Curse

Valour · Feb 20, 2007, 10:23 PM // 22:23

I was in RA today with my Rt using Weapon of Remedy and Vengeful weapon. Eventually I came against a mesmer using illusionary weapon, however when I was using WoR/VW, it did nothing. The skill says "the next time target ally takes DAMAGE", and regardless that illusionary weapon does not cause melee dmg, it's still dmg. I am in the wrong or should this be fixed?

Jetdoc · Feb 20, 2007, 10:29 PM // 22:29

It should work...this may be a bug.

Trylo · Feb 21, 2007, 12:14 AM // 00:14

try testing it with someone using vampiric gaze and see if it goes off... because then i could see how it makes sense because it is armor ignoring damage... it probably sets off the same as RoF and prot spirit

anet is notorious for writing poorly and confusing people... savannah heat deals damage... (missed the fire part ;D)

$hade. · Feb 21, 2007, 02:22 AM // 02:22

I think this had been discussed before but I don't remember lol.

I'm pretty sure it's a bug.

Jetdoc · Feb 21, 2007, 03:16 AM // 03:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trylo

try testing it with someone using vampiric gaze and see if it goes off...

Life stealing isn't damage, so this test won't work.

Trylo · Feb 21, 2007, 03:34 AM // 03:34

so apparently all those times b-spikes have ownd HA was just them not doing damage...

illusionary weaponry isnt damage then, either, it goes through the same things as your 'no damage' attacks there

LightningHell · Feb 21, 2007, 03:52 AM // 03:52

Illusionary Weaponry deals damage. It's just that Life Stealing doesn't count as damage, hence Vampiric Gaze, Touch, etc, won't work.

Kyuuba · Feb 24, 2007, 05:11 AM // 05:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trylo

so apparently all those times b-spikes have ownd HA was just them not doing damage...

illusionary weaponry isnt damage then, either, it goes through the same things as your 'no damage' attacks there

yes... b-spike does damage but it also does life steal. but its mainly life steal which is why it was effective.

illusionary weapon is damage because if you read the description it says "target foe takes x damage"
[wiki]Illusionary Weaponry[/wiki]
where was something like vampiric gaze says "you steal x life from target foe"
[wiki]Vampiric Gaze[/wiki]
[wiki]Life_stealing[/wiki]

Patrick Smit · Feb 24, 2007, 02:56 PM // 14:56

It might be due the mechanics of IW. its the "enchantment" that does damage, not the mesmer, so therefore u cannot steal the life from the enchantment. Technically the mesmer misses its attack and deals no attack damage, instead the enchant causes the target to "believe" its being damaged. I thinbk its not bugged, but its the poorly described mechanic of IW that makes it seems acting out of line.

Why_Me · Feb 24, 2007, 04:42 PM // 16:42

Its the same with [skill]Reversal of Damage[/skill]. The bug with IW is that the damage isn't classified as coming from the mesmer. In other words, the damage is bugged to have no source. And since WoR needs a source to steal from, and it can't figure out that the damage from IW is actually coming from the bugged IW, it doesn't do anything.

Terra Xin · Feb 26, 2007, 12:18 PM // 12:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Smit

It might be due the mechanics of IW. its the "enchantment" that does damage, not the mesmer, so therefore u cannot steal the life from the enchantment. Technically the mesmer misses its attack and deals no attack damage, instead the enchant causes the target to "believe" its being damaged. I thinbk its not bugged, but its the poorly described mechanic of IW that makes it seems acting out of line.

I thought I had already mentioned this in this thread, and it wasn't until I realised that my post wasn't there... Maybe I forgot to make it :S?

Anyway, I agree with the poster quoted. Because it is IW that deals the damage, then WoR will not attack the caster. Therefore, due to the fact that WoR cannot attack an enchantment, nothing happens. IW is rather special, because the only thing that the enchanted person is doing, is providing the requirements in order for the enchantment to deal the damage - that is, by attacking. It is also important to understand that IW removes the properties of hit/miss from the attacking process, so the Enchanted person cannot trigger the spell with a physical hit either. The process is rather in-depth, so it may be a little difficult to understand.

Now if you compare this with Fire Storm, WoR will trigger at each pulse. This is because Spells have different properties than Enchantments. (again, this can get confusing) When a AoE spell such as this is cast, then the damage that will result from firestorm and other such spells cannot be influenced and has been pre-determined - meaning that no matter what happens, once the spell is cast, then for that entire 10 seconds, a certain amount of damage will be dealt, which is spread across that time - whether or not the target stands in the AoE effect for the whole duration is irrelevant - damage will still be involved.

Enchantments that are similar to IW's effect are different, because the amount of damage that can be dealt over a period of time can be influenced by other effects (For IW, a target can attack/not attack, or have the enchantment removed). If it is the player's role to fulfil the requirements to make the enchantment trigger, then it is the enchantment that does the triggering - the player just influences or fulfills the requirements.

Now then, if you look at it from that perspective, then Enchantments such as Reversal of Damage, Retribution and Holy Wrath will not trigger WoR's effect, because the damage is indirectly dealt. Inclusive, WoR will not trigger WoR on an enemy target :P.

It's not a bug, but I hope this information helps^^.

(Psst. IW does not cause attacks to 'miss'. The entire mechanic of Hit/Miss is removed altogether with IW. If you still believe that IW causes attacks to miss, then test yourself under the effects of Price of Failure. I can go in further detail, but my post is a little long^^)