marverick · Mar 12, 2007, 10:27 PM // 22:27

First of all, you need 16 Death Magic and Bloodstained Insignia. It is crucial to MM's; unlike monks/mesmers/eles who can live with slightly less damage/healing, that 1 extra Death Magic translates into A LOT of extra damage and armor for minions.

Two direct damage skills is a bit too much since you really want your minions to do damage and you should be focused on keeping them up and animating new ones the instant a corpse becomes free so AI MM's don't hog up the corpses. Drop them both and bring Rotting Flesh; it lasts long and provides decent damage to members of the same species.

Healing Breeze sucks. Take Heal Area/Karei's Healing Circle as it heals you and your minions. Or use AotL and Mystic Regeneration + one other random enchantment if you can free your elite. Or go /P for Leader's Comfort; despite having 0 in Leadership you still get a 140 heal nearly all the time due to minions. And Signet of Lost Souls is pretty much a must, it gives energy and health.

Priest Of Sin · Mar 12, 2007, 10:37 PM // 22:37

Bloodstained is NOT needed for MMing, anyone who thinks that way is a moron. The only things stealing your corpses in PvE are well+consume+putrid. Kindly stfu. And in AB? MMs are utter trash there, they are fragile little things that get raped by an assassin or warrior as soon as they can find the necro using minion spells. Bloodstained= nice but not needed. And expensive as RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO too, so there.

And SoLS? Silence pig. Soul reaping will completely take care of your energy, things will be dying left and right. Don't be stupid. Clearly Maverick hasn't been MMing long, or he would know these things.

And AoTL+MR? That's two slots wasted, plus some atts wasted in Earth Prayers. Maverick, unless you can pull 3 extra skill slots out of your ass, don't suggest stupid things.

On to the matter at hand. Remove Healing Breeze, take Heal Area. It's a better heal, and heals your minions as well. Use either Deathly Swarm or Rotting Flesh if you need a damage skill. Use Rebirth, it's a better rez. And completely ditch the flesh golem, go for Order Of Undeath or Aura Of The Lich. Much more useful.

Remember: simpler is better in an MM build. You need to look after your army first, yourself second.

$hade. · Mar 13, 2007, 12:05 AM // 00:05

Priest has good points. There's not really any unique MM builds. All are generally the same.

I don't use bloodstained boots/insignia and my MM works fine. I just use MM boots. I would rather have extra armor and besides, I already use a staff that halves cast/recharge of spells 20% chance. It works fine for me.

Cathode_Reborn · Mar 13, 2007, 01:18 AM // 01:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Priest Of Sin

And in AB? MMs are utter trash there, they are fragile little things that get raped by an assassin or warrior as soon as they can find the necro using minion spells.

I've been able to tank plenty of warriors and sins in Ab and Aspenwood. No one brings disenchants so I take advantage of that. AotL + Mystic Regen + Infuse Condition + Dark Bond. It's easy to MM in Ab without dying. Just cause you saw a bunch of crap N/Mo's die after taking a small amount of hits doesn't mean it's impossible. Let your team do the killing....once you get a few minions up, it gets pretty easy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by $hade.

I don't use bloodstained boots/insignia and my MM works fine. I just use MM boots. I would rather have extra armor and besides, I already use a staff that halves cast/recharge of spells 20% chance. It works fine for me.

What exacly do you consider working fine? Your feet are very very unlikely to hit. Bloodstained boots arn't needed obviously, but they're great for any MM. There really isn't any other useful insignias for your boots. What other insignia did you plan on getting? The loss of +1 energy or +5hp isn't big at all, and armor insignias on your boots/gloves are pretty useless.......might as well get the Bloodstained.

Coloneh · Mar 13, 2007, 03:21 AM // 03:21

Ya, this is the same build everyone uses that is outclassed by a conviction + mystic regen + AotL MM

Livingston · Mar 13, 2007, 03:50 AM // 03:50

If I were you I would drop healing all together. I've played both an MM as a survivor and have extensively tested MM builds for my heros.

You don't need the monk class at all.

Put everything on Death magic and Soul Reaping then put the last 3 points in Blood Magic.

So you should have:

Death: 16
Soul: 13
Blood: 3

Your minion choice is fine.

Add Dark Bond, Taste of Death, and Death Nova.

With Dark Bond + Taste of death you will never die unless your entire party and most of your minions have died. And with these two skills I've taken on a double pull with only one minion left standing. When it died, Death Nova went off killing two mobs. I ran a bit to break aggro, came back raised a Shambling and a Golum and got my minions back up to seven before the mobs were down.

