Curse

Takuna · Feb 20, 2007, 12:00 AM // 00:00

This is a build that has basically just evolved into what it is by me running through the Factions campaign and using whatever looked good. (With a teensy bit of help from the wiki to find certain elites.

) The thing is, while I think it may be good, there may be factors that I've underestimated, so I thought I'd ask some more seasoned players to give their comments.

A/Mo

Dagger Mastery: 13
Critical Strike: 11
Shadow Refuge: 8
Protection Prayers: 2 (I had a few extra points and thought about the extra second in Rebirth.)

Critical Eye
Jagged Strike (Purely because of it's low cost and quick recharge.)
Wild Strike
Death Blossom
Moebius Strike
Shadow Refuge
Heart of Shadow
Rebirth

Please note, I have ONLY used this buld in PvE. So don't assume that I'm asking about PvP build. By all means, tell me if it WOULD be a bad idea to use in PvP but also please provide some useful tips on what to for PvE. (eg. Jagged Strike, it feels like a 'gap filler' to start the combo, is it realy just pulling the build down?)

The whole point of the build is to spam like heck with Death Blossom and Moebius Strike. Would the damage be too 'slow but sure' and more of the sort of thing a Tank should use?

Kiba of hidden leaf · Feb 20, 2007, 03:16 AM // 03:16

You should porbably run Assassin's Promise because it allows you to use stronger attack skills like black lotus and black spider strike, while also recharging all your skills. Not just your attack skills.

ss1986v2 · Feb 20, 2007, 04:14 AM // 04:14

DB/Moebius is one of my favorite chains for pve. its quick, spammable, delivers a nice bit of punch (both on single target and AoE). your two set-up skills, though, are rather weak. higher end targets shouldnt be dropping so fast that you need need to restart your chain every 4 seconds. besides, moebius will recharge all of your attack skills, so you can choose ones that have a longer cool down.

my two options would first be to drop both jagged and wild. then replace them with a trigger hex and a skill like BLS. this will shorten up your chain while still using the same number of skills, and providing a bit of additional energy. the issue with this kind of set up is if your BLS misses its mark (hex removed, blinded, blocked) you are dead in the water till it recharges. BSS also makes a good alternative to BLS.

the other option would be to keep using a lead and off-hand, just pick better ones. again, this would be up to you, but id try to shy away from higher cost skills. the pair of fox attacks deliver a nice punch of dmg (both +27 at 13 DM) plus have unblockability. mantis sting/jungle strike also can pack a good hit (+19 and +50 at 13 DM if conditions met).

as for your utility, i prefer both deaths retreat and return for my escape skill. rather choose where i end up, rather than let fate decide. but it will work; its just a matter of preference. shadow refuge isnt my favorite heal, but not much else available to sins. it only heals for 64 hp at 8 SA with a bonus of 52 hp if you are attacking. but if you need the heal that bad, you shouldnt be sticking around attacking in the first place. never really used critical eye outside of crit barrage, so i wont say anything about that. i rarely ever like rebirth (just seems like bringing it is saying you anticipate to near fail several times), but whatever.

good basic idea, just needs a bit of tweaking.

Yanman.be · Feb 20, 2007, 07:15 AM // 07:15

Try getting 13 CS. Take another heal/defense skill instead of crit eye. Take zealous weapons.

Takuna · Feb 20, 2007, 11:04 AM // 11:04

I find that with critical eye, my energy is always full, though. I guess that if I bought a zealous dagger tang, I wouldn't have to use it... Ah, another thing to save for. :P

ss1986v2, I like the idea about the two alternative lead and off hands. I'll definately give them a go.

Also, I'll see what I can do about 13 CS... I really don't want to use any better runes than minor. (I currently have a minor of critical strikes on me.) However, I'll see if pulling some points out of dagger mastery wil harm the build at all.

Zicmu · Feb 20, 2007, 12:15 PM // 12:15

Got same build almost :P..

I got unsuspecting strike as lead instead

Heart of Shadow is switched with death charge

rebirth is resurect instead

..

i like this alot cuz blossom morbieus combo :d

i use this for AB farming

Takuna · Feb 21, 2007, 10:29 AM // 10:29

So, it does work with PvP, sort of? Hm, I've tried that Leaping Mantis Sting with Jungle Strike and I must say, it is very good. The only problem is that the PvE enemies die so quickly. Funnily enough, my heros and henchmen want to attack the exact same target as me, all the time...

RebelHero · Feb 21, 2007, 10:51 AM // 10:51

I'd say... almost, bu not quite there yet. Assassins get mauled most of the time in PvE. Seeing your only defense is shadow refuge and heart of shadow, I'd say there isnt much of a survival chance when several enemies target you, which is what you'd want with DB. With higher CS and Critical defenses, you'd have more of a chance to survive against enemies, and enough time to get a fe DBs off.

