Curse

Sha Noran · Jul 08, 2006, 06:49 AM // 06:49

Updated the guide with some of the things Epinephrine recommended; check it out. ;-)

XvArchonvX · Jul 14, 2006, 05:16 AM // 05:16

Oath Shot got nerfed, looks like Trappers Focus is the better strategy for trapping now. At least I got both my rangers through Gyala Hatchery before this happened. =P

SnipiousMax · Jul 14, 2006, 05:46 AM // 05:46

^ It wasn't a big nerf....

Sha Noran · Jul 14, 2006, 06:21 AM // 06:21

Was going to post the same myself regarding . ;-)

Lol at the Archer's Signet change. Saw there was an update and started to get hopeful, then read it. Too funny.

Going to fix the portion regarding Ascalon Bows right now.

Also, could I get some feedback from Epinephrine please regarding the changes I made? I'd like to know if that's what you envisioned.

SnipiousMax · Jul 14, 2006, 06:27 AM // 06:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

Lol at the Archer's Signet change. Saw there was an update and started to get hopeful, then read it. Too funny.

Fixing the bug definately makes it worth using.... wait.... no it doesn't!

Amy Awien · Jul 14, 2006, 04:40 PM // 16:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

... says the guy who uses Apply then spreads it with Savage spam.

Actually, it was you who did that, with his build, to 'show' how terrible it was.

Sir Mad · Jul 14, 2006, 04:51 PM // 16:51

Well the nerf of Oath Shot is pretty much a joke. The recharge time is now 25 secs instead of 20 secs. I don't think it will change a lot of things...

SnipiousMax · Jul 14, 2006, 06:08 PM // 18:08

^ 5 second down time for Whirling defense. That's about it.

Sir Mad · Jul 14, 2006, 06:37 PM // 18:37

Well if that's about oath shot trapping, dust trap is way more efficient against mellee fighters - it's just a matter of timing. And if you let a tank go first, foes with range attacks shouldn't hit you so...

Epinephrine · Jul 14, 2006, 06:52 PM // 18:52

The changes look fine Sha; I still find the language strong, but you seem to like bold statements (NEVER....).

I disagree with the assessment of Zealous bows still - if you look at the bows owned by many well known rangers (for example, Valerius posted his bows in a thread a while back) they are nearly all Zealous and Vampiric - because they are that good. Zealous bows are super in PvE, or even in PvP with many builds. There are just SO many times that zealous is useful.

You never changed your Expertise values, and an explanation of Expertise is still missing. It's nice to sketch out a bunch of builds, but people will also be setting up their own builds, and I think a discussion of the breakpoints for expertise and the logic behind choosing a value is worth doing.

Glad to see the Ascalon bows get an approval now; the Ithas bow still isn't bad though. Sure, it's only 5 AL extra, but it's 5 AL - if you aren't using the bow for damage (for which it's pretty bad - no 15% bonus and 13-25 damage) it works fine; For example - if you only carry a bow to fire off an oath shot, how can you complain about a bow that gives a free 5 AL boost?

Anyway, I think it's much better than it was. I still disagree with points in it, but we can agree to disagree. I think you'd be surprised how many folks will say that zealous (and vampiric) bows are an essential part of a ranger's inventory though.

Sha Noran · Jul 15, 2006, 02:42 AM // 02:42

Forgot the Expertise breakpoints; I'll add those in tonight.

Zealous arguably has its uses as a switch-to bow once you get low on Energy, but there are other more potent mods to use as a main bow in any case except Ranger e-denial, which is only even remotely logical in PvP. As this guide focuses on team play in PvE, I will hold my ground regarding my statements on the Zealous mod.

Bold statements are how people learn. Telling kids they shouldn't play with guns isn't going to help anyone, even though once they grow up they might choose to take up shooting as a hobby. :-)

Sir Mad · Jul 15, 2006, 01:44 PM // 13:44

Quote:

Zealous arguably has its uses as a switch-to bow once you get low on Energy, but there are other more potent mods to use as a main bow in any case except Ranger e-denial, which is only even remotely logical in PvP. As this guide focuses on team play in PvE, I will hold my ground regarding my statements on the Zealous mod.

Well, again zealous + barrage as a default combinaison may be very efficient with some energy consuming builds, provided your oponents stay close together (and if not no need to use barrage I guess...). This is the only way I found to run solo R/Mo builds with expensive Mo enchantments.

baboh_tea · Jul 15, 2006, 03:57 PM // 15:57

Maybe you could try conjure lightning for extra dmg. Just a thought, dosent even know if it'll work.

Sha Noran · Jul 18, 2006, 02:57 PM // 14:57

Finally got around to adding the part regarding Expertise breakpoints. Been really busy with the game the last couple of days and thus haven't had time to do it until now. See if that explains it well; I was pretty tired when I wrote that so I'm not sure it's worth a damn. :-P

Sha Noran · Jul 29, 2006, 05:02 PM // 17:02

*cough >.>

Don't mean to be bumping my own stuff here, but could I get some feedback regarding that last addition of the Expertise breakpoints? If that was the only thing you guys felt kept it from being sticky-able (hmm I doubt that's a word) then....

Also:

baboh_tea: Yes, of course you could do that; any of the Conjure spells from the Elementalist lines could be used in combination as indicated in the OP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Mad

Well, again zealous + barrage as a default combinaison may be very efficient with some energy consuming builds, provided your oponents stay close together (and if not no need to use barrage I guess...). This is the only way I found to run solo R/Mo builds with expensive Mo enchantments.

Bolded part of that for emphasis; as I said, these builds and guides are based on the idea that the user will be playing in a group environment. The rules generally change drastically when you're trying to do something alone, but that's not the focus of the guide. :-)

Shorter Than U · Aug 14, 2006, 06:34 AM // 06:34

good job on thread Sha, you have made me love rangers again

Huntmaster · Aug 14, 2006, 07:02 AM // 07:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lasher Dragon

You had me until this:

ROFL

IMO Oath Shot is one of THE best elites in the game, bar none. Yeah, sometimes it misses, but much more often it hits - especially if you know what you are doing.

QFT.

Everyone knows Barrage is the worst PvE elite.

Sneale. · Aug 14, 2006, 10:31 AM // 10:31

Not a bad guide there, Sha. IMO the new school trapping build kinda sucks. The main trapping places (for me anyway) are usually UW, Trolls or Minotaurs. Using trapper's focus is a waste of an elite cause most of these times they can still interrupt you with savage slashes, and with minotaurs theres no point running into action anyway as you'll just get maimed. Heck, even Escape is better than trapper's focus. I for one would find no use for this build, and this elite skill.

Sir Mad · Aug 14, 2006, 11:36 AM // 11:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Huntmaster

QFT.

Everyone knows Barrage is the worst PvE elite.

Let's try to remain objective... Yes I do hate those rangers with only one elite, using barrage anywhere from RoF to Fort Aspenwood. But used properly (I mean: used on maps were monsters are packed) this is a great AoE skill that doesn't make monsters flee.

Huntmaster · Aug 14, 2006, 12:03 PM // 12:03

Oh, whoops, i think i forgot the </sarcasm> on that post!

To be honest, i want to see Incend. Arrows get it's well deserved buff already.. that skill is too awesome to be left crippled in the dirt. Make it last longer and raise the energy cost, i say.. Go team team team.