Taste of Death works particularly well with the Shambling as you can destroy it for the heal and still have a minion left.

My Necro MM hero when running this build only goes down right before my Ranger does, which leaves only me.

Livingston

Ahab The Great · Mar 13, 2007, 01:06 PM // 13:06

the thing with Taste of Death and other minion-dependent healing skills is they dont spontaneously heal. this is the negative side to not having Mo secondary prof when going for LEgendary Survivor title.
i tried Ne/Mes, since it is arguably the most powerful combo (Mesmer = strongest magic, Necro = great shmit as well, SS, SV, MM abilities) but since no selfheal was available it went down under.
LET ME KNOW if it is possible to have a completely Necro build with no self heal and be "invincible" as it were. I dont think it is (at least versus lightning/fire/OVERPOWERED eles with armor penetration over the roof).
considering the necro only has 60 armor, plus the odd 5 for the MM insignia on one of your armor pieces (the others should have something like, Bloodstained, health +15, armor +15 vs piercing dmg, death magic +1, energy regen +1).
So we are in the shit in that sense. If the boss focuses on your necro (99% chance lvls 20+, you're in for a fast sprint the hell outta there or ...die..(ouch!)).
my3.5centavos

Livingston · Mar 13, 2007, 01:19 PM // 13:19

I got it quite easily (though it still took forever) with a pure Necro, using the skills I described above.

All you have to do is make sure that you always have minions on hand. You should be using henchies and hero's when going for the title, so just flag them forward to get them to attack and don't fully enter battle until you have 3 or so minions up. Unless you are doing missions like Raisu Palace, there is no reason that you would be overun.

All you have to do is make sure you don't over pull. If you have to use Taste of Death more than twice in a row, you should be getting the heck out of there. If you are going for survivor you should probably be map traveling at that point, as survival comes first.

If you aren't going for survivor then the build is even better. I've never needed a true self heal over Taste of Death.

And it's always a bad idea to give your hero a skill that heals enemy mobs.

Livingston

BeefEater4:20 · Mar 13, 2007, 05:15 PM // 17:15

Hey everyone,

Thanks for the feedback. It's mostly good suggestions.

One thing I want to point out though for those who mention pvp, this build is not used in pvp, and I don't ever intend on using it for that. My main focus is getting through the missions on nightfall and factions (already beat prophecies) and hopefully collecting some cool gear along the way.

Also, I really don't want to take healing breeze out because i find it useful for restoring health lost to sacrificing, countering any degen you may have, and functions as a backup heal if the party monks are too busy / dead or need to be healed themselves and it doesn't require having any minions to use. I also don't like rebirth because of the skill bar being disabled for x seconds after being brought back to life. Normally, the only person I will res in the middle of combat is the monk. I feel it's more important for the monk to be able to use his skills as quickly as possible rather than be able to res the monk from far away. That being said, I sure hope someone else brings rebirth in case $h1t happens.

Thanks again for all the feedback. Once I can save up some more money I'll probably get a bloodstained insignia for my boots and MM insignia's for most of the rest of the armor (need to buy new nightfall armor for my necro anyway, his droks bonelace armor is lookin old).

BeefEater

Stormlord Alex · Mar 13, 2007, 09:07 PM // 21:07

Rebirth is not an in-battle res. It's a totally retarded thing to do in the middle of a battle... You use Rebirth to bring the party back when the sh*t hits the fan and you nearly wipe, otherwise let people with Res sigs or the ele with a GoS Chant do the ressing.

Marverick · Mar 14, 2007, 01:51 AM // 01:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Priest Of Sin

Bloodstained is NOT needed for MMing, anyone who thinks that way is a moron. The only things stealing your corpses in PvE are well+consume+putrid. Kindly stfu. And in AB? MMs are utter trash there, they are fragile little things that get raped by an assassin or warrior as soon as they can find the necro using minion spells. Bloodstained= nice but not needed. And expensive as RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO too, so there.

And SoLS? Silence pig. Soul reaping will completely take care of your energy, things will be dying left and right. Don't be stupid. Clearly Maverick hasn't been MMing long, or he would know these things.

And AoTL+MR? That's two slots wasted, plus some atts wasted in Earth Prayers. Maverick, unless you can pull 3 extra skill slots out of your ass, don't suggest stupid things.

On to the matter at hand. Remove Healing Breeze, take Heal Area. It's a better heal, and heals your minions as well. Use either Deathly Swarm or Rotting Flesh if you need a damage skill. Use Rebirth, it's a better rez. And completely ditch the flesh golem, go for Order Of Undeath or Aura Of The Lich. Much more useful.