Yanman.be · Feb 21, 2007, 10:53 AM // 10:53

Leaping mantis->exhausting->moebius->db->impale->moebius->db->etc.

*edit*
OR

Leaping mantis->exhausting->impale->moebius->db->moebius->db->etc.

The5thSeraph · Feb 21, 2007, 11:42 AM // 11:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kiba of hidden leaf

You should porbably run Assassin's Promise because it allows you to use stronger attack skills like black lotus and black spider strike, while also recharging all your skills. Not just your attack skills.

Oddly enough though, Jagged Strike => Wild Strike => Death Blossom => Impale is an absolutely ideal combo to run with Assassin's Promise... especially with a full AI party...
Blacklining is all well and good, but either the enemy dies before you even finish the combo.... or else you finish the combo, find the enemy isn't dead and are still waiting for the start to recharge. Plus without some additional hex, the blackline fails entirely if one enemy dies too slowly or the hex is removed.
I run into quite a few enemies who will interrupt Assassin's Promise, remove the hex or simply tank for too long. Since the combo shown (except for the Impale) is very fast on the recharge and low cost, it can be spammed repeatedly with minimal difficulty.
In that case, the AP is mostly for the energy (and replenishment of support skills like Feigned Neutrality).

Basically... having toyed with various Critical Strikes builds, I've left one on Zenmai and gone with a Deadly Arts heavy build with Assassin's Promise and the cheap combo myself. Its far more intuitive and practical for me in PvE than any other pure Assassin build I've tried so far...

[Technically not true on the pure part, since I also take Mantra of Flame much of the time to capitalise on the Greater Conflagration that gets dropped everywhere.]

elektra_lucia · Feb 21, 2007, 03:42 PM // 15:42

Quote:

Need comments on a build.

As you've said it's just for PVE so...

Quote:

Shadow Refuge
Heart of Shadow
Rebirth

Those skills arn't needed.

I suggest you have more attack skills.

ss1986v2 · Feb 21, 2007, 04:26 PM // 16:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by elektra_lucia

Those skills arn't needed. This whole self heal deal in PVE is silly.

I suggest you have more attack skills.

i agree with you to a point about the self heal in pve. usually the fire is spread enough that a good monk or a hero monk with a quality build can support you through some of game without you being a drain on their energy. but the assassin is the weakest of all frontline characters, being basicly a semi-buffed caster. you will need some kind of defense/retreat/healing skill if you plan on being much more than minion fodder or having the monk just camp on your health bar through the whole fight. think of it this way: when was the last time you saw a derv without some kind of survivability skill(s) on their bar? why should the sin be any different?

as for more attack skills, that kinda defeat usefulness of the chain (*edit* although i do like Yanman's chains from above, just think they seem better suited on targets that wont drop so fast like pve enemies do):

lead --> off-hand --> DB --> moebius --> DB --> moebius --> ect...

more attack skills would be a waste because you would never use them. the only skill that i could think of being useful would be TF, only because is matches well with the recharge effect of moebius and because deep wound can be useful for taking down bosses/higher level enemies.

elektra_lucia · Feb 21, 2007, 04:30 PM // 16:30

I don't mean more attacks in the same chain, maybe a different leading attack for example. Wild blow is quite nice in some PVE areas too.

pingu666 · Feb 21, 2007, 06:10 PM // 18:10

moebis strike is a lategame cap

, if you had a good run theres only 40mins~ of mission time left.

flashing blades is probably the best early elite

Yanman.be · Feb 21, 2007, 07:49 PM // 19:49

Pingu....http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/The_Ete...8Explorable%29 gogogo

Takuna · Feb 21, 2007, 11:04 PM // 23:04

The trouble is, I'm not such a great player, right now. I actually take a pounding from elementalist bosses and the like and I've never so much as gone near an elite mission. However, I will take note of this advice and add what I can now and perhaps more later, when I'm better.

This build doesn't just have to be good for PvE, though. The fact is, I'm used to it, so if I had a PvP build that was similar and yet still effective, that would be ideal.

Laenavesse · Feb 22, 2007, 05:05 AM // 05:05

oddly enough, that's almost like the build I run in PvE for middle range areas (bulk of any campaign xD). I used Unsuspecting as my lead though. I think I also have Twisting fangs as another dual attack. then something else. I can't remember XD

But yeah DB spamming is fun :3

i use the hex --> BSS/BLS --> TF --> DB --> MB --> DB for harder areas where it takes them longer to die so I can at least whack at them longer. But I've already posted that build up so I'm not gonna delve more into it :O

otherwise, looks fine for PvE. I don't think you need more attack skills until you get into harder areas like Realm of Torment or Ring of Fire. Factions doesn't really have a "hard" area..i rate it all as medium >.>; ..Well okay the Shirokens can be annoying but still not as hard as the other two mentioned. And that's only one place. The AI will kill 'em faster _._;