Remember: simpler is better in an MM build. You need to look after your army first, yourself second.

Oh funny, have you been MMing a lot on Istan? When you get to the Realm of Torment, how often do you have mobs dying left and right?
And when you ever run 2 MM's in a group there is no way you will be using BotM with 20 minions without having AotL on. Of course you probably can't get more than 5 minions at any time, so yea, AotL is useless for you.

Bloodstained =/= useless... you animate minions 25% faster; how the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO is that useless? And PvE mobs do animate minions, of course if your hiding under a rock then Rock Borer Worms don't animate them so go kindly excuse your fat ass. Flesh Golems, Summit Dark Binders, Shadow of Fears, Behemoth Gravebanes........

Marverick · Mar 14, 2007, 01:53 AM // 01:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Priest Of Sin

Bloodstained is NOT needed for MMing, anyone who thinks that way is a moron. The only things stealing your corpses in PvE are well+consume+putrid. Kindly stfu. And in AB? MMs are utter trash there, they are fragile little things that get raped by an assassin or warrior as soon as they can find the necro using minion spells. Bloodstained= nice but not needed. And expensive as RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO too, so there.

And SoLS? Silence pig. Soul reaping will completely take care of your energy, things will be dying left and right. Don't be stupid. Clearly Maverick hasn't been MMing long, or he would know these things.

And AoTL+MR? That's two slots wasted, plus some atts wasted in Earth Prayers. Maverick, unless you can pull 3 extra skill slots out of your ass, don't suggest stupid things.

On to the matter at hand. Remove Healing Breeze, take Heal Area. It's a better heal, and heals your minions as well. Use either Deathly Swarm or Rotting Flesh if you need a damage skill. Use Rebirth, it's a better rez. And completely ditch the flesh golem, go for Order Of Undeath or Aura Of The Lich. Much more useful.

Remember: simpler is better in an MM build. You need to look after your army first, yourself second.

Oh funny, have you been MMing a lot on Istan? When you get to the Realm of Torment, how often do you have mobs dying left and right?
And when you ever run 2 MM's in a group there is no way you will be using BotM with 20 minions without having AotL on. Of course you probably can't get more than 5 minions at any time, so yea, AotL is useless for you.

Bloodstained =/= useless... you animate minions 25% faster; how exactly is that useless? And PvE mobs do animate minions, of course if you spend your life under a rock then Rock Borer Worms don't animate them so go kindly excuse your fat ass. Flesh Golems, Summit Dark Binders, Shadow of Fears, Behemoth Gravebanes........

It may not be *needed*... but any serious MM would have them, and a player can get the Droks 1.5k Bloodstained Boots for like 1.5k, so expensive is NOT an excuse. Heroes I don't mind that much but apparently the OP is a player, not Olias asking for advice.

Carinae · Mar 14, 2007, 01:52 PM // 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marverick

And when you ever run 2 MM's in a group there is no way you will be using BotM with 20 minions without having AotL on.

Sure you can. I run double MM's often, and my elite is OoU to boot. Just have to pay attention to your health.

BeefEater4:20 · Mar 14, 2007, 07:55 PM // 19:55

Update:

Well, I've taken some of the suggestions regarding this build and currently have Olias running this build very effectively. I have Olias running it 'cause I just find MMing not as much fun as cursing the $h1t out of enemies

and it's too much micro-management. I've modified the skill bar and attributes slightly as suggested and here's what Olias runs.

Attributes:

Death: 16 (12+3+1)
Soul Reaping: 14 (12+2)
some points leftover

Skills:
Animate Bone Fiend
Animate Shambling Horror
Animate Flesh Golem
Blood of the Master
Deathly Swarm
Feast of the Dead
Taste of Corruption
Rebirth

Olias is using my necro's Ghial's staff for the occasional fast cast or stronger minion and extra energy.

I haven't tested this in any high end areas, but I have little difficulty fighting in Kourna or near Kaineng Centre with full hero/hench team. Olias almost always has 10 minions going with a good mix of meat shields and ranged fire. This works very well with my necro casting barbs on tough targets to give the minions some extra punch.

EDIT: Corrected Soul Reaping attribute.

rick1027 · Mar 14, 2007, 10:37 PM // 22:37

only thing i dont like about this is giving olias flesh golem my olias tends to overcast it killing the first one off too quick but for my necro id use this setup or close to it especially in tight areas with few corpses